Pronoun Trouble

That is not true. Greek pronouns carry much more impact and meaning than the archaic English thous, thees, etc. If you were to learn Greek you would realize how far off the statement you made is.

 

Why not? George Fox wasn't born until 13 years after the 1611 was published. Quakers didn't exist then.The Society of Friends formed in the mid-17th century.Ye should know that.

 

You Mean 'Contraction' Trouble, I Think!

"[Sigh!] There is nothing necessarily wrong with an attempt to "make up the rules, as you go along," I guess, but really... "Ya'llth"?

[FTR, the use of "right", where I have placed the second (sic) in the above post, is technically proper English grammar. However, the sound I heard was either that of your 7th grade grammar teacher turning over in her grave, if she happens to be deceased, or falling out of her chair, should she be alive and well.]

Punctuation is one facet of written grammar, as well, and the use of a comma would serve to make this of decidedly better construction. (I realize I may be getting somewhat 'long in the tooth', but I don't believe that I have fully reached the 'decrepit' stage, quite yet.) In the alternatives (a good legal phrase, FTR), one could either opt for several synonyms for "right", or infuse a conjunction for a better resultant phrase.

The usage of "elluded" is another matter. There happen to be only two possibilities, here, and I will leave it to you to respond as to which possibility this happens to be, in this particular case.

Now for the 'meat' of your post. Your purported 'rule' would be correct, were one to be attempting to make a contraction of the Southern slang "ya" and will, however, the contracted slang plural (or sometimes the singular usage of this word) is properly (assuming such a thing is actually a possibility, here) "y'all".

Here is a sentence that will serve to illustrate the difference.

"Y'all take care now, ya' hear, otherwise ya'll likely to run afoul of Language Cop!"

Incidentally, the use of"y'all's" - as the possessive form, is the only instance in the English language, where one can properly use two apostrophes in one word, for a bit of otherwise useless information.


And, since ,

here is a link to a picture from the Commonwealth of KY, showing the 'proper' usage. :thumbs:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florence_Y'all_Water_Tower

'Mumble...! Grumble...! :BangHead:

Everyone wants to be a critic! ...Mumble... - Amateurs!!!"

Signed, Language Cop

 

I thought it was dangerous to delve into the Greek.

 

Was that first comma really necessary?

 

Things could get worser...

My 7th Grade grammar teacher died after I submitted my theme on "What I Want for Christmas" and openning line was, "I want an official Red Ryder Carbon Action 200 shot range model air rifle!"

I second Rippon's questioning of the comma...and I'll also point out that the whole ",as well," in the above sentence is superfluous and should be eliminated so to keep with the coherency of thought.

Yet without it we wouldn't be enjoying this enlightening conversation.

Perhaps this is the case, but I might make the case that linguistically the "y" does not actually carry a solid sound in the above construction. If we choose to keep with the spirit of contractions we must add a vowel, perhaps an "o", from the conjuctive in question. Yet "yo'all" is probably a closer construction to a less Southernly geographic idiom. Thus to properly meld the dipthong, the combination of a "ou" and "a" would naturally carry longer sounding "a" into the antecedant portion of the conjugation.

While this might appear, on the surface, to be correct, the inclusion of a prevailing dipthong might obsfucate the rule which is proposed.

As a firm rule, anytime we refer to individuals from the state of Kentucky to solve proper English grammar questions we have erred on the side of ignorance.

Respectfully, the right proper Earl of Linguistics.:laugh:

 

"Sir, I perceive that thou art a prophet."

"...that he was a prophet indeed."

Well, I was privileged to attend a reunion of my Bible College over the past Labor Day weekend, at the Marietta Conference Center, and I understand that it was was found that when I drove from Kentucky to Georgia, I single-handedly managed to lower the IQ of both states, and when I returned to Kentucky the following Tuesday, managed to elevate the IQ of both places.

However there is one thing that the statisticians found very puzzling, when they ran the figures.

It seems that on both the days I traveled, they ran across an unexplained, three-hour long upward spike in the IQ of Tennes...

Ed

 

You are a righteous, er... riotous act. :laugh:

 

I believe your opinion of any "man made teaching" which attempts to substitute for the word(s) of God, which He has given us, should never be humble!

And that is my not-so-humble opinion on that subject!

Ed

 

I hope ya do well in school, BT-and I hope you shuck the man-made KJVO doctrine while you're there!

The KJVO doctrine has no truth in it-and not one quark of SCRIPTURAL SUPPORT, even from the KJV itself.

The current KJVO theory comes from a CULT OFFICIAL'S book, 7TH DAY ADVENTIST official Dr. Benjamin Wilkinson's 1930 book, Our Authorized Bible Vindicated.

You cannot even BEGIN to prove that the valid MVs are any less the word of God than the KJV is, or the earlier English versions. And by "valid versions", I mean those that accurately follow the sources from which they're translated. The validity of those sources is another question entirely.

Being quite young in comparison to myself(I'll be 61 in April) I know someone has led you astray with their KJVO hooey. I hope you sincerely **PRAY** for guidance in this subject, that the HOLY SPIRIT opens your eyes to the TRUTH, that is, that KJVO is bogus as a $3 bill & is entirely MAN-MADE, as are mosta the doctrines of the Roman Catholics.

And, I shall add my prayers as well. You seem to have the makings of a great worker for the Lord, & I wish you every success, free of the man-made hooey with which some people try to pollute the IFB body of beliefs.

 

My wife used to be a Public Schools certified English Teacher in the state of Texas. I still can't find out what the rules for thee, thou, etc. are.
Anybody here know the rules for the personal pronouns used in the 15th century (1401-1500)? I know some people who use 'KJV talk' in their prayers - I don't think they know the rules for 15th century English either?

I guess I should check with my Daughter. She is a Public Schools certified, English as A Second Language, Elementary School (grades pre-school to 6) Teacher. She also works as the coordinator in her Elementary required by the USofA Federal Government of the programs specified for, English as A Second Language, learning by the 'No Student Left Behind' program. Not that that helps her with the thee & thou stuff. But her avocation is Medieval Fair Story Teller. So I'm sure she has to know the thee & thou stuff to be authinic.

Does anybody want to talk about other pronouns?

Do not the 'he's have to match something in the text? How about capital 'H' 'He' for member of the Holy Trinity and just little 'h' 'he' for us common folks? Some of the MVs have this, you know?

 

I'll second that motion, and the Amendment to the motion, as well.

(Hey! Gomme' a beak! I'm our Church Moderator, so I don't get to do very often!) :laugh:

Man, You are getting old!

Obviously, I'll never catch up to you, on that (considering I am four months behind you)! :laugh: :laugh:

Ed

 

I have yet to find any KJVO preacher use the KJVO language in their preaching being consistent with their view of the English language. In essence they are hypocritical about what they say and do.

 

IMO, the entire KJ VO position is a man-made myth based in hypocrisy and ignorance. The problem is that, once people are hooked into the false KJVO position, it takes a lot to get them off that hook. Bible believers need to pray for KJVOs every day...

 

It is obvious to non-Christians too. However it is much like a cult and the guru leading is often looked upon as some sort of prophet or authority figure.

 

I am not speaking about its precision or other commendable features -- but the ASV of 1901 used Elizabethan English throughout.There was no language update as such.So the plowboys (yes,the American spelling) had to wait two more years for Weymouth's New Testament translation in 1903.The latter used modern speech.In other words it was more Tyndalish (if I may coin a word).

 

There is an irony in saying that it is "dangerous to delve into the Greek".

The KJV translators themselves did this (delve into the Greek and Hebrew).

Speaking of the ancient translators of the past:

Emboldening my own.

Here is another contradiction to the “only” position of any group of “onlies” (such as the Latin Vulgate Only group).

Both of these quotes are taken from the 1611 KJV Prologue The Translators to The Reader.


HankD