One baptism?

[Dave...]

My reply to Alan Dale Gross,

who said:

"There is one baptism, meaning of course, that there is one "kind" of Spirit, etc.,

in Ephesians 4:4 There is one "kind of" body, and one "kind of" Spirit,
even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 One Lord, one "kind of" faith, one "kind of" baptism,
6 One God and Father of all, Who is above all, and through all, and in you all."

You know that there is not just "one baptism" that has ever taken place on earth,
so the meaning is that there is one "kind of" baptism.

Water baptism is the only Biblical interpretation for expressing what "one baptism" means.

It means water baptism, which is a very important church ordinance God Ordained along with the Lord's Supper".

There is not a second "baptism" misunderstood in whatever way.

"Water baptism" + "Spirit baptism" =2 kinds of baptism.

Do the math.

You had made up another baptism that is only assumed.

The test is where someone is able to "not assume the Spirit baptizes".

If you don't assume it as a concoction of your imagination,
THEN TRY TO FIND IT ANYWHERE THAT CLEARLY "TEACHES" WHAT YOU ARE GUESSING ABOUT, and you know it.

Do those verses actually say in words what you believe or are you just assuming that it is there.

I tell you what, if you don't assume "SPIRIT BAPTISM", IT'S NOT IN THERE.

And you can't MAKE THE BIBLE CONTRADICT ITSELF WHERE IT SAYS, "ONE" BAPTISM.

Peter mentions two baptisms here. The one that doesn't save, water, and the one that does, Spirit, is strongly implied.

1 Peter 3:21 There is also an antitype which now saves us--baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

1 Corinthians 12:12-13 For as the body is one and has many members, but all the members of that one body, being many, are one body, so also is Christ. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body--whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free--and have all been made to drink into one Spirit.

The body, is Jesus, the Church. The vehicle for that Spiritual union, the Holy spirit, was not given until Jesus was glorified.

How do we get access to that resurrection that Peter spoke of in 3:21?

What does the Bible teach us about the spiritual mechanics of being born again?

What happens spiritually that makes us born again? I'll give my thoughts on this matter and we'll go from there. Just for the record, if I'm speaking of baptism, it's the spiritual baptism that I'm speaking of unless otherwise noted. I'll tell you if I mean water baptism. When we are placed...

www.baptistboard.com

Dale Alan Gross said:

"Unless otherwise specified, the word baptism in the New Testament always refers to a dipping or immersion in water,
never to a mere sprinkling or pouring. Despite the general agreement of scholars on this fact,
however, a large part of Christendom prefers convenience to obedience and no longer practices baptism in water as a religious ordinance.

I disagree. Context usually reveals what is being spoken of, however, if it's unclear, and you fealt like you had to assume, then It would be wise to assume Spirit baptism, not water.

I baptized my French fries with ketchup. Are they saved?

No, I ate them. ;) But on a more serious note. The word 'baptize' in Scripture means to place into, to immerse into, and to dip into. The word baptize describes an action. The agent of baptism, or the baptizer, are not part of the definition of that word. A common mistake that people make is to...

www.baptistboard.com

Dale Alan Gross said:

"and in recent years some sly seducers have confused it with an imaginary "spiritual baptism"
which they say puts every believer into their nonexistent invisible "church."

It's a spiritual baptism, thus, invisible. (John 3:1-14). The invisible church, that's Jesus, He's the Church. It's a spiritual body.

1 Corinthians 12:12-13 For as the body is one and has many members, but all the members of that one body, being many, are one body, so also is Christ. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body--whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free--and have all been made to drink into one Spirit.

Romans 12:4-5 For as we have many members in one body, but all the members do not have the same function, so we, being many, are one body in Christ, and individually members of one another. Also see 1 cor. 12:12-27,

Eph 1:22-23 And He put all things under His feet, and gave Him to be head over all things to the church, which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.

Col. 1:18 And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence.

 

[JonC]

@Dave...

I do not see the two baptisms you are speaking of.

I am looking at 1 Peter 3:21

The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ

"The like figure" (corresponding to what was said in the previous verses) - baptism now saves you—not the removal of dirt, but an appeal to God for a good conscience—through the resurrection of Jesus Christ

Baptisms of the past were symbols of what was to come. These washing were to purify the flesh but did nothing to purify the conscience).

In Scripture there were many baptisms. There were baptisms as purity rituals (under the Law), there was John's baptism of repentance (making ready for the Word). But Christians are baptized into Christ.

We have one Baptism.

I am just not sure what you are asking.

 

[Dave...]

@Dave...

I do not see the two baptisms you are speaking of.

I am looking at 1 Peter 3:21

The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ

"The like figure" (corresponding to what was said in the previous verses) - baptism now saves you—not the removal of dirt, but an appeal to God for a good conscience—through the resurrection of Jesus Christ

Baptisms of the past were symbols of what was to come. These washing were to purify the flesh but did nothing to purify the conscience).

In Scripture there were many baptisms. There were baptisms as purity rituals (under the Law), there was John's baptism of repentance (making ready for the Word). But Christians are baptized into Christ.

We have one Baptism.

I am just not sure what you are asking.

Hey Jon, thanks for the reply.

For the record, Alans claim was that there is only one baptism in Scripture, therefore, he reasoned, that everywhere in Scripture that uses the word baptism must be speaking of water baptism. He said that the Spirit baptism was made up and wasn't in Scripture. I couldn't let that go unanswered, but the thread got closed before I could reply. I'm not complaining, I think that thread ran it's course, but I didn't want to leave that post unanswered.

Anyways, back to your question.

An anti type is something that is represented by a symbol, or a "type".

1 Peter 3:21: For there to be a antitype (that saves), there must also be a type (that points). We all know that types point to spiritual truths, but have no power in and of themselves. The "type" in that passage by Peter is clearly water baptism, thus the definition " (not the removal of the filth of the flesh...". The rest of that sentence "..."but the answer of a good conscience toward God)" is faith. A baptism by faith is what saves us.

Noah's ark is also a type of Jesus.

When we are placed into Christ by faith, "in Christ", our Ark, we are protected from God's judgment. You can see the picture being painted by Peter by using this illustration of the ark and Noah. It would be a very poor illustration of water baptism, but it's a perfect illustration of Spirit Baptism. When we receive the indwelling as a result of faith, and become one with Jesus spiritually, that immersion with Jesus, becoming one with Him, that placing into, becoming "in Christ", gives us access to the resurrection, which saves us both positionally (justification) and practically (born again).

So anyways, water baptism is a type, but it is a baptism. I'm sure that you would agree that the baptism spoken about in Ephesians, the one true baptism, is the "antitype" spoken of by Peter that actually does save, which is contrasted by Peter. the baptism by faith that unites us with Christ Jesus.

The baptism, the resurrection...

This is the saved part.

1 Cor. 12:13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body--whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free--and have all been made to drink into one Spirit.

Ephesians 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

A spirit baptism by faith...

Gal. 3:22, 26-27 But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe....For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Now, as a result of being "placed into" Christ Jesus by faith and receiving the indwelling, the baptism with the Holy Spirit, we have access to the resurrection, for both justification and to be born again. Thus we are saved through the resurrection per 1 Peter 3:21.

Colossians 2:11-14 *In Him* you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.

Romans 6:3-11 Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. For he who has died has been freed from sin. Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him. For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord.


1 Peter 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant mercy has begotten us again (born again) to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, (Also see Ephesians 2:1-6 "and raised us up together" gives us life.)

Do you see the picture that Peter was painting, or do we see it differently?

For the point of the thread, there's more than one baptism in Scripture. I think the point of Ephesians 4 was that there is only one true baptism, meaning only one baptism that has power to save. That immersion, or placing into, is a spiritual one that results from receiving the Holy Spirit indwelling, the placing into with the Holy Spirit, which is a spiritual immersion by faith. Do you agree with that?

Dave

Dave

 

[JesusFan]

Hey Jon, thanks for the reply.

For the record, Alans claim was that there is only one baptism in Scripture, therefore, he reasoned, that everywhere in Scripture that uses the word baptism must be speaking of water baptism. He said that the Spirit baptism was made up and wasn't in Scripture. I couldn't let that go unanswered, but the thread got closed before I could reply. I'm not complaining, I think that thread ran it's course, but I didn't want to leave that post unanswered.

Anyways, back to your question.

An anti type is something that is represented by a symbol, or a "type".

1 Peter 3:21: For there to be a antitype (that saves), there must also be a type (that points). We all know that types point to spiritual truths, but have no power in and of themselves. The "type" in that passage by Peter is clearly water baptism, thus the definition " (not the removal of the filth of the flesh...". The rest of that sentence "..."but the answer of a good conscience toward God)" is faith. A baptism by faith is what saves us.

Noah's ark is also a type of Jesus.

When we are placed into Christ by faith, "in Christ", our Ark, we are protected from God's judgment. You can see the picture being painted by Peter by using this illustration of the ark and Noah. It would be a very poor illustration of water baptism, but it's a perfect illustration of Spirit Baptism. When we receive the indwelling as a result of faith, and become one with Jesus spiritually, that immersion with Jesus, becoming one with Him, that placing into, becoming "in Christ", gives us access to the resurrection, which saves us both positionally (justification) and practically (born again).

So anyways, water baptism is a type, but it is a baptism. I'm sure that you would agree that the baptism spoken about in Ephesians, the one true baptism, is the "antitype" spoken of by Peter that actually does save, which is contrasted by Peter. the baptism by faith that unites us with Christ Jesus.

The baptism, the resurrection...

This is the saved part.

1 Cor. 12:13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body--whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free--and have all been made to drink into one Spirit.

Ephesians 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

A spirit baptism by faith...

Gal. 3:22, 26-27 But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe....For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Now, as a result of being "placed into" Christ Jesus by faith and receiving the indwelling, the baptism with the Holy Spirit, we have access to the resurrection, for both justification and to be born again. Thus we are saved through the resurrection per 1 Peter 3:21.

Colossians 2:11-14 *In Him* you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.

Romans 6:3-11 Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. For he who has died has been freed from sin. Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him. For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord.


1 Peter 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant mercy has begotten us again (born again) to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, (Also see Ephesians 2:1-6 "and raised us up together" gives us life.)

Do you see the picture that Peter was painting, or do we see it differently?

For the point of the thread, there's more than one baptism in Scripture. I think the point of Ephesians 4 was that there is only one true baptism, meaning only one baptism that has power to save. That immersion, or placing into, is a spiritual one that results from receiving the Holy Spirit indwelling, the placing into with the Holy Spirit, which is a spiritual immersion by faith. Do you agree with that?

Dave

Dave

Many have had water baptism, and still remained lost in their sins, but ALL who experence spiritual Baptism into Christ by the Holy Spirit are saved

 

[JonC]

Hey Jon, thanks for the reply.

For the record, Alans claim was that there is only one baptism in Scripture, therefore, he reasoned, that everywhere in Scripture that uses the word baptism must be speaking of water baptism. He said that the Spirit baptism was made up and wasn't in Scripture. I couldn't let that go unanswered, but the thread got closed before I could reply. I'm not complaining, I think that thread ran it's course, but I didn't want to leave that post unanswered.

Anyways, back to your question.

An anti type is something that is represented by a symbol, or a "type".

1 Peter 3:21: For there to be a antitype (that saves), there must also be a type (that points). We all know that types point to spiritual truths, but have no power in and of themselves. The "type" in that passage by Peter is clearly water baptism, thus the definition " (not the removal of the filth of the flesh...". The rest of that sentence "..."but the answer of a good conscience toward God)" is faith. A baptism by faith is what saves us.

Noah's ark is also a type of Jesus.

When we are placed into Christ by faith, "in Christ", our Ark, we are protected from God's judgment. You can see the picture being painted by Peter by using this illustration of the ark and Noah. It would be a very poor illustration of water baptism, but it's a perfect illustration of Spirit Baptism. When we receive the indwelling as a result of faith, and become one with Jesus spiritually, that immersion with Jesus, becoming one with Him, that placing into, becoming "in Christ", gives us access to the resurrection, which saves us both positionally (justification) and practically (born again).

So anyways, water baptism is a type, but it is a baptism. I'm sure that you would agree that the baptism spoken about in Ephesians, the one true baptism, is the "antitype" spoken of by Peter that actually does save, which is contrasted by Peter. the baptism by faith that unites us with Christ Jesus.

The baptism, the resurrection...

This is the saved part.

1 Cor. 12:13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body--whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free--and have all been made to drink into one Spirit.

Ephesians 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

A spirit baptism by faith...

Gal. 3:22, 26-27 But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe....For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Now, as a result of being "placed into" Christ Jesus by faith and receiving the indwelling, the baptism with the Holy Spirit, we have access to the resurrection, for both justification and to be born again. Thus we are saved through the resurrection per 1 Peter 3:21.

Colossians 2:11-14 *In Him* you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.

Romans 6:3-11 Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. For he who has died has been freed from sin. Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him. For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord.


1 Peter 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant mercy has begotten us again (born again) to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, (Also see Ephesians 2:1-6 "and raised us up together" gives us life.)

Do you see the picture that Peter was painting, or do we see it differently?

For the point of the thread, there's more than one baptism in Scripture. I think the point of Ephesians 4 was that there is only one true baptism, meaning only one baptism that has power to save. That immersion, or placing into, is a spiritual one that results from receiving the Holy Spirit indwelling, the placing into with the Holy Spirit, which is a spiritual immersion by faith. Do you agree with that?

Dave

Dave

Thanks Dave.

I didn't read the other thread and was a bit lost in the sauce.

Yes, I agree.

 

[Dave G]

Giving my thoughts on this, subject to change as the Lord gives me more understanding on the matters at hand:

" I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called,
2 with all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;
3 endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
4 [There is] one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6 one God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all.
7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ." ( Ephesians 4:1-7 )

Notwithstanding that there is more here that Paul is telling us than the points I'm taking from the above, for the purposes of addressing the subject of this thread I will try and limit my comments.

1) One body, as I understand all of the Scriptures giving us in the details, is the spiritual body of Christ.
That means every one of God's elect that Christ went to the cross for, suffered and died for and rose again for, He now makes intercession for at the right hand of God the Father.
This began with Abel, continued on with men like Enoch and Noah, and continues to this day with the Lord adding to "the Church" such as should be saved ( Acts 2:44-47 ).
They are all His sheep and are, in the eternal sense, the body of Christ ( "Other sheep I have...", John 10:16 ).

Whether or not they currently have believed on His Son or will at a later time in history, whether or not they are currently joined together by that same Spirit or will be sometime in the future, from our perspective as men, is irrelevant .

At any one point in time, that spiritual body of all Spirit-indwelt believers is termed to be the body of Christ and "the Church", and that same "Church" is broken up into local "bodies" who all share the same doctrine and practices, because they are all joined in the Spirit of truth and by the same Teacher, who leads them into all truth.

There are no "denominations" in the true body of Christ.

There is only "the Church" which is now in Heaven with the Lord, waiting to return with Him at His coming, and there is the "Church" which is now on earth...divided by distance, but united in Spirit.

These are both and all "one body".

 

[Dave G]

2) One Spirit means the Holy Spirit which indwells all born again believers... joining them together in that one earthly and Heavenly body, while at the same time joining together each individual in the local body.

Since all of God's children will come to repentance ( 2 Peter 3:8-9 ), then the Spirit will be given to each member of the elect body at some point in their earthly lifetimes...
They will be preached the word of God to ( Romans 10 ), they will come to Christ in both true faith and repentance, and they will be baptized, spiritually, by that one Spirit into the one body.

This same Spirit not only joins them, but causes them to do the will of God ( Philippians 2:13 ), comforts them through all their trials, and mortifies the deeds of the body ( Romans 8 ).

3) One hope means, that the hope that they all share is the hope that all of God's elect find in Christ Jesus...their Saviour and Deliverer from all their troubles in this world, and who has saved them from the wrath that is to come (The Lake of Fire ) upon all those not in the body of Christ.
He is their Hope.

4) One Lord means just that...He is Lord of all, and not only do they know Him and follow Him ( John 10 ), they are known by Him and loved by Him.
That He is Lord of all they freely and without reservation acknowledge, but also take comfort in and boldly proclaim through the power of the one Spirit within them.

5) One faith means the single body of truth, in its entirety, that has been revealed in His every word ( Matthew 4:4, Luke 4:4 ) and that they all recognize and understand.
This is that same "faith" that they are commanded to contend for ( Jude 1:3 ), that Moses and the prophets declared to Israel, and that the Lord Jesus Christ Himself declared when He was here the first time ( and then did so through His apostles later ) to the churches after Pentecost...

When they were empowered by that one Spirit to do the will of God.

 

[Dave G]

6) One baptism refers to both the baptism of the Spirit ( when one of God's elect is first made a partaker of Christ by the Spirit after believing, see Ephesians 1 ) and the baptism by water that they all observe as symbolizing what has been done for them by God their Father through Jesus Christ.

The representation of that one spiritual baptism is physical immersion in water...
Which is nothing more than a symbolic representation of a spiritual cleansing through the blood of Christ that took place on the cross for all of God's people.
It is emphasized to them in the accounts of Naaman the Syrian, who was cleansed of his leprosy in the waters of the Jordan River, in the baptism of repentance that John the Baptist performed in his day and that the Lord's disciples performed on those that followed Him when He was first here, and in the account of the Ethiopian eunuch in Acts 8.

In addition,
All instances of water baptism that follow belief of the Gospel in the Scriptures, I see are symbolic of this being baptized into the already-existing body of Christ by one Spirit.

Baptism by water does not save, does not cleanse of sins and does not make a person born again.
It serves purely as a picture of what God has done for the one body through the sacrifice and suffering of His only begotten Son.
At the same time, baptism by the Spirit does not save and does not cleanse of sins, neither does it make a person born again...
It is only done for those for whom Christ died and rose again for, and who have been cleansed of all their sins through His blood at the cross.

While the baptism of the Spirit closely follows ( or is associated with ) the internal making alive of a person's spirit ( some call it "nature" ) by the power of God, it is not the same thing.

In other words, I see the Scriptures teaching that the power of God, by His Spirit, is what makes a person alive ( born again ), and His indwelling them ( their being baptized by the Spirit ) acts as a "sealing" unto the day of their bodily redemption and gives them the spiritual power to overcome the world, the flesh and the devil.

All of God's elect have now been made partakers of this baptism...
Whether before or after Pentecost, whether before or after the Old Testament, makes no difference.


The "wall of partition" that was between the Jewish believers ( and those like Enoch, Noah and Abel who were not of the physical "seed" of Abraham ) and the Gentile believers has been broken down and they are all made one in Spirit and in truth.

 

[Dave G]

@Dave...

Apologies to the OP for my lengthy reply regarding this passage, but I felt it necessary to include my thoughts on all the "ones" that we see above.
The reason for this is that I see them as being all inter-related and tying each other together.
To me, what is true for "one body" is true for "one baptism"...
What is true for "one hope" is true for "one faith", "one Spirit", etc.

As I see it, they are all interdependent upon one another and apply to the same group of people...
God's elect and only God's elect.

However, in the process of answering your thread its seems as if I have contributed to subjects not being strictly pertinent to the thread, please refer to post # 8 ( this information can be found in the top right corner of each post ) that I feel does indeed answer the subject of "one baptism".
Also, to clarify one detail regarding baptism that I expressed in the above post:

"All of God's elect have now been made partakers of this baptism."
What I meant to convey by that statement is this:

I currently am convinced that all who are Christ's sheep and God's elect have now ( post-Pentecost ) been made partakers of the unity of the Spirit;
Both on earth and in Heaven.
This is that same Spirit that worked in and through the Old Testament saints and prophets, and inspired them to write the Scriptures... as well as to perform many works and miracles in His name.

What the saints of old did not know in the details ( not ever having seen these truths clearly and many of which were hidden from them when they walked the earth ), they have now learned of.
The same truths which unify the true body on earth now, unifies the body which is in Heaven now.


May God bless you.

 

[Dave...]

6) One baptism refers to both the baptism of the Spirit ( when one of God's elect is first made a partaker of Christ by the Spirit after believing, see Ephesians 1 ) and the baptism by water that they all observe as symbolizing what has been done for them by God their Father through Jesus Christ.

Hey Dave, thanks for the thoughtful replies.

Just to clarify, I'll elaborate on something just in case we are not completely on the same page.

The best way to understand the baptism with the Holy Spirit, as I see it, is to use modern English. For what ever reason, like the word 'tongues' for 'languages', we hold onto some of that old English, even in the newer translations. It's not that the Holy Spirit is being placed into us by Jesus as a result of faith, though He is, it more that we are placed into Christ by that spiritual union, that indwelling. This is what the Baptism with the Holy Spirit means literally, it should read 'the placing into (Christ) with the Holy Spirit (indwelling). That's what the baptism with the Holy Spirit is. Every believer experiences this when they come to our Lord Jesus with a genuine faith. This is Jesus, placing Himself in us, by way of the Holy Spirit, called the Spirit of Christ making us one with Him, as He is one with the Father.

Water baptism pictures the results of that spiritual union, identifying us with Jesus' death and resurrection, and benefits of that spiritual union. In a way, water baptism points back to Spirit Baptism. It's kind of cool considering that we are water baptized after we are placed into Christ by receiving that indwelling.

There was a time, before believers could be indwelt in the Old Testament, before the cross, that the baptism with the Holy Spirit had to wait and was designated a certain time after the death resurrection and ascension of Jesus. This was so that the benefits of that spiritual union could be received as a result of that spiritual union. But mainly, we being Temples of the Holy Spirit, needed the blood of Christ from that spiritual union to cleanse the Temple, that's us. that's why OT believers were not indwelt.

Dave

 

[Dave G]

It's not that the Holy Spirit is being placed into us by Jesus as a result of faith, though He is, it more that we are placed into Christ by that spiritual union, that indwelling.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that Dave, as I see that faith is not what places us into Christ...
The Spirit does, and it's because a person is one of God's elect.

That we as believers have faith, and that God sees fit to credit that faith to us as righteousness, is not the same to me as declaring that it is our faith that God looks upon and decides, on that basis, who to save.

This is what the Baptism with the Holy Spirit means literally, it should read 'the placing into (Christ) with the Holy Spirit (indwelling). That's what the baptism with the Holy Spirit is.

What it "should read" and what it does read seems to be a matter of opinion between us, Dave.
What I see when I read it is what I have expressed...
If you wish to physically change it, I don't recommend that.

Personally, I'll not mess with God's words, as that carries a very heavy penalty.

 

[Dave G]

Every believer experiences this when they come to our Lord Jesus with a genuine faith. This is Jesus, placing Himself in us, by way of the Holy Spirit, called the Spirit of Christ making us one with Him, as He is one with the Father.

I agree, to an extent, with most of what you've written here.
However, I think you know where I stand with respect to election, predestination and so forth.

Water baptism pictures the results of that spiritual union, identifying us with Jesus' death and resurrection, and benefits of that spiritual union. In a way, water baptism points back to Spirit Baptism. It's kind of cool considering that we are water baptized after we are placed into Christ by receiving that indwelling.

Agreed, with reservation.

Specifically, I don't see that believers are placed into Christ when they actively receive the Spirit, but when they passively receive Him.
To me, that is what makes it all a gift and all of grace...

Not of works, lest any man should boast.

There was a time, before believers could be indwelt in the Old Testament, before the cross, that the baptism with the Holy Spirit had to wait and was designated a certain time after the death resurrection and ascension of Jesus. This was so that the benefits of that spiritual union could be received as a result of that spiritual union. But mainly, we being Temples of the Holy Spirit, needed the blood of Christ from that spiritual union to cleanse the Temple, that's us. that's why OT believers were not indwelt.

I think you should perhaps re-visit the Scriptures a bit before you ultimately conclude that there were no Old Testament believers that were indwelt with the Holy Spirit...
I find, when I read it carefully, that there were many men who were;
Even though I also see that the Spirit was not given, whole-sale, to every one of God's people in the same way that it is now, after Pentecost.


That said, I think it's time that I concluded my involvement in this thread.
Thank you for the privilege to post replies to it, and I wish you well, sir.


May God bless you greatly.