"Once Saved, Always Saved"

[Cutter]

Then how were the old testament believers saved? Just asking, always curious about that. As far as I understand they were saved because they believed that their Saviour would come, they had faith that he would do his work.

No one received salvation in the present tense until the work of salvation was completed on the cross. The OT saints had hope and faith in the Messiah, but that's all. They died in their faith and their faith was rewarded in that Christ did come and redeem them after His Blood sacrifice was complete. If the Blood of Jesus is what saves someone, how can they be saved before the Blood of Jesus was shed?
Hebrews 11:13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of [them], and embraced [them], and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

I think we are on the same page, I just needed to clarify my position. Hope this helps.

 

[Ed Edwards]

Matt 24:13
13 "But the one who endures to the end, he shall be saved. (NASB)

Amen, Brother Matthew -- Preach it! :thumbs:

Matthew 24:13 (KJV1873):

But he that shall endure unto
the end, the same shall be saved.

This statement is true:
IF he endures to the end;
THEN he shall be saved.

Logic Dictates that this statement is
also correct because the first one was:

If he is not saved;
Then He did not endure to the end.

There are two statements that come from
this that are independend of the first
statement (I didn't say they were true or
false); I leave it up to the reader to
prove one of them true from the Bible.
If one is true, both are true [by the rules
of Logic] ):

IF he endures NOT to the end;
THEN he shall NOT be saved.

IF he is saved;
THEN he endures to the end.
​

Matthew 24:13 does NOT support the
truth of these last two propositions.
Some people think it does, but they
are wrong.

-------------------------------
An example where the second set of propositions
are not true, even though the original set
of propositions is true.

First set of propositions (True)
If you smoke; then you will die prematurly.
If you die NOT prematurely; then you
then you did NOT smoke.

Second set of propositions (False)

If you do not smoke; then you will not die prematurely
[it is false, you could die from a fall while
cleaning your gutters]

If you die prematurely; then you smoked.
[perchane you die prematurely cause
you got lung cancer from polution]
-------------------------------

 

[RevScott]

Seems to me that OSAS is a rather-odd doctrine, in light of, for example, these words from Jesus--


Luke 9:23-24 NRSV
23 Then he said to them all, “If any want to become my followers, let them deny themselves and take up their cross daily and follow me.24 For those who want to save their life will lose it, and those who lose their life for my sake will save it.

We cannot save ourselves. But by His grace, we can 'endure to the end' and be saved. It seems to me that OSAS is a false doctrine.

 

[Ed Edwards]

Seems to me that OSAS is a rather-odd doctrine, in light of, for example, these words from Jesus--


Luke 9:23-24 NRSV
23 Then he said to them all, “If any want to become my followers, let them deny themselves and take up their cross daily and follow me.24 For those who want to save their life will lose it, and those who lose their life for my sake will save it.

We cannot save ourselves. But by His grace, we can 'endure to the end' and be saved. It seems to me that OSAS is a false doctrine.

Welcome aboard BB Brother RevScott.

Amen on 'we cannot save ourselves'. When is 'the end' that we are supposed to 'endure to' by His grace?

 

[Trotter]

It may "seem" like a false doctrine, but only if you take things out of context to try to disprove it.

Jesus was conveying the cost of following Him, not the actual circumstances. "Taking up our cross" is dying to self, which we should do every day. Each and every follower of Christ is called to do this. We "lose our life" by living beyond just our own selves, but for and through Him. That is Basic Christianity 101.

If a man can be lost after he has been saved, then Christ's work on the cross was not finished, His blood is not a full atonement, and both He and God the Father are liars.

Consider some of Jesus' other words, such as "eternal life." Last time I looked, eternal is continuous, not start and stop, start and stop, or start and end. Eternal is eternal, pure and simple.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

It may "seem" like a false doctrine, but only if you take things out of context to try to disprove it.

Jesus was conveying the cost of following Him, not the actual circumstances. "Taking up our cross" is dying to self, which we should do every day. Each and every follower of Christ is called to do this. We "lose our life" by living beyond just our own selves, but for and through Him. That is Basic Christianity 101.

If a man can be lost after he has been saved, then Christ's work on the cross was not finished, His blood is not a full atonement, and both He and God the Father are liars.

Consider some of Jesus' other words, such as "eternal life." Last time I looked, eternal is continuous, not start and stop, start and stop, or start and end. Eternal is eternal, pure and simple.

Amen and Amen!

 

[Pastor_Bob]

After 25 pages, it's time to put this one to rest. :sleeping_2: