Regeneration or Conversion?

Yelsew · May 15, 2003

(NJB) Ephesians 5
1. As God's dear children, then, take him as your pattern, 2. and follow Christ by loving as he loved you, giving himself up for us as an offering and a sweet-smelling sacrifice to God. 3. Among you there must be not even a mention of sexual vice or impurity in any of its forms, or greed: this would scarcely become the holy people of God! 4. There must be no foul or salacious talk or coarse jokes, all this is wrong for you; there should rather be thanksgiving. 5. For you can be quite certain that nobody who indulges in sexual immorality or impurity or greed, which is worshipping a false god, can inherit the kingdom of God.

6. Do not let anyone deceive you with empty arguments: it is such behaviour that draws down God's retribution on those who rebel against him. 7. Make sure that you do not throw in your lot with them. 8. You were darkness once, but now you are light in the Lord; behave as children of light, 9. for the effects of the light are seen in complete goodness and uprightness and truth.

10. Try to discover what the Lord wants of you, 11. take no part in the futile works of darkness but, on the contrary, show them up for what they are. 12. The things which are done in secret are shameful even to speak of; 13. but anything shown up by the light will be illuminated 14. and anything illuminated is itself a light. That is why it is said: Wake up, sleeper, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you.

15. So be very careful about the sort of lives you lead, like intelligent and not like senseless people. 16. Make the best of the present time, for it is a wicked age. 17. This is why you must not be thoughtless but must recognise what is the will of the Lord. 18. Do not get drunk with wine; this is simply dissipation; be filled with the Spirit. 19. Sing psalms and hymns and inspired songs among yourselves, singing and chanting to the Lord in your hearts, 20. always and everywhere giving thanks to God who is our Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
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In Context, it seems to me that Ray Berrian NAILED IT!

Frogman · May 15, 2003

That is why it is said: Wake up, sleeper, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you.
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I disagree. The above statement does is not justified in light of what vs. 14 says. Vs. 14 says "he", who is "he"?

Bro. Dallas Eaton

Yelsew · May 15, 2003

Since Isaiah is a prophet (mouthpiece for hire), His boss, the one who tells the prophets what to say, is the one who said it.

So the Lord God sayeth it through his servant Isaiah. However, he was not saying it to individuals but to God's holy city Jerusalem.

Paul however, said it to the Ephesians to illustrate the power of God to bring good to those who believe in Jesus.

Frogman · May 18, 2003

Originally posted by Yelsew:
Since Isaiah is a prophet (mouthpiece for hire), His boss, the one who tells the prophets what to say, is the one who said it.

So the Lord God sayeth it through his servant Isaiah. However, he was not saying it to individuals but to God's holy city Jerusalem.

Paul however, said it to the Ephesians to illustrate the power of God to bring good to those who believe in Jesus.
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Again, who is 'he'?

Bro. Dallas Eaton

Yelsew · May 18, 2003

Presuming God to be a Triune Godhead, God inspired Isaiah to say it, Paul quoted Isaiah.

God infrequently speaks in an audible voice, but does truly inspire man to speak what God puts in the mouth of his prophets. So the "he" that spoke the words is Isaiah. The Same God inspired Paul to quote Isaiah.

Isaiah 60:22. The smallest will grow into a thousand, the weakest one into a mighty nation.
When the time is ripe, I, Yahweh, shall quickly bring it about.
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Can there be another "he"?

Frogman · May 18, 2003

yes, Yelsew, the "he" is the Spirit, which is the Spirit of Christ, then, the wherefore he saith becomes that which the dead hear his voice and they arise by the power and authority of his calling them.

God Bless.
Bro. Dallas Eaton

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