Prophecy fulfilled today! Jesus is coming soon.

[OldRegular]

For the love of all why are there so many Reformed on this website? These discussions are meant for like minded brethren.

I suppose some of us "are compelled", perhaps predestined, to address Scriptural error when we see it!

 

[OldRegular]

Maybe you're right, you're afraid of dispensationalism because you're afraid it's the truth.
Of course you can prove the Jews are no longer God's chosen people. This comes from replacement theology. A bunch of nonbiblical philosphy. The stuff has only existed for maybe 100 years. None of which has any truth in it. Let me fill you in; When God gives His word He never takes it back. Other wise God is a liar. You're not calling God a Liar are you?
MB

Actually replacement theology is a dispensational myth, or is it allegory, or metaphor? Whatever! it is mythical; and it is the dispensational error of Darby/Scofield that has only been around a hundred years or so, sometime after Margaret Macdonald had her vision.

 

[evangelist6589]

I don't see how people can ignore the signs of the times. Violence is why God brought the flood and all but Noah ignored them too. Violence has been getting worse with each passing day. Israel is surrounded by it's enemies. Islam a side product of the RCC and is murdering Christians everyday even as we speak. The world is in turmoil the financial systems of the world are failing. The weather is horrendous To ignore the signs of the time is ludicrous. Famine in this country is just arround the corner for this country. Pestilence is on the rise. Look up believers because your redemption draws near.
MB

Amen and well said MB! David Jeremiah has written 7 books on Bible prophecy and I have read all 7 of them. We cant ignore the signs of the times.

 

[evangelist6589]

I am like-minded with you, but totally against trying to make headlines fit scripture. It can't be done as had been proven over and over again.

Let's stop looking for signs and start living like we expect Jesus back any second regardless of the headlines.

There are different types of Dispensationalist and different degrees of interpretation. Perhaps this new book I am reading called the Harbinger, the author is stretching scripture a little. Looking at Isa 9:10 or the verse he uses I think he is most definitely doing that. However there are truths in the book and I am reading it for the interest level and the truths in the book. Yes he does stretch the Bible at times, but its got good content as well.

 

[evangelist6589]

Actually replacement theology is a dispensational myth, or is it allegory, or metaphor? Whatever! it is mythical; and it is the dispensational error of Darby/Scofield that has only been around a hundred years or so, sometime after Margaret Macdonald had her vision.

Dispensationalism did not start with Darby or Scofield. Look at history and you will see that this is a myth about us.

 

[InTheLight]

To put everything posted in perspective I present the following:

The 10 worst natural disasters in terms of death toll are extracted from a list of 66 compiled by David B. Hall. The complete list is available on the internet.

<Snip list of disasters over the centuries.>

OK, would you now present a list of mass murders that have occurred over the centuries to refute the OP's claim of "the love of many has grown cold" is a fulfillment of prophecy?

Generally, I don't look to headlines to fit prophecy but I can't think of any examples of a loner killing dozens of strangers before this generation. Just last year we had 70+ people killed in Norway and now we have this incident in Aurora, CO. There was also Columbine, the DC snipers, Virginia Tech massacre, Fort Hood army base killings, etc. etc. People have had guns for hundreds of years yet only recently are we seeing this sort of killings. Why?

I believe this mass murder of strangers is a new phenomena and could be a fulfillment of prophecy.

 

[OldRegular]

Dispensationalism did not start with Darby or Scofield. Look at history and you will see that this is a myth about us.

I have and dispensationalism started with Darby and was propagated in this country by Scofield. It was a sad day for the Church when the Scofield Bible was published!

 

[OldRegular]

<Snip list of disasters over the centuries.>

OK, would you now present a list of mass murders that have occurred over the centuries to refute the OP's claim of "the love of many has grown cold" is a fulfillment of prophecy?

Generally, I don't look to headlines to fit prophecy but I can't think of any examples of a loner killing dozens of strangers before this generation. Just last year we had 70+ people killed in Norway and now we have this incident in Aurora, CO. There was also Columbine, the DC snipers, Virginia Tech massacre, Fort Hood army base killings, etc. etc. People have had guns for hundreds of years yet only recently are we seeing this sort of killings. Why?

I believe this mass murder of strangers is a new phenomena and could be a fulfillment of prophecy.

Samson killed a thousand or so with the jawbone of an ass!

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

TYes he does stretch the Bible at times,

Being a literalist I have very little time for Bible stretchers

 

[webdog]

Samson killed a thousand or so with the jawbone of an ass!

Impossible...I'm sure Iconoclast still has his :laugh:

All kidding aside the comparison of Samson (righteous) to the many killings in recent history (unrighteous) is apples and space shuttles.

 

[MB]

I am like-minded with you, but totally against trying to make headlines fit scripture. It can't be done as had been proven over and over again.

Let's stop looking for signs and start living like we expect Jesus back any second regardless of the headlines.

You have to admit that the things happening today gives us a reason to remember He can come at any moment. I pray for His comming before things get much worse.
MB

 

[Luke2427]

Well when the Bible says "the Love of most will grow cold" it is referring to the lack of love and the increase in violence in the last days.

The world is a thousand times better off than it was 2,000 years ago, brother.

Wholesale slaughter was not uncommon then. Murder was a recreational PASS-TIME in Rome.

The most civilized nation in the world in that day fed people to lions for entertainment.

Immorality was a MILLION times more rampant then. The Romans, I am told, did not even have a WORD for "homosexual" because it was not thought of as a distinct sexual practice from heterosexuality. It was EXTREMELY common for Roman men to have "boy lovers" and the nation did not frown upon this.

The most civilized nation in the world had massive sex temples built for the pagan gods serviced by a thousand prostitutes, male and female, where it was very commonplace to have massive orgies nightly.

If Matthew 24 requires the world to become more immoral before Jesus can return then we've got a while.

These are things many dispensationalists do not know.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

You have to admit that the things happening today gives us a reason to remember He can come at any moment.
MB

We should not need headlines and such to remind us. The Bible tells us and that should be enough.

 

[Yeshua1]

You're trying to talk theologically, so you need to remember that the 2nd coming refers to him physical return to the earth to set up His earthly kingdom. It really doesn't refer to the rapture. Matthew 24 and 25 refer to the 2nd coming. Jesus is answering a question about his kingdom as you can see in 24:3.

I understand how you get excited about reading the paper and seeing this news and thinking it may mean Jesus was returning to take His People home. But in 1999, when 14 people were killedat columbine, was that a sign that Jesus was coming soon? What about the murders in darfur?

You use these illustrations as showing that the love of many will grow cold, but these are being committed to people who don't even like Jesus much less love him.

I appreciate your ardor, but Paul thought Jesus was coming in his lifetime. He said, "We who are alive and remain shall be caught up..." (1 Thess 4:17) I will be ecstatic if Jesus raptures us out in the nexy minute, but it won't be because ungodly people commit atrocities.

I am a pre trib Dispy, but aleways need to take the bible in contex, and to read it in the light of per the Apsotles, we have been on the "end times" since he ascended!

Do believe that wehave had same kind of trials/diseases/natural disastors, that will be consistant intil he returns, but do think frequency and intensity incrreases closer to him returning we get!

 

[Yeshua1]

I think the dispensational eschatology is not Biblical. That being said God will bring every thing to fruition in His way and in His time.

The problem with dispensationalism, which is rarely if ever mentioned, is their false doctrine regarding the purpose of the Incarnation and the Church: that is, Jesus Christ failed to establish a Messianic kingdom for the Jews and established the Church as a fall back position!:tear::tear::tear::tear:

No, the Lord used the rejection by isreal to bring us into salvation thru yeshua, he is the messaih to both jews/gentiles!

he now is dealing thru the Church, but one day will redeal and restore national isreal....

 

[Yeshua1]

The world is a thousand times better off than it was 2,000 years ago, brother.

Wholesale slaughter was not uncommon then. Murder was a recreational PASS-TIME in Rome.

The most civilized nation in the world in that day fed people to lions for entertainment.

Immorality was a MILLION times more rampant then. The Romans, I am told, did not even have a WORD for "homosexual" because it was not thought of as a distinct sexual practice from heterosexuality. It was EXTREMELY common for Roman men to have "boy lovers" and the nation did not frown upon this.

The most civilized nation in the world had massive sex temples built for the pagan gods serviced by a thousand prostitutes, male and female, where it was very commonplace to have massive orgies nightly.

If Matthew 24 requires the world to become more immoral before Jesus can return then we've got a while.

These are things many dispensationalists do not know.

Such as when he will return to rapture his Church!

 

[MB]

We should not need headlines and such to remind us. The Bible tells us and that should be enough.

Yes the Bible does tell us and what it tells us is happening right before our eyes. The news media only confirms it.
In Mathew 24 the Lord told us of the events that lead up to His coming. We are up to the point where people are being murdered for their faith in Jesus. Earth quakes are happening at an alarming rate. Natural disaster is certainly on the rise.

Missionaries are already saying that this prophecy has already happened.
Mat 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
MB

 

[preachinjesus]

There are too many Reformed on this site.

Well I'm not reformed.

These kinds of discussions are meant to be with like minded.

Then don't post them in the General Forum. Honestly if you only want your assumptions reinforced and your conclusions to be unchallenged then general discourse with a group of people probably isn't for you. However when you openly (and continually) post drivel that conflates singular events in a small community in the middle of Western civilization and conclude that this clearly must be a harbinger of the end for all humanity I'm going to challenge that statement.

Then attempting to dismiss proper critique by stating that only those who agree with you can post (which you didn't mention above) is a foolish way to avoid intellectual challenge. It smacks of the hubris of anti-intellectual fundamentalism. This is no way to comport oneself amongst fellow believers.

If you can't handle deeper level discussions than maybe you should refrain from posting ridiculous eschatological speculation and then call for conclusions.

 

[preachinjesus]

Nothing cracks me up more than those who open their mouths with out thinking.
MB;
A dispensationalist and glad that I am. Too bad you haven't the ability to defend you poor view of scripture.

What part of my post do you disagree with? What specific parts of my point are erroneous and display a "poor view of cripture"?

I am happy to talk details with you but in this reply you've actually added nothing but a trite retort that fails to engage at any level with the statement I made against over-realized eschatology.

I get that these discussions are complicated and if you can't handle the rigor of actual engagement and discussing the specific points of disagreement than maybe this is a conversation you should sit out.

 

[preachinjesus]

Dispensationalism did not start with Darby or Scofield. Look at history and you will see that this is a myth about us.

This is false. You simply cannot find dispensational theology articulated before Darby. Some attempt to claim that the chialist position of patristic scholars was dispensational, yet at closer examination they were articulating a covenant theological position. Also, it is a false claim to say that because the "Catholic Church" opposed dispensationalism it destroyed all the early works. We have a very thorough compendium of patristic and early church writings, including many works that were rejected by the framers of the NT canon. None of them articulate dispensationalism.

The truth is Darby is the first dispensationalist. It is a recent development in theology.