Regeneration

[kyredneck]

How you came to that absurd (and false) concluhingsion off of my statement is bewildering. Tell me how you deduced that from what I stated. I'll get the popcorn!

Everything about the LS Puritan nosey judgemental fruit inspecting witch hunting for false professors posts you all make is KILLJOY. Pharisaim redux.

 

[Van]

Let me say it again. When a person is transferred into the kingdom of Christ, they are transferred out of the realm of darkness (separated spiritually from God) and united with God, made alive together with Christ, regenerated, born anew, and made a new creation created for good works. And all this occurs while the individual is still physically alive on earth, but spiritually a part of us is in heaven. Don't get lost in Old Testament types and shadows.

 

[SovereignGrace]

No, they did not 'saw my legs off'. Several anti-Jn 1:13/3:8 folks have posted recently making no distinction between the heavenly birth and conversion. All three links clearly make that distinction between the two and that one definitely precedes the other. From the SB link:

"James P. Boyce (first president of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, in Louisville, Kentucky): "It is not strange, therefore, that they [i.e. regeneration and conversion] are often confounded. Yet, after all, the Scriptures also teach that regeneration is the work of God, changing the heart of man by his sovereign will, while conversion is that act of man turning towards God with the new inclination thus given to his heart" (Abstract of Systematic Theology, p. 374).

John A. Broadus (distinguished professor of New Testament and successor to Boyce at Southern Baptist Theological Seminary): "1. Q. What is meant by the word regeneration? A. Regeneration is God's causing a person to be born again. 9. Q. Does faith come before the new birth? A. No, it is the new heart that truly repents and believes" (taken from Broadus' A Catechism of Bible Teaching, reprinted in A Baptist Treasury, pp. 67-68).

John L. Dagg (first writing Southern Baptist theologian; president of Mercer University in Georgia): "In our natural state we are totally depraved. No inclination to holiness exists in the carnal heart; and no holy act can be performed, or service to God rendered, until the heart is changed. This change, it is the office of the Holy Spirit to effect. . . . But, in his own time and manner, God, the Holy Spirit, makes the word effectual in producing a new affection in the soul: and, when the first movement of love to God exists, the first throb of spiritual life commences" (A Manual of Theology, pp. 277, 279).

B. H. Carroll (founder and first president of Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary in Fort Worth, Texas): "The true scriptural position [concerning regeneration] is this: There is, first of all, a direct influence of the Holy Spirit on the passive spirit of the sinner, quickening him or making him sensitive to the preaching of the Word. In this the sinner is passive. But he is not a subject of the new birth without contrition, repentance and faith. In exercising these he is active. Yet even his contrition is but a response to the Spirit's conviction, and the exercise of his repentance is but a response to the Spirit's conviction, and the exercise of his repentance and faith are but responses to the antecedent spiritual graces of repentance and faith." Carroll goes on to state that "repentance and faith are fruits of regeneration" (An Interpretation of the English Bible, Volume 4, p. 287)."

Brother KYR, I believe, to a certain extent, we are talking past each other. I agree that regeneration is solely the work of grace wrought upon the heart by God. I do not deny this. Neither do those who you are using in your posts. However, where I take umbrage is to this notion that regeneration happens when no one has never even heard of the name of Jesus.

Ppl who are anti-gospel regeneration quickly rush to Abram as their support. One problem, it was God who spoke directly to him. He knew who Christ was because, if you do a careful study, Christ is Jehovah, the pre-incarnate Christ. Look at J.L. Dagg's statement where he said "the Holy Spirit makes the word effectual." He is saying that the Holy Spirit, through the proclamation of the gospel, quickens those who God chosen from before the creation of the world, and they are then converted by their faith and repentance, which are both gifts of God in regeneration.

Ppl then want to rush to John the Baptist as he leapt for joy in Elizabeth's womb. Only one problem...that is the only occurrence recorded in the bible, so it would be foolish to use that event to build one's doctrine upon.


B.H. Carroll states "quickening him or making him sensitive to the preaching of the Word." Again, he is saying that regeneration does not happen in a vacuum but by the Spirit of God through the preaching of the gospel.

Look at 1 Corinthians for instance..."For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. For it is written: “I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate. Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe."[vss 18-21] Those who are saved in today's world are saved solely through the gospel. Then in Romans 1 we can read... For I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God that brings salvation to everyone who believes: first to the Jew, then to the Gentile. For in the gospel the righteousness of God is revealed—a righteousness that is by faith from first to last, just as it is written: “The righteous will live by faith.”[vss 16,17] The gospel saves everyone who believes and it also displays the righteousness of God. Those who believe are those whose heart God has wrought grace upon as they heard the word of God being preached, witnessed to, or taught through the word of God.

No gospel...no salvation.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Everything about the LS Puritan nosey judgemental fruit inspecting witch hunting for false professors posts you all make is KILLJOY. Pharisaim redux.

And you are on a LS'er witch hunt.

 

[SovereignGrace]

"John L. Dagg (first writing Southern Baptist theologian; president of Mercer University in Georgia): "In our natural state we are totally depraved. No inclination to holiness exists in the carnal heart; and no holy act can be performed, or service to God rendered, until the heart is changed. This change, it is the office of the Holy Spirit to effect. . . . But, in his own time and manner, God, the Holy Spirit, makes the word effectual in producing a new affection in the soul: and, when the first movement of love to God exists, the first throb of spiritual life commences" (A Manual of Theology, pp. 277, 279)."

J.L. Dagg states "God, the Holy Spirit, makes the word effectual in producing a new affection in the soul." He is NOT saying what you think he is saying. He is saying that through the word of God, through the proclamation of the gospel, He quickens whoever He wills. But Joe Blow in deepest darkest Africa who has never seen the first missionary, who has never heard the word of God either in preaching or in witnessing, knows nothing about the risen Christ. They can not be quickened without having some knowledge that the risen Christ came in the flesh. That is the thrust of Paul's argument in Romans 10 when he wrote "How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them? And how can anyone preach unless they are sent? As it is written: “How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!” But not all the Israelites accepted the good news. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our message?” Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word about Christ." Faith, which is a gift of God, comes from hearing the word. As the gospel is being proclaimed, God quickens those of His own choosing.

But when it was the good pleasure of God, who separated me, even from my mother`s womb, and called me through his grace,
16 to reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the Gentiles; straightway I conferred not with flesh and blood: Gal 1

And yet Paul knew about the risen Christ, as He was foretold in the OT scriptures he was taught. It was when Christ revealed Himself to Paul(Saul at that time), and knocked him off his camel(I think that was his ride) that he knew that Christ was God's only Son. But to use Saul of Tarsus to support your claim is not wise. How many were shown this bright Light that blinded them? One. You can not build your argument off of Saul, no more than you can Abram.

 

[Internet Theologian]

Everything about the LS Puritan nosey judgemental fruit inspecting witch hunting for false professors posts you all make is KILLJOY. Pharisaim redux.

You have no clue and are so far off track here it's pathetic. Not one thing I stated had a thing to do with anything you said above. Not one. You have LS on the brain while you yourself preach a false works salvation.