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Rumsfeld - This is really disgusting!

L

liebeskind

Guest
Originally posted by OldRegular:
I wonder how much of the criticism of Bush and Rumsfield is coming from people who supported that man whose mind never got above his belt. Fess up now! :D
Like I've mentioned to you people once before "I DON'T SUPPORT KERRY OR BUSH, AND NATER (I'm speechless!)!

So stop making this partisan because that does not work with me, just because I don't support Bush does not make me a Kerry Supporer, both are APOSTATES IF YOU ASK ME! Now I hope everyone got that! :rolleyes:

Ron
 
L

liebeskind

Guest
Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
Rumsfeld has done a good job.

Joseph Botwinick
Again, you would say that!
laugh.gif


Ron
 
L

liebeskind

Guest
Originally posted by KenH:
Hey, Ron, do you take medicine for high blood pressure? You appear to write like your blood pressure is always sky high.
No I'm sorry you have me mixed up with BUSH.
I write so the blind can see through their bias loyalty. I know I get through eventhough they do not admit to it (just to save face). ;)

Ron
 

Joseph_Botwinick

<img src=/532.jpg>Banned
Originally posted by blackbird:
Are we not thankful we live in a country where we are free to rant about our President???

There's a lot of countries out there still today where Presidental ranters are usually on the "Receivein'" end of a machine gun!!!
So true, Blackbird. Natan Sharansky call these tyrannical societies fear societies. This is what Afganistan was. This is what Iraq was. They are both becoming free societies. No longer are people's tongues cut out in Iraq for the mere crime of being a dissenter.

Joseph Botwinick
 
L

liebeskind

Guest
Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by blackbird:
Are we not thankful we live in a country where we are free to rant about our President???

There's a lot of countries out there still today where Presidental ranters are usually on the "Receivein'" end of a machine gun!!!
So true, Blackbird. Natan Sharansky call these tyrannical societies fear societies. This is what Afganistan was. This is what Iraq was. They are both becoming free societies. No longer are people's tongues cut out in Iraq for the mere crime of being a dissenter.

Joseph Botwinick
</font>[/QUOTE]How funny, if you ask me, some on this site would like to shoot us so-called Bush haters! Is Iran a fear society? Is Palestian a fear society. Or are you associating them like that because they hate the America? ;)

Ron
 

Joseph_Botwinick

<img src=/532.jpg>Banned
Originally posted by Ronald H.:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by blackbird:
Are we not thankful we live in a country where we are free to rant about our President???

There's a lot of countries out there still today where Presidental ranters are usually on the "Receivein'" end of a machine gun!!!
So true, Blackbird. Natan Sharansky call these tyrannical societies fear societies. This is what Afganistan was. This is what Iraq was. They are both becoming free societies. No longer are people's tongues cut out in Iraq for the mere crime of being a dissenter.

Joseph Botwinick
</font>[/QUOTE]How funny, if you ask me, some on this site would like to shoot us so-called Bush haters!
</font>[/QUOTE]I have never advocated physical violence against those who have a different opinion than me. That is part of democracy and a free society. If you, however, commit murder, rape, or treason, then I would advocate your execution. To my knowledge, you have not done these things, have you?

Is Iran a fear society?[/QUOTE]

Does Iran have free elections? Does Iran allow freedom of speech? Does Iran allow freedom of emmigration? If the answer to all those questions are no, then I would say that they are indeed, a fear society.

Is Palestian a fear society. Or are you associating them like that because they hate the America? ;)

Ron
[/QUOTE]

Yes. The Palestinians do live in a fear society. I was thinking about this very issue earlier today. When Reagan died earlier this year, I remember on the day of his actual funeral in Washington, during the processional there were some people from Westboro Baptist Church in the crowd holding up signs that said "Ronald Reagan is in Hell!" and had pictures of Reagan burning in Hell. However tasteless the actions of these lunatics were, it was a good example of Democracy in a free society. Although, their message was wrong and totally out of line morally, none of them were beat up. None of them were imprisoned. None of them were tortured or killed for excercising free speech. I then wondered what would have happened had a Palestinian Christian stood at the processional of Arafat's funeral holding signs that said "Arafat was a terrorist" or "Arafat is now in Hell with his 76 virgins". What do you think the outcome would have been? They would have probably been killed. That is the way things are in fear societies. But, there are some dissenters within Palestinian society who want to have Democracy because they know that this is the key to human rights and to a better life for the average Palestinian, and not just the corrupt leaders who horde all the money for themselves or send them to terrorists group which continue to oppress their own people and murder Jews as well. I am on their side in their quest for freedom. How about you? As to the second part of your question, many people in London hate America for political reasons. However, they do live in a free society because they are allowed freedom of speech, free elections, and the freedom to emmigrate. The same cannot be said about Palestine, Iran. The same couldn't be said of Iraq and Afganistan. That has changed and is in the process of continual change for freedom.

Joseph Botwinick
 

Joseph_Botwinick

<img src=/532.jpg>Banned
Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Ronald H.:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
Originally posted by blackbird:
[qb] Are we not thankful we live in a country where we are free to rant about our President???

There's a lot of countries out there still today where Presidental ranters are usually on the "Receivein'" end of a machine gun!!!
So true, Blackbird. Natan Sharansky call these tyrannical societies fear societies. This is what Afganistan was. This is what Iraq was. They are both becoming free societies. No longer are people's tongues cut out in Iraq for the mere crime of being a dissenter.

Joseph Botwinick
</font>
How funny, if you ask me, some on this site would like to shoot us so-called Bush haters!</font>[/QUOTE]I don't want to kill you. I do, however, want to defeat your ideology as I think it is wrong for America and the world.

Joseph Botwinick
 

blackbird

Active Member
Quote by Ronald H.: "How funny, if you ask me, some on this site would like to shoot us so-called Bush haters!"

That is an implication that is not true!!! And I resent that implication!!

Blackbird
 
L

liebeskind

Guest
Originally posted by blackbird:
Quote by Ronald H.: "How funny, if you ask me, some on this site would like to shoot us so-called Bush haters!"

That is an implication that is not true!!! And I resent that implication!!

Blackbird
I can accept your resentment, just as I do when I'm called a bush hater!

Ron
 
L

liebeskind

Guest
Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Ronald H.:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
Originally posted by blackbird:
[qb] Are we not thankful we live in a country where we are free to rant about our President???

There's a lot of countries out there still today where Presidental ranters are usually on the "Receivein'" end of a machine gun!!!
So true, Blackbird. Natan Sharansky call these tyrannical societies fear societies. This is what Afganistan was. This is what Iraq was. They are both becoming free societies. No longer are people's tongues cut out in Iraq for the mere crime of being a dissenter.

Joseph Botwinick
</font>
How funny, if you ask me, some on this site would like to shoot us so-called Bush haters!</font>[/QUOTE]I don't want to kill you. I do, however, want to defeat your ideology as I think it is wrong for America and the world.

Joseph Botwinick
</font>[/QUOTE]Ok I'll bite on that. But why don't you try to defeat my ideology on your post entitled "The NOBEL PEACE PRIZE"! It's the same!

How would you describe your ideology stating that Ronald Reagan should have gotten a Nobel Prize for Peace?

Ron
 

Dragoon68

Active Member
Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
Just getting worked up over nothing.

I guess we gotta find something to lynch him for.

Joseph Botwinick
That's exactly the way I see it too Joseph!

I don't think it matters whether the letters are hand written, typed, personally signed, mechanically signed, or marked with a drop of blood. I don't hold it against the Secretary of Defense one way or the other. Sure, it would be a very nice thing if all letters could be personally written and signed but, just because they're not, hardly means the person doesn't care. I don't know about today, but in times past it fell upon a person's immediate commander to write a personal letter to the next of kin of the deceased soldier.

What matters far more is what's in the hearts of all concerned and what's done in action by everyone. I care, you care, and the country cares about those lost. We all care because we know the price paid is so great and especially so for the ones lost and their immediate families and friends. It is a sacrifice that must be made. Fellow troops will fight on to victory remembering those who fell before them if the losses are made what they should be. Winning the war is everything. That's why we go to war. To win at all costs. The nation mourns its losses but must not dwell upon it and must remain focused on victory. So many do not understand that today.

There is no one to blame for it except our enemies and their causes! That's what we need to get into our heads. They're the bad guys - we're the good guys. No one - including the President or the Secretary of Defense or anyone else in the chain of command - wants to see any of our troops die, and it's painful when they do. Everything we say and do needs to add support to the just cause it which we're engaged and needs to support those doing the work and leading the work. The rest needs to be put aside.

The true benefit of their loss is the continued freedom and liberty others will enjoy. That is paid for in blood and letters of condolence have nothing to do with making the sacrifice worthwhile or not.

It is understandable that some, in their grief, would be upset over it but it is a real shame that many others would seize upon it to make yet another run at discrediting our leaders. Some folks relish the opportunity to jam a camera into the face of a grieving mother or father and, indeed, it does hurt to "feel" their sorrow. Never the less, the true purpose, I fear, is not concern over the losses but simply petty attacks by some for not having had their choice in the White House or Dept. of Defense.

Patrick
 

LadyEagle

<b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>
Even President Bush personally signs the condolence letters. It is arrogant, uncaring, and yes....laziness for the Secretary of Defense to not do so, too.

Our soldiers and their loved ones deserve better from the greatest military in the world. I can't believe some on here defend the indefensible. If it was a Clinton appointee, some who are defending Rumsfeld would be all over this. Sad.
tear.gif
 

poncho

Well-Known Member
They'll talk about unarmoured humvees and Rumsfeld not signing condolence letters in person but they never talk about the long term dangerous effects that depleted uranium may have on our troops and their families.

Wonder why that is.
 

LadyEagle

<b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>
I know, poncho. But they weren't going to talk about the unarmored humvees until a Tennessean troop brought it up.

I just talked to my cousin today who's grandson is over there. She said the parents are having to send body armor because there isn't enough for everyone. And they've had to make up boxes with underwear and socks because the military doesn't provide enough. She said those videos they showed on TV about troops enjoying a big Thanksgiving dinner were propaganda. Most of the troops ate MREs for Thanksgiving!

Just for the record, I've read there are quite a few Republicans in Congress who aren't real happy with Rummy.
 

KenH

Well-Known Member
For the anti-war folks, listen up! The election is over. You're not going to get rid of President Bush at the ballot box and you're not going to convince President Bush to dump Secretary Rumsfeld. You're wasting your time.

Ya'll need to be supporting the war against al Qaeda, not carping against our leaders trying to defeat al Qaeda.
 

poncho

Well-Known Member
Republicans in congress unhappy with Rummy? Your joking right? Their just trying to distance themselves from any blame LE. Same with Kristol's latest public rant trying to cover his behind. Buncha cowards!
 

KenH

Well-Known Member
Yes, it is cowardly to be carping instead of supporting 100% the war against al Qaeda.

The next election is two years away and four years away for president.

Let's lay politicking aside for a while and support the war against al Qaeda.
 
L

liebeskind

Guest
Originally posted by KenH:
Yes, it is cowardly to be carping instead of supporting 100% the war against al Qaeda.

The next election is two years away and four years away for president.

Let's lay politicking aside for a while and support the war against al Qaeda.
Do you understand what you are writing? THE WAR AGAINST AL QAEDA, who is AL QAEDA? The war is against OSAMA whom is AL QAEDA! But when we had him your president siad on National TV that "HE WAS NOT WORRIED ABOUT HIM". WHY NOT KEN? Because BUSH and the NEOCONS had their own AGENDA! So don't tell us not to POLITIC! Like I told you people once before, I DON'T CARE ABOUT BUSH OR KERRY. People like you need to stop making this POLITICAL, and accept the facts that SOME of us are not political and when we see Wrong we attack it! Now if you can't deal with that, and if you can't defend BUSH and his administration based on facts, then you should not post anything asking others not to post things about Bush and his administrations based on the FACTS. You need to listen to yourself, your asking Christians to ignor unrightousness, that's something we don't do, FOR ANYONE! Peace.

Ron
 
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