Satan and sin

[DHK]

We all are led by a spirit DHK; You are either led by the Spirit of God, or you are led by the spirit of satan, an evil spirit. Choose ye this day, whom ye shall serve DHK.

BBob

I choose to serve God:

1 John 2:15-16 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

However there are many that choose to follow either:
the lust of the flush, or
the lust of the eyes, or
the pride of life, or
a combination of any of the above.

That doesn't mean that they are actually falling a demon.
They are following their own wants and fleshly desires as the Bible teaches over and over: here, in Rom.7:23 and in James 1; all of which you are ignoring.

 

[Brother Bob]

The man of sin, in this verse, refers to the anti-christ--yet to come. This verse has nothing to do with my quote--to which this was a response to:

Examine this Scripture in Romans 7:23 Bob.
There is no way that Satan enters into this picture.
The choice that Paul gives is the law of God or the law of sin. And the decision is yours--not influenced by Satan--but just yours to make. Don't blame your decisions on Satan.
Of course if you are admitting that you are demon-oppressed that is another thing.

You sure do think funny DHK;

Act 19:16And the man in whom the evil spirit was leaped on them, and overcame them, and prevailed against them, so that they fled out of that house naked and wounded.

1Jo 4:1¶Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

BBob,

 

[menageriekeeper]

Absolutely............, it sure is not the good Spirit telling you that.

But what makes you so sure that any spirit at all was telling me anything? Why do you believe I couldn't have had an evil thought all on my very own?

Do you see us as humans being simply washed from one deceptive influence to another with a sprinkling of good impressions from God thrown in there for good measure? Can we not imagine evil for ourselves?

For what reason was the tree called the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil? Was it merely so we could recognize the difference between the bad thoughts Satan throws our way and the good thoughts God gives to us? You really believe that man in his creation as the image of God really has no --what?-- "creative tendencies" of his own? Are we incapable of independent thought?

 

[DHK]

Act 19:16And the man in whom the evil spirit was leaped on them, and overcame them, and prevailed against them, so that they fled out of that house naked and wounded.

BBob,

You are ignoring the Scripture Bob.
Examine Romans 7:23. Give an answer to that passage.

 

[menageriekeeper]

Guys, this is an interesting conversations but can I make a request?

Please don't just quote scripture without also giving some idea of what you expect others to get from it. DHK and Bro. Bob may can read each other's mind, but I can't read either of them and I'm getting a bit confused as to why you think these scriptures apply to the conversation at hand.

Thank You.

 

[Brother Bob]

I choose to serve God:

1 John 2:15-16 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

However there are many that choose to follow either:
the lust of the flush, or
the lust of the eyes, or
the pride of life, or
a combination of any of the above.

That doesn't mean that they are actually falling a demon.
They are following their own wants and fleshly desires as the Bible teaches over and over: here, in Rom.7:23 and in James 1; all of which you are ignoring.

Oh, you are a peacher and don't know where temptation comes from?

Gen 3:13 And the LORD God said unto the woman, What [is] this [that] thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.

Rom 5:12¶Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

 

[Brother Bob]

You are ignoring the Scripture Bob.
Examine Romans 7:23. Give an answer to that passage.

Romans 7:

17: Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18: For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19: For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20: Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21: I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22: For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23: But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24: O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

Sin is of the devil. Jesus received those same temptations from satan.

Why did Jesus say "get behind me Satan", it was because of the temptations, which bring forth sin if inacted.

Jesus was without sin, because He never give in to those temptations. We did.

BBob,

 

[DHK]

Oh, you are a peacher and don't know where temptation comes from?

Gen 3:13 And the LORD God said unto the woman, What [is] this [that] thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.

Rom 5:12¶Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

1. You quoted my explanation of 1John 2:15,16 which explains where temptation comes from, and then proceeded to ignore it. That seems to be a denial of the Word of God, or perhaps you just didn't understand the Scripture that was explained to you.

2. After three requests now, you still have totally ignored my explanation of Romans 7:25, and refuse to comment on it. I believe the reason for that is because it totally debunks your theology on this subject.

 

[DHK]

Sin is of the devil. Jesus received those same temptations from satan.

Why did Jesus say "get behind me Satan", it was because of the temptations, which bring forth sin if inacted.
BBob,

My mistake Bob if I said Rom.7:23. I meant Romans 7:25

Romans 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

The verse was evident in my post and explanation. It is odd, however, that you left this verse out when you quoted from Romans 7. Why did you do that, it being the last verse of the chapter?

Jesus said: "Get thee behind me Satan" because it was actually Satan himself at that time that was using Peter to prevent Christ from going to the cross. Read the entire passage and then put it into context. Read the rest of the rebuke of Christ. It can only apply to Satan, for it does not apply to Peter at all.

 

[Brother Bob]

In the Millennial Kingdom Satan will be bound for a thousand years. He and his demons will have no influence on anyone at that time. Jesus will rule as king over all the world with a rod of iron. Yet even then, at the end of a thousand years, when Satan is loosed from the bottomless pit, he will be able to muster up a great army from the earth that will turn against Christ and rebel against Him. That shows the depravity of man's heart, and his willingness to follow Satan without his influence. After a thousand years of the influence of God alone, they are still willing to follow Satan.

First place, I do not believe the Millenium is yet to come. Nevertheless, You seem to be saying when Jesus is ruling and satan is bound, there will be no sin. That should give you the answer.

Now, don't no one get me wrong. The body has to be envolved for there to be sin, but also there has to be an evil spirit envolved, which is of the devil.
Why, are we having this disagreement, I do not understand. Man would not of sinned ever, if not tempted. IMO

BBob,

BBob

 

[DHK]

First place, I do not believe the Millenium is yet to come. Nevertheless, You seem to be saying when Jesus is ruling and satan is bound, there will be no sin. That should give you the answer.

BBob

It doesn't give me your answer to Romans 7:25. But my explanation of the Millennial Kingdom does show that man does not need Satan to influence man to do evil. That was the point of that post. Man will do evil even though Satan and his demons will not be there. Christ will rule with a rod of iron, and justice will be meted out. If Christ must rule, and justice must be meted out, then of a necessity there must have been an offence for justice to be carried out.

 

[Brother Bob]

It doesn't give me your answer to Romans 7:25. But my explanation of the Millennial Kingdom does show that man does not need Satan to influence man to do evil. That was the point of that post. Man will do evil even though Satan and his demons will not be there. Christ will rule with a rod of iron, and justice will be meted out. If Christ must rule, and justice must be meted out, then of a necessity there must have been an offence for justice to be carried out.

I do not believe you are among the majority DHK on the Millenium. I think most believe it will be a time of peace and Holiness. I think this has been the belief, even before the NT was ever written.
And if true, there will be no "sin".

Question, What would it took for Jesus to sin, give in to the temptations of satan?

I am going to bed, you have wore me out.......... Good nite,


BBob,

 

[DHK]

I do not believe you are among the majority DHK on the Millenium. I think most believe it will be a time of peace and Holiness. I think this has been the belief, even before the NT was ever written.
And if true, there will be no "sin".

Question, What would it took for Jesus to sin, give in to the temptations of satan?

I am going to bed, you have wore me out.......... Good nite,
BBob,

What about Romans 7:25 Bob?

 

[Joe]

I've never actually heard that sin comes from Satan. I was taught that sin comes from the heart of man (the heart of man is decietful and desperately evil). Sooo, can we have some scripture for and against this idea.

THAT OLD SERPENT, CALLED THE DEVIL, AND SATAN, WHICH DECEIVETH THE WHOLE WORLD-Rev 12:9.

WHEREFORE, AS BY ONE MAN SIN ENTERED INTO THE WORLD, AND DEATH BY SIN; AND SO DEATH PASSED UPON ALL MEN, FOR THAT ALL HAVE SINNED-Ro 5:12.

Here's my analogy for what it's worth-An explanation of the "double whammy"

A boy has a cold. He got the sickness from a sin nature of which Satan is responsible.( See Ro 5:12) Satan is responsible for this child's sickness permeating throughout his body-ORIGINAL SIN

Satan or his demons can ALSO be responsible in a second manner, as the bible tells us of Demon possessions and Satan himself directly tempting Eve and Jesus.

So Satan or his demons directly shoot in a stronger dose of sickness into the boy.

God can inject a dose of penicillin into the boy via the holy spirit

Christians are indwelled with the holy spirit. Often they know they are weak and ask the Lord for strength. Then hopefully he will fill the body with the holy spirit to fight off Satan, his demons, and the stronghold of original sin.

1.Satan is indirectly responsible for our sin nature indirectly (Original sin)
2. Satan and/or his demons can be DIRECTLY responsible for temptations we may have ( demon possession) in combination w/our sin nature

Our sins originate from our sin nature, yet more powerfully Satan himself or his demons are directly causing us evil (possession) when he caused our fallen nature to begin with. Double whammy

People often get upset when others say "The devil made me do it",it's often a cop-out. But doesn't have to be- there is one HUGE benefit in believing this truth. If it wasn't totally one's fault, it's easier to rely upon God to overcome the sin since as a human, we aren't as powerful as Satan or his demons. We are pretty much defeated so we can say "Lord if you want me to get drunk tomorrow, then let the sin take over my mind. I give up,it's up to you whether I sin."
So in turning to the Lord, letting the sin go, and forgetting about it, it defeats Satan or his demons who caused it. All sin begins with a thought. Let the thought go, and you have let the sin go. :saint:

 

[Benjamin]

Sin does come from the lust of the FLESH.. not Satan.

Satan (or imps) tempts our flesh.. but we cannot blame satan for our sin.
We sin because we lust.

In these verses, it is plain to see that sin is born out of our flesh.. the lust of our flesh... NOT from Satan...

Don't give Satan glory by blaming him for our faults...
He would love to get all the credit... but we do it to ourselves...

James 1:14-15
(14) But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
(15) Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Interesting questions; I had to go through quick to get the jest of what is being discussed, but wonder how the following relates to sin being born in the flesh, yet, seems to be helped along by satan's temptations. Both (the lusting man/woman and the temptation of Satan) seem to work to in conjunction with each other, which brings a warning of sinful actions leading one to be tempted because of them:

(1Co 7:5) Defraud ye not one the other, except it be with consent for a time, that ye may give yourselves to fasting and prayer; and come together again, that Satan tempt you not for your incontinency.

We are also told we will not be tempted beyond what we can bear, and so the any sin ought to be the responsibilty of the one falling short; wouldn't you think?


(1Co 10:13) There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

 

[Brother Bob]

I really think I have been misunderstood. I don't think satan makes us sin, I think he is the one who is always present to tempt us though and if we sin, its because we are following him, instead of the Lord. I think if you removed the temptor from the Equation, that we would not be tempted to sin, therefore, no sin. It is us who are the blame for sin, because we follow an evil spirit.

BBob,

 

[Brother Bob]

What about Romans 7:25 Bob?

I did answer this DHK; I think I did anyway.

Romans 7:25
23: But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24: O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25: I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

Here is a perfect example of the temptor being present in the flesh, creating a war between the inward man and the outward man. If you remove the temptor, which is what will happen in the resurrection, there would be no temptation, therefore no sin.

You remember that "thorn in the flesh" which is a "messenger of satan"???

2Cor.12

1. [7] And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

BBob,

 

[DHK]

Here is a perfect example of the temptor being present in the flesh, creating a war between the inward man and the outward man. If you remove the temptor, which is what will happen in the resurrection, there would be no temptation, therefore no sin.

You remember that "thorn in the flesh" which is a "messenger of satan"???
BBob,

Paul never refers to a messenger of Satan. You are reading that into the text. It is not there. Look at the verse again:

Romans 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

There is a war as described by the previous verses.
Paul finds victory over that war. Here is the vicotry, and here is also the defeat.

The victory: With the mind I myself serve the law of God.
The defeat: With the flesh I serve the law of sin.

Who is your master? Who will you serve? The law of God or the law of sin? Satan does not enter into this equation. You make the choice entirely apart from Satan. In fact Satan is not mentioned in Romans 7. The battle is in the mind. We make the choice who we will serve. Satan is not one of those choices. God and our own flesh are the only choices given.

 

[DHK]

I really think I have been misunderstood. I don't think satan makes us sin, I think he is the one who is always present

This is a false theology. Satan can only be in one place at one time. He is not God. He does not have the power to be omnipresent. That is an attribute that only God has. If Satan has it, then Satan is God also. Do you ascribe deity to Satan? I hope not. He isn't God, and isn't omnipresent. He isn't everywhere. He can only be at one place at one time.

We can only say that he is "ubiquitous." That is: he seems to be everywhere because of the multitude of demons that he has serving under him that he sends everywhere to do his work. It therefore seems like he is everywhere, but he isn't. He can only be at one place at one time.

 

[Brother Bob]

This is a false theology. Satan can only be in one place at one time. He is not God. He does not have the power to be omnipresent. That is an attribute that only God has. If Satan has it, then Satan is God also. Do you ascribe deity to Satan? I hope not. He isn't God, and isn't omnipresent. He isn't everywhere. He can only be at one place at one time.

We can only say that he is "ubiquitous." That is: he seems to be everywhere because of the multitude of demons that he has serving under him that he sends everywhere to do his work. It therefore seems like he is everywhere, but he isn't. He can only be at one place at one time.

Satan can only be in one place at one time, is completely ridiculous. If one of his evil spirits is there, so is he.

BBob,