I put a question to Bob Ryan which he must regard as another of my jokes concerning one such instance in his own arsenal of ideologies. Must be he is too afraid to answer me, therefore just flat ignore my question—ignore to insult me, in fact.
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Seventh Day Adv.
- Thread starter Berean
- Start date
I put a question to Bob Ryan which he must regard as another of my jokes concerning one such instance in his own arsenal of ideologies. Must be he is too afraid to answer me, therefore just flat ignore my question—ignore to insult me, in fact.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
It is amazing how you directly contradict Christ in John 4 "Salvation is of the Jews".
Are you doing that on purpose or did you forget about the problem you are creating for yourself?
You also seem to be stepping right into the face of Acts 21:21-24 where it appears that Paul was clueless about your imagined doctrine - so also in Romans 2:6-11 and Romans 11 does Paul flatly contradict your statement.
in Christ,
Bob
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Hold as the Apostle paul did, that NONE can be saved by keeping the Law, as none can, but jesus fulfilled and kept the law for us, so whoever received him by faith receives his grace. and are made born again by act of god!
the HS now dwells in them, and we have the Spirit who will enable tus to walk as we should, and he will allow us to keep the law, NOT to get or keep saved, but in order to please the lord!
blessed is th man who transgression nor held against him, for when we receive Chrsit as the Saviour, we receive His rightousness to stand before God!
We DIO know that revelation fromGod ceased with the passing of John , as the canon of scripture was completed in revealtion, so whatever she got, was NOT from the HS, must have been another spirit!
the Lord has shown us that we are under grace, not law in the writtings of paul, so whatever she received regarding keeping the sabbath day, keeping the law not of God!
the definition of a biblical cult would be
Extra bilical authority other than the bible you have that in your Prophetess
belief true church you hold to being that select remant church of end times
adding to the gospel do by Sabbath and keeping the Law
So while you would be saved, the group yuor in would be same as Mormon/JW a biblical cult!
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BobRyan
Well-Known Member
There is no text in all of scripture saying that the 1Cor 12 gifts are just for "writing the Bible".
There is no text in all of scripture saying that when the NT letters are canonized - the spiritual gift of prophecy will end.
Instead of that we have Eph 4:4-10 telling us that the spiritual gifts continue until the 2nd coming.
And "proof by name calling" is not a form of Acts 17:11 "Sola scriptura" testing of doctirne. (Though I have found some people that suppose that the dark ages model of "proof by name calling" is some sort of valid substitute for Bible evidence in favor of a given doctrine.)
in Christ,
Bob
the office of the prophet and Apostle ceased after John passed away, as the HS does NOT give forth additional and contridictory revealtion to us apart from the Bible!
Do you hold the prophetess was one of God as isaiah and john the baptist were?
Yes, In Jesus' day HE stood before the Samaritan woman and showed her, HERE stands before you the Saviour who is of the Jews, Behold, the Salvation of the Jews! The Jews rejected Him but the Samaritans accepted Him and were saved. Jesus Christ was that Salvation of the Jews they rejected and salvation consistently became of Him irrespective nationality and despite one's Jewish nationality. God brought back from the dead again that Great Shepherd of ALL the sheep of God.
But I know, it's not ME who imagines his own doctrines here; it's you who claim Jesus was a Seventh-day Adventist and a Jew because He kept the Jews' laws. Obeying a nation's laws does not make one, one of that nation. Not even does obeying God's laws make a person the child of God. One is made a child of God DESPITE one’s disobedience.
The same with Paul. In Galatians 3 Paul tells the heathen Christians he too had first to become like them—a heathen—before God could save him.
The SDAs have EVERYTHING about salvation the wrong way round.
You answered well.
Now then, Do you (not I)—Do you speak of the Ten when you say "jesus fulfilled and kept the law for us"? Was it JESUS' obedience to and fulfilment of the TEN Commandments Law in our place that pleased the Lord and in the Lord's eyes was virtuous enough that sinners could be saved by JESUS' fulfilment and obedience of the LAW? Was it JESUS' obedience to and fulfilment of the TEN Commandments?
You answered well.
So was it Old Testament or New Testament Law that Jesus fulfilled by having obeyed "them"?
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jesus Himself stated that he came not to abolish the OT law of the prophets, but to fulfill them!
the trick on this for us as believers in jesus us that to see that we are saved totally by grace, as he did what none could do, be as rightous as God himself, but once saved, God wants us to follow and heed the scriptures regarding what to do and what not to do...
whatever the bible tells us to do, that is what we do, but the reason is NOT to earn or keep salvation, but in order to pleaee God and do what is best for us!
danger of groups like SDA/RCC is they mix and confuse this, so that its own own rightoiusness that gets good enough to allow God to save us, as we would now "merit it!"
Compare post 6738 above :
>>BobRyan
- we have Eph 4:4-10 telling us that the gifts go until the 2nd coming.
GE:
Do you have an actual Bible text for it??
NO! You MISQUOTE!
This is just presumption on your part.
If Ephesians 4:4-10 said "the gifts go until the 2nd coming" then point us to the OTHER text, because it is NOT in Ephesians 4:4-10!
Until you do that you are a liar.<<
... and post 1975401 :
>>Yeshua1
We DIO know that revelation from God ceased with the passing of John , as the canon of scripture was completed in revealtion,
There is no text in all of scripture saying that the 1Cor 12 gifts are just for "writing the Bible".
Bob Ryan:
There is no text in all of scripture saying that when the NT letters are canonized - the spiritual gift of prophecy will end.
Instead of that we have Eph 4:4-10 telling us that the spiritual gifts continue until the 2nd coming.
And "proof by name calling" is not a form of Acts 17:11 "Sola scriptura" testing of doctirne. (Though I have found some people that suppose that the dark ages model of "proof by name calling" is some sort of valid substitute for Bible evidence in favor of a given doctrine.)
in Christ,
Bob<<
GE:
... That now is how a straight challenge is answered the BobRyan SDA way.
>>BobRyan
- we have Eph 4:4-10 telling us that the gifts go until the 2nd coming.
GE:
Do you have an actual Bible text for it??
NO! You MISQUOTE!
This is just presumption on your part.
If Ephesians 4:4-10 said "the gifts go until the 2nd coming" then point us to the OTHER text, because it is NOT in Ephesians 4:4-10!
Until you do that you are a liar.<<
... and post 1975401 :
>>Yeshua1
We DIO know that revelation from God ceased with the passing of John , as the canon of scripture was completed in revealtion,
There is no text in all of scripture saying that the 1Cor 12 gifts are just for "writing the Bible".
Bob Ryan:
There is no text in all of scripture saying that when the NT letters are canonized - the spiritual gift of prophecy will end.
Instead of that we have Eph 4:4-10 telling us that the spiritual gifts continue until the 2nd coming.
And "proof by name calling" is not a form of Acts 17:11 "Sola scriptura" testing of doctirne. (Though I have found some people that suppose that the dark ages model of "proof by name calling" is some sort of valid substitute for Bible evidence in favor of a given doctrine.)
in Christ,
Bob<<
GE:
... That now is how a straight challenge is answered the BobRyan SDA way.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by Gerhard Ebersoehn
What thing is 'Messianic Jews'? It's a contradiction in terms as in practice. You're a Christian or not a Christian; "There no longer are JEWS".
You make stuff up rather well GE. Nice.
But the text of scripture says "by contrast" - that Jesus responded to the Samaritan woman "You worship what You do not know - WE worship what WE know for salvation is of the JEWS".
I think you know that is what the text said in any case - perhaps you just wanted to try your hand and turn it another way.
Oh well...
in Christ,
Bob
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Do you hold that God ceased revealtion knowledge to us after the scripture canon was closed. or has he still ongoing revelations?
was the prophetess always 100 % accurate in her announcements, did she get extra biblical insight outside of what the bible has?
where does it say that a prophet is ONLY to a chosen remnant, if from god, woulding those revealtions be binding and for all Christians?
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
I hold that God told the truth in Eph 4:4-10
Eph 4
7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.
8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
For now we see through a glass darkly - but then face to face (2nd coming) -- 1Cor 13 -- "For we shall see Him as He is - we shall be like Him" 1John 3.
Thus it is the 2nd coming that is the event where all those gifts cease.
And God is telling the truth in 1Thess 5:19-20
19 Quench not the Spirit.
20 Despise not prophesyings.
And God is telling the truth in Isaiah 30
9 That this is a rebellious people, lying children, children that will not hear the law of the Lord:
10 Which say to the seers, See not; and to the prophets, Prophesy not unto us right things, speak unto us smooth things, prophesy deceits:
11 Get you out of the way, turn aside out of the path, cause the Holy One of Israel to cease from before us.
There is no text in all of scripture that says that prophets only get messages from God by reading the Bible.
I think we all agree on that point.
"To him that knows to do right and does it not - to him it is sin" James 4:17.
The Jews were held accountable for not accepting the Christ - the Messiah that their scriptures told them about. They were not held accountable for not reading the book of Revelation and accepting it - since they would first have to accept the Messiah to get there.
Even SDAs themselves do not hold fellow SDAs accountable to what God told the Seventh-day Adventist church by a prophet named "Ellen White" - before that SDA has had time to first study through the entire set of Bible doctrines.
in Christ,
Bob
saturneptune
New Member
Never realized how dangerous SDA and charasmatic was until this rash of threads. They pass the RCC easily and are up there with the Mormons and JWs.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
I am good with "sola scriptura" as a way of proving/testing Bible doctrine.
But "sola name calling" I pretty much ignore.
In my prior post - I emphasize the point that those who claim "just give me the Bible" are ok as far as that goes. But for me I say "Give me the Bible AND the words IN the Bible" which include Eph 4:6-13, 1Thess 5:19-20, Isaiah 30:8-11 and so on.
in Christ,
Bob
But "sola name calling" I pretty much ignore.
In my prior post - I emphasize the point that those who claim "just give me the Bible" are ok as far as that goes. But for me I say "Give me the Bible AND the words IN the Bible" which include Eph 4:6-13, 1Thess 5:19-20, Isaiah 30:8-11 and so on.
in Christ,
Bob
Sola scriptura surely seems to preclude the need for latter day prophets/prophetesses. Not only do Joseph Smith, Mary Baker Glover Patterson Eddy, Judge Rutherford, Ellen G. White, Azuza St. adventures, etal, contradict each other they make serious departures from "the faith, once for all delivered unto the Saints", Jude 3. See also: "... going after teachers, having itching ears...". There are millions following the above.
False teachings to not hold up under "sola scriptura." It is a two-edged sword.
Now what?
Even so, come Lord Jesus.
Bro. James
False teachings to not hold up under "sola scriptura." It is a two-edged sword.
Now what?
Even so, come Lord Jesus.
Bro. James
God ceased giving prophets/prophetess to the church after death of John, and they in the SDA can claim that she ONLY spoke to their church from god, but the Lord would had given the prophetess to ALL the church, but cease she has been proven false, her teachings are NOT to be heeded either!
THAt is something BOTh cals and Non cals can agree with!
I make stuff up? If in this Word, "You worship what you do NOT KNOW - we worship what we KNOW FOR SALVATION of the Jews is", JESUS CHRIST is not that Salvation, the word of Jesus Christ is void and worthless. Jesus knew the Salvation of the Jews was HE. ‘Jews are saved by ME as are all nations—you, Samaritans, too!'
Alright, if that is made up, it is made up, but not by GE. But GE considers it a trustworthy Word of and about Jesus Christ Himself.
But you speak so typically SDA, Bob Ryan. All you see in the Scriptures is carnal Jewish law to the extent it for you becomes the test for sound hermeneutic.
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In 'African', we say for stuff like yours, 'Warra Warra!' which means, Noise Noise!