Should women be allowed to baptize?

[annsni]

It does occur to me that in some cases it may be best if a woman were to baptize another woman simply for modesty's sake. I know we always, and repeatedly, tell people to wear clothes that will not be see through when they get wet but...well, the admonish gets ignored way to often. It would be good to have the means in place to protect the modesty of the woman.

At the church we visited they had black t-shirts to give to those being baptized and it had the church logo on the front and on the back it said....shoot...I'll have to ask my husband to be sure but I think it said "Transformed" or something like that. I thought that was a great idea!! They then get to keep the t-shirt.

 

[LillyoftheValley]

Thank you annsni
not only do I feel this thread has finally gotten back on track, but there are some great posts for me to think about.

This whole thing started because my sister (who has been raised Presbyterian) has started to take a look at baptism on her own instead of blindly accepting what she has been taught all of her life, and feels that what she has been told all along is wrong. If she does get baptized either our pastor or my husband will be the likely one to do the job (she and I both feel that I should not), but it got me thinking... even though I never would - is there anything Biblically wrong with women baptizing (specifically other women).

 

[HeirofSalvation]

I guess in certain situations she can baptize men too but I'd hope that there would be a godly man who could do that.

Thank you Ann.... for your posts....I tend to agree with this sentiment...but why?....... I guess it has to do really with the whole of revealed Scripture, but....why do we feel this way???? Something says.... absolutely...find a Godly man... and yet something says.... dunno why... just dunno...have a man do it... Thank you for your insight

 

[revmwc]

As I said in a post the word, diakonostranslated as "servant" is the same word, diakonos that is translated as "deacon" over 20 times in the New Testament. Remember the translators were men and many allowed their bias against women to show in the translation. The weight of evidence in the translation of this word in so many other places indicates very strongly that Phoebe was a deacon.

As long as it is applied within it's context as a servant and not a leader then there is no problem. The problem comes when one tries to say as a deacon she had SPIRITUAL AUTHORITY over men. No deacon (Servant) has any spiritual authority in that context. Where we run into problems is trying to apply a spiritual leadership context to the word.

 

[annsni]

Thank you Ann.... for your posts....I tend to agree with this sentiment...but why?....... I guess it has to do really with the whole of revealed Scripture, but....why do we feel this way???? Something says.... absolutely...find a Godly man... and yet something says.... dunno why... just dunno...have a man do it... Thank you for your insight

See, I do believe that there is a special calling for men to be pastors (not women) and that as such, there is something about a man in leadership doing the baptizing. I was baptized by a man. My husband was baptized by a man and all of my children have been baptized by men - the youngest two being baptized by their dad!! But in some cases, I think it is more appropriate for a woman to baptize a woman because of modesty/lack of availability/fear on the part of the baptizee (LOL).

 

[seekingthetruth]

See, I do believe that there is a special calling for men to be pastors (not women) and that as such, there is something about a man in leadership doing the baptizing. I was baptized by a man. My husband was baptized by a man and all of my children have been baptized by men - the youngest two being baptized by their dad!! But in some cases, I think it is more appropriate for a woman to baptize a woman because of modesty/lack of availability/fear on the part of the baptizee (LOL).

I have to agree with Ann here on this. Many women go into women's prisons where men cant go and teach the gospel to women.

Preaching the gospel is not the same as being a pastor. The Bible doesnt prohibit a woman from being a teacher, only a pastor...and there is a huge difference

John

 

[Michael Wrenn]

Oh, call me Sally? I am actually not offended... not in the least.... many on this board could hurt my feelings...quite easy to do when one attempts to insult my "manhood" so to speak .... you simply are incapable of it, despite how otherwise (as a former U.S. Marine Corps anti-terrorism expert) sensitive I actually am about that. I am sorry :tear:



I am directly refering to an article YOU posted about the topic you are introducing into this thread about the role of women in the Church.... the author's article actually (are you familiar with it??) You posted it.... tried to equivocate Male headship with that of the headwaters of a river..... I know he was reaching when he did it....

So....Before you get your thong in a wad......Lilly is trying to call out everyone who is trying to make this thread about something it isn't, and, had you simply read and complied with her legit request in her OP....This conversation would not even be possible....Go start yourself yet one more "Women should be preachers" post and leave her alone. She wants the opinions of people who see things as she does....what is so wrong with that??

Your objection is vaguely akin to this....
I know I stole a pack of gum from the store... but Tommy did too...so make sure you punish him also........:tear::tear:

Okay, Sally, see if you can comprehend this: Since Valley and you want to call me by my last name, I was returning the favor, and since I don't know your last name , I used a form of your made up identity.

Other point: If Valley is trying to call out everyone, as you assert, why did she single me out specifically?

Got it now? Maybe you can comprehend that, in spite of your expert military training.

 

[Michael Wrenn]

Does da widdle girl scare you????:tear::tear:

All you got are insults, huh?

I'd like to meet you in person and see how tough you are. You know my real name and address. What is yours? Care to answer, military man?

What are you afraid of?

Come on down and have a drink with me and show me how bad you are. :laugh:

 

[Michael Wrenn]

I could understand why you would say that since we hold to the same view of thinking, but you are wrong. HoS is my husband. If there is anyway I can prove this to you, then shoot let me know, otherwise I would appreciate you not continuing this line of thinking in that it is false.

Well, well. That is hilarious. :laugh:

So, kyredneck is right after all. LOL

Does hubby have to get your permission before he can insult me, or does he do that all on his own?

 

[HeirofSalvation]

Okay, Sally, see if you can comprehend this: Since Valley and you want to call me by my last name, I was returning the favor, and since I don't know your last name , I used a form of your made up identity.

O.K. again..... this is simply not a thread that was designed for you...or anyone of your persuasion about particular topics.... I am NOT trying to out-macho you in any way, I concede.....You are by far the better physical specimen... I know this.......You believe women should be ordained as ministers...... Lilly specifically asked in her OP only those who do not believe this to respond you elected to interject yourself in this thread

I am a sissy who is physically threatened by your masuline superiority... thus.... in mercy...willl you simply not hurt me and not respond to threads where you are NOT (by definition) invited to respond?? She wants the opinion of people who share some of her premeses....she called YOU out by name for one reason and it is this:

Prior to her creating the thread I told her, in so many words....you are going to open a can of worms with the "Women should be ordained" crowd...I told her that there was a particular "Michael Wrenn" who would inevitably show up (un-invited) and post on this thread that you are trying to intentionally exclude him from, at the start....you can add nothing to the conversation... you can in no way help her....you showed up...as I predicted.... she asked that ONLY those who shared her premesis respond..... but...... Michael Wrenn has to hear himself talk...just start another thread any leave my wife's poingnant, pointed andchallenging question alone.

I am physically, emotionally, and intellectually threatened by you...and I acknowledge you as my superior in all ways....

 

[Michael Wrenn]

O.K. again..... this is simply not a thread that was designed for you...or anyone of your persuasion about particular topics.... I am NOT trying to out-macho you in any way, I concede.....You are by far the better physical specimen... I know this.......You believe women should be ordained as ministers...... Lilly specifically asked in her OP only those who do not believe this to respond you elected to interject yourself in this thread

I am a sissy who is physically threatened by your masuline superiority... thus.... in mercy...willl you simply not hurt me and not respond to threads where you are NOT (by definition) invited to respond?? She wants the opinion of people who share some of her premeses....she called YOU out by name for one reason and it is this:

Prior to her creating the thread I told her, in so many words....you are going to open a can of worms with the "Women should be ordained" crowd...I told her that there was a particular "Michael Wrenn" who would inevitably show up (un-invited) and post on this thread that you are trying to intentionally exclude him from, at the start....you can add nothing to the conversation... you can in no way help her....you showed up...as I predicted.... she asked that ONLY those who shared her premesis respond..... but...... Michael Wrenn has to hear himself talk...just start another thread any leave my wife's poingnant, pointed andchallenging question alone.

I am physically, emotionally, and intellectually threatened by you...and I acknowledge you as my superior in all ways....

I only posted after I saw everyone else doing so and no one objected.

Come on, brave boy; tell us who you really are and where you live. Don't hide behind a computer, if you are all you claim to be. You started this.

 

[HeirofSalvation]

I only posted after I saw everyone else doing so and no one objected.

Come on, brave boy; tell us who you really are and where you live. Don't hide behind a computer, if you are all you claim to be. You started this.

I tried to convey to you in my last post that I physically fear you and your prowess as a fighter...I prefer to Hide behind my computer. You have called me out by name... and I have failed to answer....out of fear....your honor is preserved and mine is compromised....I stand ashamed. If it is a duel you challenged me to, I am too much of a coward to meet you....by default, score 1 for you,

did I not say this:

I am physically, emotionally, and intellectually threatened by you...and I acknowledge you as my superior in all ways....

 

[Michael Wrenn]

I tried to convey to you in my last post that I physically fear you and your prowess as a fighter...I prefer to Hide behind my computer. You have called me out by name... and I have failed to answer....out of fear....your honor is preserved and mine is compromised....I stand ashamed. If it is a duel you challenged me to, I am too much of a coward to meet you....by default, score 1 for you,

did I not say this:

Fighting? Nah, just a battle of wits, and in person.

But one who is going to engage in insults, name-calling, and dishonesty should have the courage to reveal their identity. You don't.

 

[HeirofSalvation]

I seriously don't know what you mean Michael, about identity??? Where they live, who they are, I am simply not as computer savvy as you are....really...what am I missing?? I do not know your last name...I only know"Michael Wrenn" I simply don't know whether that is your "actual" name or not.....Do I know where you live???? No, I actually don't. Is there some form of internet decorum I am unaware of??? Consider: I have actualy not even had internet access for about the last 3 years...you make too many assumptions...and I was a computer illiterate then too!!!
I honestly do not get all of this.... and I concede that I will with no reservation.... LOSE any battle of wits you challenge me to...Again, you call my bluff...and I fail to deliver...You win.

 

[Michael Wrenn]

I seriously don't know what you mean Michael, about identity??? Where they live, who they are, I am simply not as computer savvy as you are....really...what am I missing?? I do not know your last name...I only know"Michael Wrenn" I simply don't know whether that is your "actual" name or not.....Do I know where you live???? No, I actually don't. Is there some form of internet decorum I am unaware of??? Consider: I have actualy not even had internet access for about the last 3 years...you make too many assumptions...and I was a computer illiterate then too!!!
I honestly do not get all of this.... and I concede that I will with no reservation.... LOSE any battle of wits you challenge me to...Again, you call my bluff...and I fail to deliver...You win.

You know my real name and where I live. My identity and location are there for everyone to see. Can't say the same for you.

 

[HeirofSalvation]

You know my real name and where I live. My identity and location are there for everyone to see. Can't say the same for you.

O.K. probably on the public profile somewhere....I have not looked at it, and would not actually know how to change it unless I tried....didn't actually think one could...I am sorry....I am more computer illiterate than you think...whatever scenario is playing out in your head.....I am simply incapable of responding in like kind....Is there a "User profile" that you have released more info on than I have? Is that what you are driving at?.....I honestly don't know, and as far as I know your name is "Michael Wrenn" and you live....somewhere....I have no idea where...I am not going to ask you where you live....I think if you wanted to tell me, you would have.

 

[Michael Wrenn]

O.K. probably on the public profile somewhere....I have not looked at it, and would not actually know how to change it unless I tried....didn't actually think one could...I am sorry....I am more computer illiterate than you think...whatever scenario is playing out in your head.....I am simply incapable of responding in like kind....Is there a "User profile" that you have released more info on than I have? Is that what you are driving at?.....I honestly don't know, and as far as I know your name is "Michael Wrenn" and you live....somewhere....I have no idea where...I am not going to ask you where you live....I think if you wanted to tell me, you would have.

Can you see across from my name on the right-hand side where it says "Location: Charleston, MS"

Anyway, you are derailing your wife's thread by continuing to respond to me. You shouldn't be doing what you accused me of, now should you?