Questions About Predestination

[Charlie24]

God bases His election towards us who will be found in Jesus per His good will and pleasure, and then He predestines us due to our election in Christ, so 2 separate processes here, and diagreement would be on just what basis did God rest His election onm?

The election is based on the same thing it was from the very beginning, faith.

The disagreement is on whether God chooses or allows man to choose.

 

[JesusFan]

The election is based on the same thing it was from the very beginning, faith.

The disagreement is on whether God chooses or allows man to choose.

man already chose though to be at war against God and be His enemy

 

[Charlie24]

Unless the Holy Spirit enables them to hear though, they will remain deaf and dumb to it

I think that would be the purpose of spreading the Gospel.

"Faith comes by hearing..."

 

[Charlie24]

man already chose though to be at war against God and be His enemy

But we chose Christ when we heard and believed the Gospel.

But at the same time we disagree on whether the predestination was a predestination to God's plan of redemption for all who will believe, or a predestination of salvation strictly chosen by God.

 

[JesusFan]

But we chose Christ when we heard and believed the Gospel.

But at the same time we disagree on whether the predestination was a predestination to God's plan of redemption for all who will believe, or a predestination of salvation strictly chosen by God.

Think that you are asking if the predestination was to the Plan or to the person, correct?

 

[Charlie24]

Think that you are asking if the predestination was to the Plan or to the person, correct?

Paul was speaking to the born-again Church when he said that.

They were predestined to what? Was it a plan that all of them were adopted by Jesus Christ according to the good pleasure of His will or was it a salvation according to God's election of the individual?

 

[Silverhair]

Where is that doctrine of full free will taught though, as my bible states that desire God, no not right, nor seek after Him?

Free will is not a doctrine @JesusFan.
Free will is a God given ability to make actual choices.

We see this all though the bible.

In the OT we are told to make choices:
Jos_24:15 "And if it seems evil to you to serve the LORD, choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve,...

Deu_30:19 "I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose life,...

We see that man can make real choices in the NT:
Rom 10:13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Eph 1:13 And in Him, having heard and believed the word of truth—the gospel of your salvation

Whether the OT or NT man has the ability to make real free will choices.

 

[Charlie24]

Paul was speaking to the born-again Church when he said that.

They were predestined to what? Was it a plan that all of them were adopted by Jesus Christ according to the good pleasure of His will or was it a salvation according to God's election of the individual?

God's plan of redemption doesn't end with justification/election, it carries on into sanctification throughout our whole lives "conforming us into the image of Christ."

The Holy Spirit is continuously trying to bring our standing up to the level of our position in Christ.

 

[canadyjd]

….

Now you can quote all the Scripture you like and twist it as much as you like, but that is the truth of the matter.

I have attempted to get you to consider what Jesus meant when He said those that sin are slaves to sin. If the Son sets you free, you are free indeed.

I have attempted to get you to consider what the Apostle Paul taught us in Romans when he very clearly stated we are slaves to sin (personified as a master over us) who controls our actions.

Without any attempt to explain exactly how I am “twisting”, you just make the statement as if it needs no support.

I have attempted to get you to engage your mind and open yourself up to at least consider what is being said. You want no part of that.

Therefore, this is not a dialog. This is not an attempt to wrestle with God’s Word, but rather to simply regurgitate talking points.

It is unedifying and non productive.

I am done

Peace to you

 

[Charlie24]

I have attempted to get you to consider what Jesus meant when He said those that sin are slaves to sin. If the Son sets you free, you are free indeed.

I have attempted to get you to consider what the Apostle Paul taught us in Romans when he very clearly stated we are slaves to sin (personified as a master over us) who controls our actions.

Without any attempt to explain exactly how I am “twisting”, you just make the statement as if it needs no support.

I have attempted to get you to engage your mind and open yourself up to at least consider what is being said. You want no part of that.

Therefore, this is not a dialog. This is not an attempt to wrestle with God’s Word, but rather to simply regurgitate talking points.

It is unedifying and non productive.

I am done

Peace to you

That's a good idea, and I'll join you on "I am done."