Pastor on the clock

[Luke2427]

I agree, but as a layman, when I do all or most of these same things I would like to at least get a gold star added beside my name on the sunday school board. You will need to have some age on you to understand that reference.

Pastors are salaried employees, they are not hourly. Salaried employees work when work needs to be done and are often paid for their expertise and applying that expertise to meet the needs of the organization. There is also an expectation that salaried employees will put in more that 40 hours most weeks.

Ed, as a layman, you dont do it like a good pastor does. There's almost no way you can if you work a secular job 40 hours a week.

I know this is going to really frustrate some laymen who may read this but generally speaking pastoral study and discussions about the Bible and ministry are on a whole other level from the kind that laymen have.

 

[Gib]

Give that man a MEDAL!

I'd like to give him a mop, broom and a weed eater. He and his 5 kids could knock out the cleaning and lawn maintenance in an hour or so on Saturday morning. Idle hands....

 

[Crabtownboy]

I'd like to give him a mop, broom and a weed eater. He and his 5 kids could knock out the cleaning and lawn maintenance in an hour or so on Saturday morning. Idle hands....

Oh man, Gib now you are going to be in big trouble with some folk on the board, you want them to actually work. :laugh:

I am reminded of a pastor I know, who actually works hard, but is very honest. He said, "Being a minister in a church is like being retired. No one really know what they do."

I really like my pastor, but I do not expect her to mow the yard at church .... oh wait, we do not have a yard. :laugh: She does pitch in and help when we have a work day.

I try very hard to support my pastor and I will do nothing that may cause her a problem. There are too many neurotics out there that are more than willing to cause problems. Thank goodness we do not seem to have any of them in the small church I attend.

 

[Ed B]

Ed, as a layman, you dont do it like a good pastor does. There's almost no way you can if you work a secular job 40 hours a week.

I know this is going to really frustrate some laymen who may read this but generally speaking pastoral study and discussions about the Bible and ministry are on a whole other level from the kind that laymen have.

I am sure you do it right and invest a lot of study into each sermon. But some pastors plagiarize and/or copy complete sermons and lessons straight off of other people's work. And I know some preachers reissue the same sermons and lessons that perhaps they authored. It might be done on a X year rotation or after changing Churches. I am related to enough Pastors and have known others well enough to know this. Then you hear a famous preacher on Christian radio give a sermon that you heard almost word for word at your church from your Pastor 3 months prior. That stuff doesn't go unnoticed by everyone. Unfortunately not all your colleagues are as studious, inspired and original as you or the other Pastors on this community. To be honest, if it is a good, biblically correct sermon and presentation of a Gospel message I don't mind if it is borrowed or re-issued as long as the preacher acknowledges the source.



I certainly assume that I am not able to do those things as well or at the same volume as a good Pastor. It just struck me as I read your list than any good layperson will do most if not all of the same things, though admittedly not as well or as much. I intentionally left off the 8 hours of visitation that you do because that is logistically impossible for a layman if they hope to keep their job. A layman can do a few hours of visitation but not often could layman do eight hours.


But regarding the time-clock question, as I stated before, Pastors should not be viewed as hourly workers. They are more analogous with salaried professionals with the added expectation that Pastors are invested in their flock. That being so, some weeks might be less than 40 "billable hours" and that is OK, but other weeks there will be many more than 40 "billable hours".


I assume there is something behind the original question. It sounds like some ignorant laypersons are making trouble or perhaps complaining that you don't really working for a living. My father was bad about making that accusation. As I said, I am related by marriage to quite a few current and former Pastors. I have a pretty good idea of the demands on their time and emotions. It isn't an easy profession if you are trying to be a good Pastor.

 

[Revmitchell]

1. I have used other preachers outlines. I have done so because I came across it unintentionally and was impressed with how well it communicated the subject. Still I do my own study behind it and I give credit to whom I took it from from the pulpit.

2. I have preached sermons more than once. I still have to do the work again and see if I need to make any changes to it and no sermon can be preached exactly the same twice. I use an outline but nothing more.

3. There is nothing wrong with any of that.


4. Pastors who do nothing but look for sermons online and do not do their own work need to be removed from the pulpit and often are.

 

[preacher4truth]

He comes in and works at the church 5-6 hours four days a week AND has to put up with church people who are stupid enough to say such things??

Give that man a MEDAL!

Agreed.

He claimed his pastor was 'awesome' not too long ago. Now this.

The Jews did the same capricious dance -- one week He was THE ONE then shortly thereafter they crucified the Christ. Fickle church goers like this are rampant.

Go figure.

 

[Revmitchell]

AS a pastor with an education I will say that it is absurd that laymen can only study the Bible and have discussions at a lower level is severely arrogant and completely not true.

 

[Gib]

He claimed his pastor was 'awesome' not too long ago. Now this.



Go figure.

He's still awesome. What I printed was in quotations. I thought everyone would get that's what others say. I can't believe people are too stupid to not figure that out

 

[annsni]

My hubby is preaching another man's sermons and he's STILL spending hours in preparation. Right now our senior pastor has a series he wants preached to all three campuses so he's preaching the first week and then the next week, the two campus pastors are to bring the message to the campuses. But I know my husband has a different angle for these messages - and sometimes it's almost a completely different message - and it takes him at least 8 hours to put it together. This week will take more as he's having a little more difficulty with it. So even preaching someone else's message doesn't mean it's taking the easy way out.

 

[preacher4truth]

He's still awesome. What I printed was in quotations. I thought everyone would get that's what others say. I can't believe people are too stupid to figure that out

But of course! We should've all caught your denigrating remarks about your pastor after you whined about his hours at church as a fabrication and exercise in buffoonery. Then you rush back in to defend your imprudent nonsense with more inflammatory name calling.

 

[Gib]

When a former pastor at our church was out for any reason, he would have the then youth pastor preach in his place. The pastor always gave the YP a sermon printed out and expected him to preach it word for word. Always thought that was weird.

I can understand if its like Ann's situation.

 

[Revmitchell]

When a former pastor at our church was out for any reason, he would have the then youth pastor preach in his place. The pastor always gave the YP a sermon printed out and expected him to preach it word for word. Always thought that was weird.

I can understand if its like Ann's situation.

It is not a good idea. If you cannot trust the man you leave in your place get another one.

 

[Gib]

inflammatory name calling.

Lighten up preach. Just using Luke's words about stupid people.

I spent the day with about 40+ area pastors, including my pastor, and there was no inflammatory name calling on my part. :laugh:

 

[Gib]

It is not a good idea. If you cannot trust the man you leave in your place get another one.

I agree. But, once that pastor left, the YP filled in for 6 months until the position was filled. His sermons were not the issue. The former had his own agenda.

 

[Revmitchell]

I agree. But, once that pastor left, the YP filled in for 6 months until the position was filled. His sermons were not the issue. The former had his own agenda.

And don't let preach bother you. He has no room talking to someone else about posting something inflammatory.

 

[quantumfaith]

And don't let preach bother you. He has no room talking to someone else about posting something inflammatory.

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

[Salty]

It is not a good idea. If you cannot trust the man you leave in your place get another one.

Agreed - 100%

 

[Ed B]

My hubby is preaching another man's sermons and he's STILL spending hours in preparation. Right now our senior pastor has a series he wants preached to all three campuses so he's preaching the first week and then the next week, the two campus pastors are to bring the message to the campuses. But I know my husband has a different angle for these messages - and sometimes it's almost a completely different message - and it takes him at least 8 hours to put it together. This week will take more as he's having a little more difficulty with it. So even preaching someone else's message doesn't mean it's taking the easy way out.

It sounds to me like your husband and your senior pastor are doing it right Annsni! Blessings to you both.

 

[Tom Butler]

Almost 40 years ago, our young pastor passed out a questionaire to members with a list of pastoral duties. The question was, how much time do you think the pastor should spend in each of these pursuits.

I forget every item on the list, but it did include
Sermon preparation
Hospital visitation
Outreach visitation
Personal witnessing
Counseling
Denominational activities
Personal devotional time
Teaching (and prep for teaching)
Administrative duties, planning
Outside revivals
Mission activities

I think there were a couple more. The survey results were shocking. We expected our pastor to work about 80 hours a week or more. It was an eye opener.

Our pastor (who spent about 20 hours a preparing two Sunday sermons and a Wednesday Bible study) said, "Obviously I can't do that. Which means that of some of the things on that list get done, YOU'LL have to do them. I have responsibilities as pastor. You have responsibilities as members. I won't do your job for you."

After we got over the brashness of this young pastor, we realized that he had a point.

And, if he didn't spend the required time in preparation, we could tell. His preaching would reflect it.

 

[Revmitchell]

I recently conducted an unscientific Twitter poll to ask pastors precisely how much time they spend in sermon preparation. For this question I asked for the amount of preparation time for one sermon. Many pastors must prepare more than one sermon per week, so their workload to prepare to preach is even greater.

I am pleased and appreciative for the number of responses I received. Here are the results of the poll by three-hour increments:

1 to 3 hours — 1%

4 to 6 hours — 9%

7 to 9 hours — 15%

10 to 12 hours — 22%

13 to 15 hours — 24%

16 to 18 hours — 23%

19 to 21 hours — 2%

22 to 24 hours — 0%

25 to 27 hours — 1%

28 to 30 hours — 2%

31 to 33 hours — 1%

The results were fascinating to me. Here are some key points I found in the study:

- Most pastors responded with a range of hours. I took the midpoint of each range for my data.
- 70% of pastors’ sermon preparation time is the narrow range of 10 to 18 hours per sermon.
- Keep in mind that these numbers represent sermon preparation time for just one sermon. Many pastors spend 30 or more hours in preparing messages each week.
- The median time for sermon preparation in this study is 13 hours. That means that half of the respondents gave a number under 13 hours; the other half gave a number greater than 13 hours.
- Most of the respondents who gave a response under 12 hours indicated they were bivocational pastors.
- If the sermon was part of a series, the pastors indicated they spent even more upfront time to develop the theme and preliminary issues for the sermons to be preached.
- Many of the pastors are frustrated that they don’t have more time for sermon preparation.
- A number of the pastors indicated that finding consistent and uninterrupted sermon preparation time was difficult.


http://thomrainer.com/2013/06/22/how-much-time-do-pastors-spend-preparing-a-sermon/