ONLY The Originals Are Inspired

[rlvaughn]

There is also the book and audiobook, Misquoting Jesus
The Story Behind Who Changed the Bible and Why
By Professor Bart Ehrman

Daniel Wallace's review of "The Gospel According to Bart: A Review Article of Misquoting Jesus by Bart Ehrman," Journal of the Evangelical Theological Society 49/2 (June 2006) 327–49.

Ehrman's status, according to Ehrman in God’s Problem (New York: HarperCollins, 2008, pp., 2–3)

...I had solid Christian credentials and knew about the Christian faith from the inside out—in the years before I lost my faith...When I was away from home, living in Chicago, I served as the youth pastor of an Evangelical Covenant church...for a year I was pastor of the Princeton Baptist Church, preaching every Sunday morning, holding prayer groups and Bible studies, visiting the sick in the hospital, and performing the regular pastoral duties for the community

But then, for a variety of reasons that I'll mention in a moment, I started to lose my faith. I now have lost it altogether. I no longer go to church, no longer believe, no longer consider myself a Christian.

On page 3, he says "my strong commitment to the Bible began to wane the more I studied it. I began to realize that rather than being an inerrant revelation from God, inspired in its very words (the view I had at Moody Bible Institute), the Bible was a very human book with all the marks of having come from human hands: discrepancies, contradictions, errors, and different perspectives of different authors living at different times in different countries and writing for different reasons to different audiences with different needs."

While his doubts about the Bible may have laid the groundwork, to be fair Ehrman says that is not what led him to deny the faith. Ehrman writes, "the problems of the Bible are not what led me to leave the faith" but he said that his beliefs about the Bible "could not hold up...to critical scrutiny." He says it was because he came to the point that he "could not believe that there is a good and kindly disposed Ruler who is charge of" what he calls this life which is "a cesspool of misery and suffering." (God’s Problem, p., 3)

 

[Yeshua1]

Great point. Only the originals, the autographs, are inspired.

What we have today are copies of copies of copies. And the originals have been changed in the course of history.

Maybe that is why the world has graduated more and more into chaos and violence. When, according to Messiah prophecy the world was to enter into peace with his coming.

Originals have never changed, and the peace will be at His second coming.

 

[Yeshua1]

Isaiah is of the Tanakh.

The earliest of the extant NT manuscripts only date back to the middle of the 4th century. Hundreds of years after Christ and his Apostles.

It is a simple study to undertake. Begin with keywords like, history new testament tampering.

There is also the book and audiobook, Misquoting Jesus
The Story Behind Who Changed the Bible and Why
By Professor Bart Ehrman

Catholic Church admits to Forgery


The Forged Origins of the New Testament

That man is no textual critic expert, as his views do not square with recognized experts!

 

[37818]

...I had solid Christian credentials and knew about the Christian faith from the inside out—in the years before I lost my faith...

How and what did Bart Ehrman describe in believing the gospel in regards to one becoming saved when he was a professing Christian?

This is an important question.

1 John 5:10, ". . . He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: . . ."

Romans 8:16, ". . . The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: . . ."

John 17:3, ". . . And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, . . ."

And of course contexts.

 

[SGO]

Almighty God is the God of order, and He established the order or primacy [the state of being first or foremost] with the preserved Scriptures in the original languages serving as the one foundation and authority on which Bible translations would need to be based or built. Almighty God gave or laid the foundation on which Bible translations depend. The Scriptures in the original languages obviously preceded any later Bible translations. No other foundation for Bible translations can be laid than the one God Himself laid when He gave the Scriptures in the original languages by the supernatural process of inspiration to the prophets and apostles (Eph. 2:20, 2 Tim. 3:16, 2 Pet. 1:21, Eph. 3:5, 1 Cor. 2:13, Ps. 11:3, 1 Cor. 3:11).

Puritan William Whitaker wrote: “The church is said (Eph. 2:20) to be built upon the foundation of the prophets and apostles, that is, upon the prophetic and apostolic doctrine; therefore the prophetic and apostolic doctrine, that is, the whole scripture, and the approbation of the same, preceded the church” (Disputation on Holy Scripture, pp. 347-348). William Whitaker added: “The foundation of the prophets and apostles in this place actually does denote the scripture” (p. 348). William Whitaker also observed that “Ambrose says that by the foundation in this place is understood the old and new Testaments” (p. 349). Again concerning Ephesians 2:20, William Whitaker asserted: “This foundation denotes the doctrine of the scriptures, promulgated by the prophets and apostles” (p. 50). Reformer Francis Turretin noted that the word of God is “the foundation upon which we are built (Eph. 2:20)” (Institutes, I, p. 55). Francis Turretin maintained that “the church is built upon the Scripture (Eph. 2:20) and borrows all authority from it” (I, p. 88). In 1684, David Dickson wrote: “The Scriptures are the foundation, upon which the church is built (Eph. 2:20) (Truth’s Victory over Error, p. 3). Concerning this same verse, the Henry Morris Study Bible noted: “The ’foundation of the apostles and prophets,’ upon which the great house must be built, clearly refers to the Scriptures which they wrote under divine inspiration. The New Testament was given ‘by revelation‘ (3:3), ‘revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit‘ (3:5)” (p. 1809). Vishal Mangalwadi wrote: “The church was ‘built on the foundation of the apostles and the prophets,’ that is, on the New and Old Testaments” (Book that Made Your World, p. 397).

Scriptural truth concerning a foundation established by God would conflict with any human attempt to make a translation the final authority.

Does the KJV-only desire or claim to have absolute certainty and final authority in a translation while in effect dismissing or undermining the greater authority of its foundation hold up?

"Scriptural truth concerning a foundation established by God would conflict with any human attempt to make a translation the final authority. "

But that does not stop man from saying there is no inspired scripture today.

Why don't you answer the question I have asked of you twice, now thrice?

What is you word?

You say you have read the KJV for 50 years and that you are a "bible believing man" but it is obvious you do not believe in the KJV.

What about your word?

What "word" do you believe in?

All scripture is given by inspiration of God...
2 Timothy 3:16

The word of our God shall stand for ever.
Isaiah 40:8

 

[TurtleSox]

That man is no textual critic expert, as his views do not square with recognized experts!

What man are you referring to?

 

[TurtleSox]

Originals have never changed, and the peace will be at His second coming.

We can't actually say that from any place of knowledge since the originals are called autographs, and are not available to us.

 

[SGO]

We can't actually say that from any place of knowledge since the originals are called autographs, and are not available to us.

The word of our God shall stand for ever.
Isaiah 40:8

 

[TurtleSox]

The word of our God shall stand for ever.
Isaiah 40:8

What Exactly Does the Term, “Autograph of Scripture” Mean?

 

[SGO]

From a look online:

"The autographs contain the original text, but the original text can exist without them. A text can be preserved in other ways. One such way is that the original text can be preserved in a multiplicity of manuscripts."

The Difference Between Original Autographs and Original Texts.

 

[TurtleSox]

From a look online:

"The autographs contain the original text, but the original text can exist without them. A text can be preserved in other ways. One such way is that the original text can be preserved in a multiplicity of manuscripts."

The Difference Between Original Autographs and Original Texts.

GC is not credible.

(Sic)"...It was Augustine who first coined the term “inerrant,” and Luther and Calvin can speak of Scripture as free from error."
The Truthfulness of Scripture: Inerrancy - Articles

* What Is The Didache? Is It Inspired By God?

"Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you." Deuteronomy 4:2

https://d3hgrlq6yacptf.cloudfront.net/5f4766d57c3ad/content/pages/documents/1333232121.pdf

 

[rlvaughn]

How and what did Bart Ehrman describe in believing the gospel in regards to one becoming saved when he was a professing Christian?

This is from the same book:

For most of my life I was a devout and committed Christian. I was baptized in a Congregational church and reared as an Episcopalian, becoming an altar boy when I was twelve and continuing all the way through high school. Early in my high school days I started attending a Youth for Christ club and had a "born-again" experience--which, looking back, seems a bit strange: I had been involved in church, believing in Christ, praying to God, confessing my sins, and so on for years. What exactly did I need to convert from? I think I was converting from hell--I didn't want to experience eternal torment with the poor souls who had not been "saved"; I much preferred the option of heaven. In any event, when I became born again it was like ratcheting my religion up a notch. I became very serious about my faith and chose to go off to a fundamentalist Bible college--Moody Bible Institute in Chicago--where I began training for ministry. (God' Problem, p. 1)

 

[rlvaughn]

GC is not credible.

Because?

 

[TurtleSox]

Because?

It's better if you seek out the evidence yourself. Keywords like, Gospel Coalition Corrupt, will be quite informative I think.

 

[SGO]

GC is not credible.

(Sic)"...It was Augustine who first coined the term “inerrant,” and Luther and Calvin can speak of Scripture as free from error."
The Truthfulness of Scripture: Inerrancy - Articles

* What Is The Didache? Is It Inspired By God?

"Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you." Deuteronomy 4:2

https://d3hgrlq6yacptf.cloudfront.net/5f4766d57c3ad/content/pages/documents/1333232121.pdf

Do you trust that Jesus Christ died for your sins and rose from the dead?

That is where you admit to God that you are a sinner (repentance) and have faith (trust) in what Jesus did for you.

Testifying to both to the Jews,
and also to the Greeks,
repentance towards God,
and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.
Acts 20:21

 

[37818]

@rlvaughn

For most of my life I was a devout and committed Christian. I was baptized in a Congregational church and reared as an Episcopalian, becoming an altar boy when I was twelve and continuing all the way through high school. Early in my high school days I started attending a Youth for Christ club and had a "born-again" experience--which, looking back, seems a bit strange: I had been involved in church, believing in Christ, praying to God, confessing my sins, and so on for years. What exactly did I need to convert from? I think I was converting from hell--I didn't want to experience eternal torment with the poor souls who had not been "saved"; I much preferred the option of heaven. In any event, when I became born again it was like ratcheting my religion up a notch. I became very serious about my faith and chose to go off to a fundamentalist Bible college--Moody Bible Institute in Chicago--where I began training for ministry. (God' Problem, p. 1)

This does not answer my question.

How and what did Bart Ehrman describe in believing the gospel in regards to one becoming saved when he was a professing Christian?

This is an important question.

1 John 5:10, ". . . He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: . . ."

Romans 8:16, ". . . The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: . . ."

John 17:3, ". . . And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, . . ."

And of course contexts.

You see, if we actualy know someone. We cannot honestly say there was never such a person. Genuine Christians know God through Christ.

 

[rlvaughn]

It's better if you seek out the evidence yourself. Keywords like, Gospel Coalition Corrupt, will be quite informative I think.

No thanks. For now I'll trust Michael Kruger, who professes to be a Christian, over Bart Ehrman, who has denied the faith.

 

[rlvaughn]

This does not answer my question.

I know what I think about Ehrman, but I was trying to give you his answer. That seems to be the way he describes his becoming a Christian. Not sure he ever claims he knew Christ, so far as I can tell. Our churches are filled with people who are doing but not knowing. I'll not go further down that road, since it likely will lead farther and farther from the OP.

 

[37818]

I know what I think about Ehrman, but I was trying to give you his answer. That seems to be the way he describes his becoming a Christian. Not sure he ever claims he knew Christ, so far as I can tell. Our churches are filled with people who are doing but not knowing. I'll not go further down that road, since it likely will lead farther and farther from the OP.

There are a list of former professing Christians. This is also a study as to why. The stony ground might be as one reason. The trusting one's own efforts to be a Christian, Matthew 7:22. Can this be prevented? We need to speak the needed truth in love.

 

[TurtleSox]

No thanks. For now I'll trust Michael Kruger, who professes to be a Christian, over Bart Ehrman, who has denied the faith.

Many prefer to ignore the truth they're not ready to face. However a corrupt source, like GC is not credible in an intellectually honest debate.

Bart Ehrman was a professed Christian and had a crisis of faith. This does not mean God lost faith in Bart. Who remains a New Testament Scholar, and is still the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.

Were he removed from relationship with God, being an agnostic now, one would expect him to resign. Not teach the history of God's New Covenant.

Michael Kruger. Michael Kruger is Presbyterian and Calvinist. Michael Kruger believes Orthodox Christianity is Heresy. And Orthodox Christians are Heretics.