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Revival is...

John of Japan

Well-Known Member
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Last night in our prayer meeting, I recalled an experience from 45 years ago in S. Georgia. I was preaching in a little country church, and at the invitation a young man came forward from the back to get saved. At his salvation, the church erupted with joy, thanksgiving and praise to God. He was a prodigal son, come back to his family at last!
 

JesusFan

Well-Known Member
Last night in our prayer meeting, I recalled an experience from 45 years ago in S. Georgia. I was preaching in a little country church, and at the invitation a young man came forward from the back to get saved. At his salvation, the church erupted with joy, thanksgiving and praise to God. He was a prodigal son, come back to his family at last!
Reminds me of reading the conversion experience of Spurgeon, as believe was 17 years old, wandered from churches to church in midst of a bad snowstorm at the time, and finally landed at a church who had a small crowd due to weather, and had someone who was picked to preach a message as pastor did not make church service, and all he knew to preach was on isaiah look to me to be saved, and as he kept preaching just that phrase, Spurgeon stated he looked at Jesus and His cross and was saved
 

Tenchi

New Member
But Calvinists don't believe God's initiative in salvation is coercive. He doesn't say, "I'm going to make you a Christian against your will." Rather, He grants the sinner new, spiritual life, without which that sinner cannot believe on the Lord Jesus Christ:

“And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins, in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience, among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others.” (Eph 2:1-3 NKJV)

Saying that God "grants the sinner new, spiritual life" is word-play, as far as I can see. By "grants" do you mean God allows the sinner genuine freedom to choose, or not to choose, their spiritual-regeneration? Or do you actually mean that God unilaterally determines that the sinner will be spiritually-regenerated so that they can then respond positively to the Gospel? In my experience with Calvinists, it's usually the latter, not the former.

I understand that Calvinists want to construe "dead" (in trespasses and sins) as meaning "utterly without the capacity to respond," or something like this, but I don't think this is what Paul meant by "dead" in Ephesians 2:1. Men in whom the Holy Spirit did not dwell in a post-Calvary, spiritually-regenerative way (e.g Job, Moses, Noah, Daniel, Cornelius) are given high praise in Scripture, called "perfect and upright," and "a just man and perfect in his generation," and "a devout man and one who feared God." Far from being presented as utterly incapable of a positive response to God - dead - in their sins, these men, sans spiritual regeneration (i.e. the indwelling Holy Spirit), lived exemplary, God-ward lives.

Paul often used "dead" to mean "separation from," or "self-sacrifice," rather than "utterly without the ability to respond." Read Romans 6:6-11; 7:4; Colossians 3:3, 2 Timothy 2:11, etc. I think this is the sense in which he meant "dead" in Ephesians 2:1. As you know, I'm sure, from the Fall in Eden until Christ's Resurrection, Man was spiritually separated from God - "dead" - but this state-of-affairs has been rectified through Christ, as Paul described in Ephesians 2:4-10 (and in Colossians 2:9-13, Romans 6:1-11, Isaiah 53; 2 Corinthians 5:18-21, etc.). But as the biblical characters already mentioned (Job, Noah, Cornelius, etc.) demonstrate, this separation did not mean a profound, incorrigible disinterest in God, an utter "deadness" in mind and heart, toward Him.

Anyway, this thread isn't about the Calvinist ordo salutis, or prevenient grace, but spiritual revival, so I'm won't say any more about Calvinist doctrine.
 
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