Silly translation.

[37818]

The Greek, ανδρες αδελφοι, men brethern. Since "men brethern" in English are redundant, then simply translating those two words as "brethern" makes good sense.

In the book of Acts those two Greek words occur 14 times together.

In the KJV, Acts of the Apostles 1:16, "Men and brethren, this scripture must needs have been fulfilled, which the Holy Ghost by the mouth of David spake before concerning Judas, which was guide to them that took Jesus."

Now the first word ανδρες alway is addressing men, never women.

The Christian Standard Bible does this, '"Brothers and sisters, it was necessary that the Scripture be fulfilled that the Holy Spirit through the mouth of David foretold about Judas, who became a guide to those who arrested Jesus. . . ."'
Effectively calling men, ανδρες, "and sinters."

The CSB does this 6 times out 14 in the book of Acts.
The question then does the NASB 2020 edition do the same sillyness?

 

[McCree79]

I believe ἀδελφοί can certainly mean "siblings"/ "brothers and sisters" in certain contexts. But Peter's words ἄνδρες ἀδελφοί remove such possibility. Peter makes it clear he is speaking to only the men by adding ἄνδρες before ἀδελφοί.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

 

[Ziggy]

Rhetorically, it would be quite proper to begin an address to males with "Men" and then delimit it to those who were also "Brethren". In this sense, *both* terms were necessary, and the oft-recurring phrase in Acts should neither be reduced to only "Brethren", and definitely not to "Brothers and sisters."

 

[Deacon]

"This phrase represents a type of formal address found in first-century synagogues [EBC]. The expression ‘men, brothers’ is using the word ‘men’ in a general sense that does not exclude women, so it is usually best left untranslated. The term ‘brothers’ can also cause difficulties in languages in which the term for ‘brother’ is not generalized. Often the terms ‘relatives, kinsmen’ or ‘companions’ must be used for a term that can include women [TH]. Similar to verse 15, the ‘brothers’ here refers to ‘followers of Jesus Christ’, ‘fellow believers’, including men and women, and it may have to be translated ‘brothers and sisters’. The term ‘Christians’ should not be used until after Acts 11:26 [TRT].
An Exegetical Summary of Acts 1-14
Belinda Cheng and Robert Stutzman, 2017

"My brothers translates the expression “men brothers.” Since in this phrase the word “men” is used in a general sense and does not exclude women, it is best left untranslated (see also fellow Jews, literally “men Jews,” 2:14; men of Israel, literally “men Israelites,” 2:22; and brothers, literally “men brothers,” 2:29).
An expression such as my brothers may cause considerable difficulty in languages in which a term for “brother” is not generalized. In these instances one can often generalize a term for “relative,” kinsman,” or “companion.” This must, of course, be a term which can include women."
Handbook on the Acts of the Apostles,
Barclay M. Newman, 1972, UBS


"If the address “brothers” (ἀδελφοί) refers to the entire community of followers of Jesus, which is likely, the women of v. 14 are included (thus the translation “brothers and sisters”). Peter uses the common mode of address in Greek speeches: the word ἄνδρες (“men”) is combined with another noun in apposition, such as ἀδελφοί (“brothers”), Ἰουδαῖοι (“Judeans, Jews”), Ἰσραηλῖται (“Israelites”), Γαλιλαῖοι (“Galileans”), Ἀθηναῖοι (“Athenians”), Ἐφέσιοι (“Ephesians”). When Jews address fellow Jews as “brothers,” they express the conviction that they are all descendants of Abraham and thus belong to the same “family” of people. In Acts, the term “brothers” is often used for fellow Christians, both male and female, expressing the conviction that they belong to the one family of God’s reconstituted people."
Zondervan Exegetical Commentary on the New Testament, Eckhard J. Schnabel, 2012.

 

[37818]

Rhetorically, it would be quite proper to begin an address to males with "Men" and then delimit it to those who were also "Brethren". In this sense, *both* terms were necessary, and the oft-recurring phrase in Acts should neither be reduced to only "Brethren", and definitely not to "Brothers and sisters."

Maybe. Two things to note. These two Greek words together in the NT is only done in the book of Acts. And of the 14 times it is done the CSB translates it only 6 times as "brothers and sisters." I strongly believe those 6 times are a mistake.

 

[37818]

"This phrase represents a type of formal address found in first-century synagogues [EBC]. The expression ‘men, brothers’ is using the word ‘men’ in a general sense that does not exclude women, so it is usually best left untranslated. The term ‘brothers’ can also cause difficulties in languages in which the term for ‘brother’ is not generalized. Often the terms ‘relatives, kinsmen’ or ‘companions’ must be used for a term that can include women [TH]. Similar to verse 15, the ‘brothers’ here refers to ‘followers of Jesus Christ’, ‘fellow believers’, including men and women, and it may have to be translated ‘brothers and sisters’. The term ‘Christians’ should not be used until after Acts 11:26 [TRT].
An Exegetical Summary of Acts 1-14
Belinda Cheng and Robert Stutzman, 2017

"My brothers translates the expression “men brothers.” Since in this phrase the word “men” is used in a general sense and does not exclude women, it is best left untranslated (see also fellow Jews, literally “men Jews,” 2:14; men of Israel, literally “men Israelites,” 2:22; and brothers, literally “men brothers,” 2:29).
An expression such as my brothers may cause considerable difficulty in languages in which a term for “brother” is not generalized. In these instances one can often generalize a term for “relative,” kinsman,” or “companion.” This must, of course, be a term which can include women."
Handbook on the Acts of the Apostles,
Barclay M. Newman, 1972, UBS


"If the address “brothers” (ἀδελφοί) refers to the entire community of followers of Jesus, which is likely, the women of v. 14 are included (thus the translation “brothers and sisters”). Peter uses the common mode of address in Greek speeches: the word ἄνδρες (“men”) is combined with another noun in apposition, such as ἀδελφοί (“brothers”), Ἰουδαῖοι (“Judeans, Jews”), Ἰσραηλῖται (“Israelites”), Γαλιλαῖοι (“Galileans”), Ἀθηναῖοι (“Athenians”), Ἐφέσιοι (“Ephesians”). When Jews address fellow Jews as “brothers,” they express the conviction that they are all descendants of Abraham and thus belong to the same “family” of people. In Acts, the term “brothers” is often used for fellow Christians, both male and female, expressing the conviction that they belong to the one family of God’s reconstituted people."
Zondervan Exegetical Commentary on the New Testament, Eckhard J. Schnabel, 2012.

The fact is that two word Greek phrase in the NT is only found in the book of Acts. The CSB translators did not use "and sisters" 8 times out of the 14 uses because the context could not allow it.

 

[Deacon]

The fact is that two word Greek phrase in the NT is only found in the book of Acts. The CSB translators did not use "and sisters" 8 times out of the 14 uses because the context could not allow it.

CONTEXT – underlined

PHRASE - Ἄνδρες ἀδελφοί (bolded)

Acts 1:14–15 (CSB)
They all were continually united in prayer, along with the women, including Mary the mother of Jesus, and his brothers.
In those days Peter stood up among the brothers and sisters—the number of people who were together was about a hundred twenty—and said,


Acts 2:17–29 (CSB)
17And it will be in the last days, says God, that I will pour out my Spirit on all people; then your sons and your daughters will prophesy, your young men will see visions, and your old men will dream dreams.
18I will even pour out my Spirit on my servants in those days, both men and women and they will prophesy.

21Then everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.
22“Fellow Israelites, listen to these words: This Jesus of Nazareth was a man attested to you by God with miracles, wonders, and signs that God did among you through him, just as you yourselves know.

29“Brothers and sisters, I can confidently speak to you about the patriarch David: He is both dead and buried, and his tomb is with us to this day.


Acts 2:37 (CSB)
When they heard this, they were pierced to the heart and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Brothers, what should we do?”


Acts 6:15–7:2 (CSB)
15And all who were sitting in the Sanhedrin looked intently at him and saw that his face was like the face of an angel.

2“Brothers and fathers,” he replied, “listen: The God of glory appeared to our father Abraham when he was in Mesopotamia, before he settled in Haran,



Shall I continue with all the instances of the phrase's use and why the CSB translates it as it does?

Rob

 

[Ziggy]

Only recently has ανήρ been considered anything except specifically male (unlike άνθρωπος, which can readily have a generic aspect). Even until the latest BDAG, no lexicon attempted to redefine ανήρ as supposedly (and only extremely rarely!) having an inclusive sense.

The current trends since the 70s are more in line with trying to promote social equality than anything else.

 

[rlvaughn]

These two Greek words together in the NT is only done in the book of Acts. And of the 14 times it is done...

Which fourteen verses did you get? Searching in the KJV, where the phrase is translated "men and brethren," I only got 13. Thanks.

Acts 1:16
Acts 2:29
Acts 2:37
Acts 7:2 (Men, brethren, and fathers)
Acts 13:15
Acts 13:26
Acts 13:38
Acts 15:7
Acts 15:13
Acts 22:1 (Men, brethren, and fathers)
Acts 23:1
Acts 23:6
Acts 28:17

 

[rlvaughn]

Which fourteen verses did you get? Searching in the KJV, where the phrase is translated "men and brethren," I only got 13. Thanks.

Remembered where I could do a quick search for ανδρες αδελφοι and found it is Acts 7:26. I think the reason for the different translation there will be obvious. Thanks.

 

[37818]

Acts 1:14–15 (CSB)
They all were continually united in prayer, along with the women, including Mary the mother of Jesus, and his brothers.
In those days Peter stood up among the brothers and sisters—the number of people who were together was about a hundred twenty—and said,

That interpretation understandable.
Two things that I see.
Acts of the Apostles 1:14-15, ". . .
These all continued with one accord in prayer and supplication, with the women, and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brethren. And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples, and said, (the number of names together were about an hundred and twenty,) . . . ." Between v14 and v.15 the conjuction is also a speparater. And v,15 the common Greek (97%) text has "the disciples" not "brothers." (3%) And v.16 is a continuation of v.15. There are gounds for disageemen.
Otherwise I agree, you made some excilent arguments. Thanks.

Again, the CSB translators did not use "and sisters" in 8 of the 14 places do to context.

 

[37818]

Which fourteen verses did you get? Searching in the KJV, where the phrase is translated "men and brethren," I only got 13. Thanks.

Acts 1:16
Acts 2:29
Acts 2:37
Acts 7:2 (Men, brethren, and fathers)
Acts 13:15
Acts 13:26
Acts 13:38
Acts 15:7
Acts 15:13
Acts 22:1 (Men, brethren, and fathers)
Acts 23:1
Acts 23:6
Acts 28:17

The 6 places where "and sisters" is added,
Acts 1:16
Acts 2:29
Acts 13:26
Acts 13:38
Acts 15:7
Acts 15:13
The 8 places where in CSB it is only translated "brothers" do to context.
Acts 2:37
Acts 7:2
Acts 7:26
Acts 13:15
Acts 22:1
Acts 23:1
Acts 23:6
Acts 28:17

 

[Van]

It seems to me to be a formal or pro-forma way of addressing a group. Acts of the Apostles 13:26 points to the idea that "brothers" refers to those whose blood line goes back to Abraham, Jews rather than born anew believers. I do not see evidence that the term is necessarily limited to male members of the crowd, except in Acts 13:15 where in all likelihood only males "selected" the deacons. The females of course were free to voice their views to their male family members.

Clearly Acts 13:38 refers to both male and female Jews as salvation for all is in view. Therefore, I think the phrase "men brothers" could be translated "people, Hebrews." And when the speaker wanted to limit the group being addressed or requested to take action, they could says "People, Hebrews, fathers."

 

[37818]

Clearly Acts 13:38 refers to both male and female Jews as salvation for all is in view.

Your argument here gave me reason to look at this closely. While what you argued is generally true, the Apostle Paul from verse 16 to 38 is addressing men in the synagogue, verse 15, where the context the CSB translators use only "brothers."

 

[Van]

Your argument here gave me reason to look at this closely. While what you argued is generally true, the Apostle Paul from verse 16 to 38 is addressing men in the synagogue, verse 15, where the context the CSB translators use only "brothers."

Acts 13:16 could be translated, People, Israelite,... so exclusively men is not necessitated.
Acts 13:17 is obviously not limited to men....
Acts 13:18 refers to both the men and women who wandered in the wilderness....
Acts 13:19 again refers to the benefits bestowed upon the men and women who entered the promised land.

Basically, I do not find that Paul was addressing just men. For example, verse 24 refers to people...

However, thank you for this thread, as sharing the results of our studies is an important factor in the life of the church.

 

[37818]

Acts 13:16 could be translated, People, Israelite,... so exclusively men is not necessitated.

I strongly disagree.
On Acts 1:16, "Men brethers . . . ." Textual critic Wilbur N. Pickering,
'The term used here refers exclusively to males—so also in 1:21, 2:5, 2:14, 2:22, 2:29, 2:37, 3:12.'

 

[Van]

I strongly disagree.
On Acts 1:16, "Men brethers . . . ." Textual critic Wilbur N. Pickering,
'The term used here refers exclusively to males—so also in 1:21, 2:5, 2:14, 2:22, 2:29, 2:37, 3:12.'

Yes, lets leave it we strongly disagree.

 

[John of Japan]

Maybe. Two things to note. These two Greek words together in the NT is only done in the book of Acts. And of the 14 times it is done the CSB translates it only 6 times as "brothers and sisters." I strongly believe those 6 times are a mistake.

I agree. To translate as "brothers and sisters" is anachronistic. It is an attempt to read 21st century values back into the first century. It's as if I were to translate "bullwhip," a strictly modern invention, for the Hebrew word שׁוט (shôṭ) in

The same for the rendering of just "brothers" for the idiom. To take the perceived redundancy out is to interpret the Greek language by English standards. I would definitely keep the redundancy in, translating "Men and Brothers."

 

[Van]

Trying to remove paternalistic bias in translation is a worthy goal. Men can mean males, or be a generic reference to people. Brothers, can refer to male members of a person's family, or to members of ethnic group, Jews or Hebrews, or to born anew siblings in Christ.

1) What is Peter's audience, those in the upper room, made up of both males and females?
2) When asking the group to make a selection, because of the culture of that day, only the males voted. But females expressed their views within their individual families.

Acts 1:16 could be rendered: People, Hebrews, ....

"Brethren, sons of Abraham's family, and those among you who fear God, to us the message of this salvation has been sent. (Acts 13:26)

 

[John of Japan]

Maybe. Two things to note. These two Greek words together in the NT is only done in the book of Acts. And of the 14 times it is done the CSB translates it only 6 times as "brothers and sisters." I strongly believe those 6 times are a mistake.

I just took a look, and of course you are right that this phrase/idiom only occurs in Acts. This leads me to say that since it is exclusive to Luke's writing, it is something that shows us who Luke was to one degree or another. So, if this phrase is translated in any way other than "Men and brothers/brethren" then we have lost data about Luke and who he was. This should be unacceptable to a translator. No one has the right to subtract data from the Word of God other than what is normally lost in translation because of the normal loss of nuance in syntax and semantics.