Seventh-Day Adventists

[bound]

You have to realize that the first 4 commandments (keep the Sabbath, have no idols, dont take the Lord's name in vain, etc) have to do with "Love to God" and the last 6 commandments (dont steal, dont kill, etc) have to do with "Love to your Neighbor"

LOVE Has ALWAYS been the foundation of the 10 commandments. Jesus wasnt stating anything new, He was bringing to light that which had bee forgotten by the people...

Mt:23:23: Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

Hi Claudia_T (sorry I missed the 'T' on my previous post I was not trying to be fresh.)

I don't think you'll get much of an argument from anyone here concerning 'Love always being the foundation' but I do believe that what I would say is that the law was meant to establish a society 'in love'. Unfortunately, the letter of the law became more important than the spirit of the law and 'the society in love' was lost.

I believe when we start to focus on the 'letter of the law' we begin to create a idol of the law and thus quickly loose sight of the 'spirit of the law' which is as the Apostle Paul stated so beautifully:

Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. - Romans 13:8

With regards to the Sabbath I believe I look at honoring God on the 'last day of every week' as the most important observance here not in a rigorist attempt to keep to calendars long past and full of errors. I mean honestly we can't be sure that today is really the Sabbath because of all the changes and old errors with calendars throughout history. It is thus a pious gesture which we extend to 'the last day of the week' which in this culture happens to be Sunday.

Of course, if one desired, as a pious gesture, to honor the Lord on Saturday I personally have no issue with such an act as long as it is done for the honor and glory of God. I say "More power to ya!" :thumbsup:

On the other hand, if one brother or sister sought to impose such a practice on everyone else I would be quick to point to the personal liberty we have been given in Christ to observe our own form of piety (be it dietary, calendar observance or anything else).

May God bring you grace and peace. Amen.

 

[FundamentalOnly!]

SDAs,


I was wondering if you beleive in Original Sin and reject OSAS?

 

[Claudia_T]

SDAs,


I was wondering if you beleive in Original Sin and reject OSAS?

Hi Fundamental,

we dont believe in Original Sin or Once Saved Always Saved... neither one

 

[Samuel Owen]

Here is a post made on another forum, not by me but someone else. This provides some rather interresting information about the SDA.

( They publish their own Bible and insert their own doctrines in the text.

Fulfilled: The Seventh-day Adventist Church publishes The Clear Word Bible. It is a cultic Bible that does not separate the Bible text from the author’s personal commentary, opinions, which slants the text to agree with the writings of Ellen G. White and whatever else to make the text say what he wants it to say. This corrupt piece of work, makes the Word of God unclear to the reader.

The SDA's NEVER quote the Ten Commandments from Deuteronomy, because of the following verse.

Deut. 5:3 The LORD made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day. KJV


Adventists teach that the Ten Commandments were not first given at Sinai, but were given to Adam and Eve before the fall of man, before sin began.


Now notice the same verse from the "SDA Bible".

Deut. 5:3 It wasn't only with our ancestors that He made a covenant , but with us and with all who are alive today.

Read those two verses again and notice the 180 degree difference. The REAL Bible says that the Lord did not make this covenant with our ancestors. The SDA bible clearly implies or states just the opposite. This leads to some questions.


Why did the Adventist's change the meaning to read the complete opposite of what ALL other Bibles read in Deut. 5:3? (look for yourself)


How many other verses in their "Bible" did they change, and if they do change others, why?


On closer inspection of the SDA bible we find literally hundreds of major changes to the real meaning of Scripture. From simple movement of commas, to out-and-out blasphemy, the SDA Bible is a real shame. Someone is going to pay a big price for tampering with God's word, and changing the meaning of Scripture. )

 

[Claudia_T]

Our own Bible? Now thats one thing I never heard of LOL! Oh come on Samuel, Ive never even heard of that!

 

[Claudia_T]

Samuel,

Look:



Sin is transgression of the Law.

1Jn:3:4: Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.​

How long has there been such a thing as sin?​

"He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil." 1 John 3:8.​

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times]





[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times]"For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;" 2 Peter 2:4. [/FONT]​

Now I ask you, how could there have been any sin if there was no law?​

Can there be sin where there is no law?​

​

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times]"Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression." Romans 4:15. [/FONT]​

How was the first death brought about?​

"And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him." Genesis 4:8.​

What was the difference between the characters of the two men?​

"Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous." 1 John 3:12.​

Did the Lord impute sin to Cain for taking the life of his brother?​

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times]

"If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door.​

[/FONT]


Ok so now you tell me, how could there be sin if there was no law?

 

[Claudia_T]

These anti-Adventist sites will twist everything we say all day long... you need to just go to our own official websites to get your information on what SDAs believe

 

[Claudia_T]

Samuel,

all this was before the 10 commandments given at Sinai...

Why did the Lord abhor the nations that occupied Canaan before Israel?​

"Ye shall therefore keep all my statutes, and all my judgments, and do them: that the land, whither I bring you to dwell therein, spue you not out. And ye shall not walk in the manners of the nation, which I cast out before you: for they committed all these things, and therefore I abhorred them." Leviticus 20:22,23.​

Why did God make His promise to the seed of Abraham?​

"Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws." Genesis 26:5.​

What will the children of Abraham do?​

"They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham." John 8:39.


when was the 7th day Sabbath originally given?


Genesis 2
1: Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
2: And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
3: And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.​

 

[Claudia_T]

**sigh**

I think I am going to quit saying stuff on this thread, this is too annoying to me

 

[bound]

**sigh**

I think I am going to quit saying stuff on this thread, this is too annoying to me

Hi Claudia_T,

I'm sorry you are getting annoyed but, to be frank, I would like to get a response from you concerning my post.

I'm willing to give you the benefit of a doubt if you just talk and don't flood me with really long posts of canned apologetics. Fair enough? :saint:

May God bring you grace and peace. Amen.

 

[Brother Bob]

we dont believe in Original Sin or Once Saved Always Saved... neither one

Claudia_T,
If you don't believe in Original then how did man fall?

 

[Ed Edwards]

Regarding a day to worship God, Bound says:
// It is thus a pious gesture which we extend to 'the last day of the week' which in this culture happens to be Sunday.//

Which culture might that be?
I note all my calendars (I've got 3 or 4 for 2007 coming up)
START each week with a Sunday.

Speaking of the first day of the week, wouldn't it
be better to call it Firstday instead of devoting it
to the Sun god? Or maybe better still 'Sonday'
for devotion to Messiah Jesus - Son of God.

[ edited to put a question mark (?) at the end of a question. ]

 

[Claudia_T]

True, in fact the number for the Sun and/or the Sun god in Astrology is 1... thus Sun-day is the first day of the week.

Dr. Edward T. Hiscox, author of The Baptist Manual, before a group of ministers, made this candid admission:

"There was and is a commandment to keep holy the Sabbath day, but that Sabbath day was not Sunday. It will be said, however, and with some show of triumph, that the Sabbath was transferred from the seventh to the first day of the week, with all its duties, privileges, and sanctions. Earnestly desiring information on this subject, which I have studied for many years, I ask, Where can the record of such a transaction be found? Not in the New Testament, absolutely not. There is no Scriptural evidence of the change of the Sabbath institution from the seventh to the first day of the week.

"Of course," he continues, "I quite well know that Sunday did come into use in early Christian history as a religious day, as we learn from the Christian fathers and other sources. But what a pity that it comes branded with the mark of Paganism, and christened with the name of the sun god, when adopted and sanctioned by the papal apostasy, and bequeathed as a sacred legacy to Protestantism!"-From a paper read before a New York Ministers' Conference, held Nov. 13, 1893.

 

[Claudia_T]

bound,

Okay let me just get all done being annoyed first though...

Claudia

 

[bound]

Regarding a day to worship God, Bound says:
// It is thus a pious gesture which we extend to 'the last day of the week' which in this culture happens to be Sunday.//

Which culture might that be?
I note all my calendars (I've got 3 or 4 for 2007 coming up)
START each week with a Sunday.

Ugh! :tongue3:

Can you tell I'm a workaholic? I would have bet my eye-teeth that Monday was the beginning of the new week.

I stand, humbly corrected.

Thank you Ed.

 

[Jerome]

When does a weekend end?

 

[BobRyan]

Samuel Owen:
"That only the 144,000 will actually go to Heaven (them of course), and the rest of us bums will only be allowed on the New Earth."

I consider myself a very lucky bum who will only be allowed on the New Earth, and I don't even have to be a SDA for that!

This just gets better and better!

Owen makes something up out of thin air - and GE goes for it hook line and sinker!!:laugh:

 

[BobRyan]

Gerhard,

Take up the details with Bob Ryan. He is much better at that than I am. I cannot understand what it is you are actually trying to say half the time.

Claudia

Actually I get lost when GE starts claiming that Adam sinned on Day Six and was tossed out of the Garden the very day he was made - then God "called it good" thus ending day 6 of creation week-- all BEFORE literal day 7 of creation week!

 

[BobRyan]

Sounds to me like somebody can't keep their organizations
straight. The 7 million world-wide Jehovah's Witnesses
believe only 144,000 of them will go to heaven.
So they have a contest as to who shall work the hardest
to get to heaven. But that isn't the SDA.

Agreed - someone on this thread keeps trying to insert JW doctrine into the SDA teachings AS IF SDAs teach it --

 

[BobRyan]

Don't let him get behind you with a shovel in his hand!

Got an uncle who thought one of his turkeys was dead in the turkey lot so he took a hoe to bury him. When he climbed up the hill to the turkey lot the turkey was running around completely alive! My uncle knocked him in the head with the hoe and said " I came here to bury you and I am going to bury you".

Turkeys are always getting a bum deal if you ask me.