Poll: #3, Suicide & Lapsi

[Claudia_T]

If you don't have any good works how you can say you believe in Jesus. If you believe in Jesus you do as He says. If good works are missing your faith can be questioned. If your faith is questionable then salvation is as well. Do I miss something?

I have to say that I have never actually heard that put so well.

 

[Ed Edwards]

If you don't have any good works how you can say you believe in Jesus. If you believe in Jesus you do as He says. If good works are missing your faith can be questioned. If your faith is questionable then salvation is as well. Do I miss something?

You got it!
Now say one does 99% good works and 1% bad works.
Does that one go saved to lost, lost to saved, saved to lost?
Or can we just so our bad works and tip the priest a few
$100 bills and get on with life?

 

[Claudia_T]

You got it!
Now say one does 99% good works and 1% bad works.
Does that one go saved to lost, lost to saved, saved to lost?
Or can we just so our bad works and tip the priest a few
$100 bills and get on with life?

Ed,

I understand where you are coming from but isnt he just saying the same thing that James said here?

James 2:
17: Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18: Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
19: Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
20: But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?



because if its "by faith alone" ???

 

[Janosik]

You got it!
Now say one does 99% good works and 1% bad works.
Does that one go saved to lost, lost to saved, saved to lost?
Or can we just so our bad works and tip the priest a few
$100 bills and get on with life?

It's between one and Jesus if 99% is good enough isn't it? It could be that for somebody .01% will be enough. You never know

 

[Ed Edwards]

Obviously you never had your baby gang raped in front of you.
(Chad, 1988)

Obviously you never had your 10-year-old boy captured as a sex slave.
(Somalia, 2007)

It is a cruel world out there and Satan isn't a
purring kitten but a ROARING LION.
Our American forefathers didn't talk about the
'this vail of tears' for light reasons..
Don't get confused between 'tribulation' and
'Sunday School picnic'.

John 16:33 (KJV1611 Edition):
These things I haue spoken vnto you, that in me
ye might haue peace, in the world ye shall haue tribulation:
but be of good cheare, I haue ouercome the world.

Savior Jesus is the overcomer!

 

[Janosik]

Ed,
I am not sure what you were trying to say by your post.
Nevertheless, no good works, no faith, no salvation. Very simple.

 

[webdog]

Ed,
I am not sure what you were trying to say by your post.
Nevertheless, no good works, no faith, no salvation. Very simple.

You indirectly add works to salvation. I also do not see grace anywhere in your equation, the main factor. You are saved by grace through faith...no works. Works come AFTER one is saved, but is never guaranteed to last a lifetime. In James we see faith without works being a "dead faith", not a non existent faith, or a faith that was never truly genuine.

 

[Claudia_T]

Most people when they talk about faith realize they have faith in the grace of God, in the atoning blood of Christ. Just because they dont specifically spell everything out doesnt mean anything. I noticed people do that alot on here. Its like they nit pick.

 

[Claudia_T]

I mean what is it you think they are having faith in when they mention faith? well what else? OF COURSE they mean faith in the atoning blood of Christ.

 

[Janosik]

You indirectly add works to salvation. I also do not see grace anywhere in your equation, the main factor. You are saved by grace through faith...no works. Works come AFTER one is saved, but is never guaranteed to last a lifetime. In James we see faith without works being a "dead faith", not a non existent faith, or a faith that was never truly genuine.

If I wrote a whole page about salvation I would miss something. I am sure.
What I am trying to say is that good works back up faith. I agree - 'by grace through faith'.
Having said that I realize the salvation process is more complicated then that and it's impossible to describe it in a few lines.

 

[webdog]

If by "salvation process" you are referring to sanctification, I agree. Sanctification never is the measuring stick for justification, nor is it a factor in whether one is justified...has been justified...or will continue to be justified.

 

[Janosik]

What do you consider sanctification. What is an endresult of the sanctification?

 

[webdog]

The end result is being conformed into the image of Christ, and set apart for His purpose while on earth.

Sanctification
SANCTIFICA'TION, n. [See Sanctify.]
1. The act of making holy. In an evangelical sense, the act of God's grace by which the affections of men are purified or alienated from sin and the world, and exalted to a supreme love to God.
God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation, through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth. 2 Th 2. 1 Pet 1.
2. The act of consecrating or of setting apart for a sacred purpose; consecration.

 

[Janosik]

Is it a process or one time thing? If it's an ongoing process and it's not finished yet do you know how it's going to end up?

 

[webdog]

It's an ongoing process ending in our glorification.

 

[Janosik]

How you can say it's going to end up in your glorification if it's not finished yet?

 

[webdog]

I'm not sure I'm following your question. Currently we are being sanctified if we are believers. Once we go to be with the Lord and are glorified, the sanctification process will have been fulfilled, as we won't still continue to be "made holy"...we will be glorified.

 

[Janosik]

Is there a chance that Jesus can say one's sanctification process failed? One will not end up in heaven?

 

[Ed Edwards]

How you can say it's going to end up in your glorification if it's not finished yet?

By faith & by hope.

John 3:16-17 (KJV1611 Edition):
For God so loued ye world, that he gaue
his only begotten Sonne:
that whosoeuer beleeueth in him,
should not perish, but haue euerlasting life.
17 For God sent not his Sonne into the world
to condemne the world:
but that the world through him might be saued.

Glorification is NOT the end of Salvation;
salvation has no end.

salvation = everlasting life

salvation has no end

if it has an end, it is something other than 'salvation'

 

[Ed Edwards]

Is there a chance that Jesus can
say one's sanctification process failed? One will not
end up in heaven?

Do they have ice storms in hell?

(I'm shut in by an ice storm for a couple or three days.
As long as the electrical line to the house is up
and the TV/phone/internet access Cable is up I
will likely be posting.)

Seriously: Jesus does the sanctification (though I suppose
if the person doesn't cooperate they might not have been
saved by Jesus in the first place.