"passive" in justification; "not passive" in sanctification

[Van]

And once again the Calvinist's have no answer to the conditional election taught in scripture, so they offer up the logical fallacy of an argument against the man. Note RT says delusional, du..., unlearned, and so forth.
2 Thess. 2:13 teaches we are chosen through faith in the truth, demonstrating to any objective reader our election for salvation is conditional, being based on God crediting our faith as righteousness.

 

[Yeshua1]

And once again the Calvinist's have no answer to the conditional election taught in scripture, so they offer up the logical fallacy of an argument against the man. Note RT says delusional, du..., unlearned, and so forth.
2 Thess. 2:13 teaches we are chosen through faith in the truth, demonstrating to any objective reader our election for salvation is conditional, being based on God crediting our faith as righteousness.

Yes, we are the ones chosen to get saved by Jesus by God the father, as ONLY those whom he destined and Foreknew will even be the ones to accept jesus through faith!

Election happened first, from God, then we are placing faith in Jesus, not we do that first, and then God elects us!

 

[Van]

As has been pointed out time and time again, since we are chosen through faith in the truth, we must have been born, grown, and accepted the gospel of Christ before we are individually chosen for salvation.

Calvinism collapses like a house of cards when scripture is actually studied.
1) They say no unregenerate person every seeks God at any time, but scripture (Matthew 23:13) says unregenerate men were entering heaven.
2) They say we are chosen individually unconditionally, but scripture (2 Thess. 2:13) says we are chosen through faith in the truth.
3) They say Christ died only for the elect, but scripture say Christ laid down His life as a ransom for all.
4) They say the grace drawing individuals to salvation is irresistible, but scripture say men entering heaven were blocked by false teachers.

 

[robustheologian]

Yes, we are the ones chosen to get saved by Jesus by God the father, as ONLY those whom he destined and Foreknew will even be the ones to accept jesus through faith!

Election happened first, from God, then we are placing faith in Jesus, not we do that first, and then God elects us!

Van is not able to comprehend that...as you can see.

 

[Van]

And has been pointed out time and time again, all Calvinism can do is offer logical fallacies (i.e. non-Cal unable to comprehend).

Calvinism collapses like a house of cards when scripture is actually studied.

1) They say no unregenerate person ever seeks God at any time, but scripture (Matthew 23:13) says unregenerate men were entering heaven.
2) They say we are chosen individually unconditionally, but scripture (2 Thess. 2:13) says we are chosen through faith in the truth.
3) They say Christ died only for the elect, but scripture say Christ laid down His life as a ransom for all.
4) They say the grace drawing individuals to salvation is irresistible, but scripture say men entering heaven were blocked by false teachers.​

 

[robustheologian]

Accusations of logical fallacy by one using the logical fallacy of proof by assertion...oh the irony. :laugh:

 

[Van]

On they run, over the hill and away from the topic. Calvinism teaches we were chosen individually unconditionally, but scripture (2 Thess. 2:13) teaches we are chosen through faith in the truth.

 

[aadebayo]

On they run, over the hill and away from the topic. Calvinism teaches we were chosen individually unconditionally, but scripture (2 Thess. 2:13) teaches we are chosen through faith in the truth.

One thing is for sure, the reformed doctrine ascribes all the glory to God as per election.

 

[Van]

Another thing for sure is Reformed Doctrine ascribes individual election as unconditional, but scripture ascribes individual election as conditional, i.e. through faith in the truth. Thus we are saved by grace through faith.

 

[Yeshua1]

Another thing for sure is Reformed Doctrine ascribes individual election as unconditional, but scripture ascribes individual election as conditional, i.e. through faith in the truth. Thus we are saved by grace through faith.

So salvation is the free gift of God towards us , but then is also a conditonal gift to us?

And corporate election would fir the Old covenant view of salvation, but NOT the NT on under the new covenant!

 

[Van]

2 Thessalonians 2:13 says our individual, not corporate election for salvation is conditional, i.e. through faith in the Truth. All these efforts to change the subject are simply evasions. Man is passive in regeneration, justification and adoption. This seems true, God regenerates us, causes us to be born anew. God justifies us, we do not justify ourselves by works of righteousness. And God will adopt us, the redemption of our bodies, at Christ's second coming. The issue of course comes with our understanding of what prompted God's monergistic action, did He credit our faith in Christ as righteousness, or did He chose us unconditionally and give us faith via irresistible grace. 2 Thessalonians 2:13 makes the answer crystal clear.

Calvinism collapses like a house of cards when scripture is actually studied.

1) They say no unregenerate person ever seeks God at any time, but scripture (Matthew 23:13) says unregenerate men were entering heaven.
2) They say we are chosen individually unconditionally, but scripture (2 Thess. 2:13) says we are chosen through faith in the truth.
3) They say Christ died only for the elect, but scripture say Christ laid down His life as a ransom for all.
4) They say the grace drawing individuals to salvation is irresistible, but scripture say men entering heaven were blocked by false teachers.​

 

[Yeshua1]

2 Thessalonians 2:13 says our individual, not corporate election for salvation is conditional, i.e. through faith in the Truth. All these efforts to change the subject are simply evasions. Man is passive in regeneration, justification and adoption. This seems true, God regenerates us, causes us to be born anew. God justifies us, we do not justify ourselves by works of righteousness. And God will adopt us, the redemption of our bodies, at Christ's second coming. The issue of course comes with our understanding of what prompted God's monergistic action, did He credit our faith in Christ as righteousness, or did He chose us unconditionally and give us faith via irresistible grace. 2 Thessalonians 2:13 makes the answer crystal clear.

Calvinism collapses like a house of cards when scripture is actually studied.

1) They say no unregenerate person ever seeks God at any time, but scripture (Matthew 23:13) says unregenerate men were entering heaven.

Isaiah and paul disagree with you on that, as does jeremiah and John!

2) They say we are chosen individually unconditionally, but scripture (2 Thess. 2:13) says we are chosen through faith in the truth.

Romans 8 states the truth, of how God saves us from start to finish

3) They say Christ died only for the elect, but scripture say Christ laid down His life as a ransom for all.

Jesus death on the Cross was sufficient to have saved all sinners, yet clearly only some were meant to get saved by god from that act!

4) They say the grace drawing individuals to salvation is irresistible, but scripture say men entering heaven were blocked by false teachers.​

sinners keep on rejecting the grace of God, as Stephen speech to them made clear, but ALL whom God draws to jesus shall be saved, and not one shall ever be lost!

Think that you keep on protesting and kicking against what the bible teaches unto us concerning salvation!

 

[Van]

On and on it goes folks. Total Spiritual Inability is a fiction, limited spiritual ability is biblical doctrine!!

Romans 8 does not contradict 2 Thessalonians 2:13, it reinforces it!!

Men were entering heaven, thus were seeking God, and were blocked. Irresistible Grace is thus shown to be fiction, Matthew 23:13!!

Jesus is the propitiation or means of salvation for the whole world. No verse says otherwise!!

 

[robustheologian]

Jesus is the propitiation or means of salvation for the whole world. No verse says otherwise!!

Someone obviously doesn't know what propitiation means...unless you're endorsing universalism.

 

[convicted1]

Someone obviously doesn't know what propitiation means...unless you're endorsing universalism.

Trust me, he doesn't...:thumbsup:.


Those Calvinists, gotta love'em folks...

 

[Van]

Yet another attack, another logical fallacy, another unprincipled defense of fiction.

Propitiation = Jesus = Means of Salvation

So simple a child could understand!!

And folks note the effort to claim my view reflects or is close to Universalism, so an effort to paint me as a heretic. This is all they have, make one false charge after another.

You have got to love them, folks.

On and on it goes folks. Total Spiritual Inability is a fiction, limited spiritual ability is biblical doctrine!!

Romans 8 does not contradict 2 Thessalonians 2:13, it reinforces it!!

Men were entering heaven, thus were seeking God, and were blocked. Irresistible Grace is thus shown to be fiction, Matthew 23:13!!

Jesus is the propitiation or means of salvation for the whole world. Thus Limited atonement, as defined by Calvinism, is a fiction.

 

[robustheologian]

Yet another attack, another logical fallacy, another unprincipled defense of fiction.

Propitiation = Jesus = Means of Salvation

So simple a child could understand!!

And folks note the effort to claim my view reflects or is close to Universalism, so an effort to paint me as a heretic. This is all they have, make one false charge after another.

You have got to love them, folks.

On and on it goes folks. Total Spiritual Inability is a fiction, limited spiritual ability is biblical doctrine!!

Romans 8 does not contradict 2 Thessalonians 2:13, it reinforces it!!

Men were entering heaven, thus were seeking God, and were blocked. Irresistible Grace is thus shown to be fiction, Matthew 23:13!!

Jesus is the propitiation or means of salvation for the whole world. Thus Limited atonement, as defined by Calvinism, is a fiction.

So you're saying the definition of propitiation is "the means to satisfying God's wrath" and not "the satisfaction of God's wrath"??? :laugh: Like I said, you don't know what "propitiation" means.

 

[convicted1]

So you're saying the definition of propitiation is "the means to satisfying God's wrath" and not "the satisfaction of God's wrath"??? :laugh: Like I said, you don't know what "propitiation" means.

Hey, at least Van's consistent...

 

[convicted1]

Yet another attack, another logical fallacy, another unprincipled defense of fiction.

Propitiation = Jesus = Means of Salvation

So simple a child could understand!!

And folks note the effort to claim my view reflects or is close to Universalism, so an effort to paint me as a heretic. This is all they have, make one false charge after another.

You have got to love them, folks.

On and on it goes folks. Total Spiritual Inability is a fiction, limited spiritual ability is biblical doctrine!!

Romans 8 does not contradict 2 Thessalonians 2:13, it reinforces it!!

Men were entering heaven, thus were seeking God, and were blocked. Irresistible Grace is thus shown to be fiction, Matthew 23:13!!

Jesus is the propitiation or means of salvation for the whole world. Thus Limited atonement, as defined by Calvinism, is a fiction.

Son you need to go back to 1st grade and try to study again...get outta 1st grade before you try to debate with the big boys...

 

[Iconoclast]

Son you need to go back to 1st grade and try to study again...get outta 1st grade before you try to debate with the big boys...

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh: van is on the right