Wow, how long was he overseas?
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Should pastors be required to know original Biblical languages?
- Thread starter Yeshua1
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a year....
Ok. I thought they all required a yr of one and a semester of the other
Thanks
Thanks
Required by whom? God? Apparently he did not, based on 1 Timothy 3 and Titus 1. By churches? Why should they, if God did not? Educational institutions? They can set there degree plans as they wish, but do not lord over what churches can or do require in pastors.
The best pastors I know have never set foot in a seminary. The worst ones I personally know have "Dr." in front of their name. One of them confided in me that before Seminary, he was a country preacher who loved God and loved to win souls. After seminary, he was a worthless pastor who loved nothing but knowledge and debate.
Should those who study theology and church history be required to know German?
I actually did use German studying theology, but I do not know it well (just enough to struggle through). And I love kartoffelklöße. So it is nice being able to order 'em.
And French.
So much of John Calvin’s output is still unavailable in English, having yet to be translated, after hundreds of years. Sad, isn't it?
books.google.com/books?id=sGHKcZI3XAMC&pg=PA2
“To anyone lacking Latin or Renaissance French, much of the writings of John Calvin must remain inaccessible....many of his...sermons, letters, tracts, polemics, writings on liturgy and church regulations—are not.”
I'll go further, any teacher of the Word in a local congregation or in an official capacity must be able to engage the original languages in a productive way. At least considering how easy it is to get books and information on the bible and languages in our time.
Ever since I switched to NASB, Mounce Interlinear, use of Concordance, and use of biblical dictionaries of the New and Old Testament. I feel that the bible makes so much more sense.
Understanding Textual Criticism, but in no way Higher Criticism, helped too. I still need to engage more commentaries, get the biblical world better, know hermeneutics better, and learn true exegesis from the original languages, and I feel all of that is important if I want to be an able teacher of the Word in my local congregation one day.
Based on what?
I think this misses the bigger picture. The bishop must be apt to teach, but what is the teacher of the Word in the local congregation supposed to be teaching? To be language scholars? To quibble over minute disagreements about words? Perhaps Titus 2 will give the bigger picture, which might be summed up as teaching that we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in this present world. I wonder if we might judge what we need by the extent it helps us help others learn more about God and godliness?
[This is not a repudiation of language study, which is and can be well and good to the extent it helps us enlighten, exhort, and edify the saints. I have seen much that does not.]
Let me give you an idea of where I am coming from. I and many Christian friends were in evil churches that twisted and warped the Word of God to make it say things it doesn't. Christians face a hostile culture trying to brain wash us and all children. We face many grave mutilations of the scriptures from the Charismatics, feminists, LGBTQ, liberal Christians, Roman Catholic Church, social justice, pop psychology, and so much more.
That in mind, my biggest concern is to have teachers that rightly interpret the scriptures against a cacophony of critics, even in our congregations. Teachers of the Word nowadays must be authoritative instructors, well versed in the Word, able to correct and rebuke, and careful explainers of the Word and its teachings. This has apparently been true even in the days of the apostles, given 2 Timothy 4:2-4.
2 Timothy 4:2-4
2Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and encourage with every form of patient instruction.3For the time will come when men will not tolerate sound doctrine, but with itching ears they will gather around themselves teachers to suit their own desires. 4So they will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.
I'll echo rlvaughn, the local church chooses, which effectively closes the conversation.
Now, as far as languages go, I would reckon that a "familiarity" with the original languages is a good tool to have in the toolbox. More than that is great, but with the books and software available today, I wouldn't want to be adding onerous requirements when time might be better spent otherwise. The last 2 churches I've belonged to called men without seminary training, and helped them to pursue the standard education later.
That seems to me to be a good model. You can send a faithful servant to school, but sending someone to school doesn't necessarily make them a faithful servant.
Now, as far as languages go, I would reckon that a "familiarity" with the original languages is a good tool to have in the toolbox. More than that is great, but with the books and software available today, I wouldn't want to be adding onerous requirements when time might be better spent otherwise. The last 2 churches I've belonged to called men without seminary training, and helped them to pursue the standard education later.
That seems to me to be a good model. You can send a faithful servant to school, but sending someone to school doesn't necessarily make them a faithful servant.
A working familiarity with the Original Languages is a priceless tool to have in the box for pastors.
One thing I believe the Church is lacking is a focus on pastors as iheologians. Pastors need to be educated. The local church is the pillar and ground of the truth, not a popular commentator or even Logos Bible Software (which I use and love).
One problem with simply suggesting that the amount of resources such as commentaries etc. available remove the need for language training is that pastors will not have the wherewithal to be able to discern bunk from quality. What will occur is that popular and unaccountable non-pastors will be the go-to for biblical questions and exegesis. Local Churches will become effectively taught by Academia instead of the men God actually called to teach them.....their pastors.
It is obvious in Christendom that Original language knowledge can and is abused. But it's abuse is not relegated solely to those with a mere cursory knowledge of the language. It is also abused by experts or by perceived experts. I, like many with formal training, have just enough knowledge to be dangerous, but am no expert. But that same training has given me the ability to sniff out a lot of bunk as well. MANY times commentators and Theologians try to effectively rewrite a Biblical text by removing it from your English Bible and telling the unsuspecting that what the text really says is_____________.
If pastors do not have the ability to see when a commentator is abusing original languages, then they are simply repeating to their flocks what the "experts" have said. Paul's comments to Timothy about studying the text diligently as a workman which need not be ashamed is in the context of his role as a pastor or teacher.....
2 Ti 2:15 - Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
IS NOT a general encouragement for all Christians. Although I would say all Christians should study diligently. Paul's larger concern in context was for Timothy to protect the flock from heresy, bad teaching etc.... Paul had a preacher-boy and his role as a teacher in mind when he wrote this......to Timothy incidentally, not you or me.
If pastors are not the well-prepared, knowledgeable well-schooled persons the flock can look to for sound exegesis than Christendom is enslaved to a small (and incestuous) cadre of an Academic elite, a Papacy of the popular or well-connected. They will teach your congregation instead of the pastors God called for the task..... through a medium....the unarmed and poorly educated pastors. This does not mean that pastors must have tons of letters behind their name, nor does it mean that offering education to him after a prospective call isn't a viable option as well.
One thing I believe the Church is lacking is a focus on pastors as iheologians. Pastors need to be educated. The local church is the pillar and ground of the truth, not a popular commentator or even Logos Bible Software (which I use and love).
One problem with simply suggesting that the amount of resources such as commentaries etc. available remove the need for language training is that pastors will not have the wherewithal to be able to discern bunk from quality. What will occur is that popular and unaccountable non-pastors will be the go-to for biblical questions and exegesis. Local Churches will become effectively taught by Academia instead of the men God actually called to teach them.....their pastors.
It is obvious in Christendom that Original language knowledge can and is abused. But it's abuse is not relegated solely to those with a mere cursory knowledge of the language. It is also abused by experts or by perceived experts. I, like many with formal training, have just enough knowledge to be dangerous, but am no expert. But that same training has given me the ability to sniff out a lot of bunk as well. MANY times commentators and Theologians try to effectively rewrite a Biblical text by removing it from your English Bible and telling the unsuspecting that what the text really says is_____________.
If pastors do not have the ability to see when a commentator is abusing original languages, then they are simply repeating to their flocks what the "experts" have said. Paul's comments to Timothy about studying the text diligently as a workman which need not be ashamed is in the context of his role as a pastor or teacher.....
2 Ti 2:15 - Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
IS NOT a general encouragement for all Christians. Although I would say all Christians should study diligently. Paul's larger concern in context was for Timothy to protect the flock from heresy, bad teaching etc.... Paul had a preacher-boy and his role as a teacher in mind when he wrote this......to Timothy incidentally, not you or me.
If pastors are not the well-prepared, knowledgeable well-schooled persons the flock can look to for sound exegesis than Christendom is enslaved to a small (and incestuous) cadre of an Academic elite, a Papacy of the popular or well-connected. They will teach your congregation instead of the pastors God called for the task..... through a medium....the unarmed and poorly educated pastors. This does not mean that pastors must have tons of letters behind their name, nor does it mean that offering education to him after a prospective call isn't a viable option as well.
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1689Dave
Well-Known Member
How many think in the original languages without translating them into their native tongue on the fly? I think teachers should know doctrine so they know how to translate within the wide area of meaning presented in Greek word definitions. More So than being able to think Greek.
In your case you must be able to read and understand the English language.
Your pastor reads from the NIV2011 in the pulpit.
37818
Well-Known Member
As good as that can be, it is no guarantee.
Someone with 4 classes in Greek is going to do a better job?
Teams of true expert translators give us our Bibles. You can take what is equal to an elementary knowledge of Greek and do better than they did?
I get so annoyed by the crowd who insists on higher degrees.
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