Sodomites and Baptists

So you would rather listen to men who run people off and those who are divorced?

Ever read those in depth sermons preached?

 

Those folks have not been doing any evangelism. Even most non-believers outside of the church are against homosexual leaders in the church.

 

Reality is that the president also tends to set the theological tone for the convention indirectly by how he elects trustees and other committees. If you don't think this effects the future pastors of our Churches and the direction they lead it, I think you are not looking at this with the big picture in mind. This is why it is important to me to have someone leading the Convention who is a theologian.

Gee...we would not want somebody going around stressing evangelism and soul winning...why, we might end up wittnesing to the non elect...THE HORROR!!!!!!!

J [/QUOTE]

I did some searching to learn more about Pastor Johnny Hunt, and found your comment mocking those of us of the Reformed Beliefs to be disturbingly similar to a quote from Pastor Hunt himself at the Pastors Conference last year:

web page

Yours, and Pastor Hunt's comments were crude, lacking in the love of Christ, and missed the mark in several ways:

1. Both you and Pastor Hunt assumed that because one is a Reformed Theologian that they lack the zeal for evangelism. This is a lie that is propogated mostly by those of the free-will persuasion to smear those who disagree with them. I have just as much zeal to witness to all people as you claim to, whether they be of the elect or not, because my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, has commanded me to. Since I am a new creation and have a new mind of Christ, how could I not care for the lost and share the Gospel with them?

2. Particularly to Pastor Hunt's comment, none of the non-elect will ever be saved. I don't have to worry about that. This decision is in the sovereign hands of God, not mine. My duty and obligation is to be obedient to the commands of my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. He knows who the elect are and are not, since he chose them from the foundations of the world.

Joseph Botwinick

 

So you would rather listen to men who run people off and those who are divorced?

Ever read those in depth sermons preached? </font>[/QUOTE]Who did Patterson run off? I am quite glad he ran off many of the liberal wolves in sheeps clothing who were trying to destroy the Church with their false doctrines.

Joseph Botwinick

 

I'm not exactly sure who "RW" is, but the two others you mentioned are somewhat familiar. Andy Stanley no longer pastors a "Baptist" church, having resigned that to found Northpoint Community Church. Out of curiosity, you mentioned "lite preaching". Care to elaborate?? It seems that this thread has some sort of preconceived idea that large churches are receiving some sort of watered down message, preached by, as ShannonL phrased it, "cream puff preachers" preaching in some sort of "seeker friendly" church, else they would not be 'large'. I'd suggest that the late(s) W. A. Criswell and/or George W. Truett might beg to differ. I'm not saying ShannonL is doing this, by any stretch, but this is what has been implied, by some others. The SBC certainly is far from perfect; it is also been allowed to become, in the providence of God, the largest "Protestant" denomination in history. And with nearing 40,000 churches, we cover a lot of ground, and with a membership of over 16,000,000. Maybe rather than someone attempting to shoot in the general direction with a scatter-gun, we might concentrate on "cutting straight the Word of Truth" with a "Sword of the Spirit!".

Ed

 

Thanks, ShannonL---this post hits the nail on the head!!

 

EdSutton:

==It is not "large" churches that I am against, it is not "popular" preachers that I am worried about (per say). It is the "popularist" preachers. I think some call them "seeker-friendly", the "life-principles" people.


Martin.

 

J.R.Maddox:

==I have said NOTHING about Calvinism (etc) that is something you brought up. Let's also notice that I approved of men like Adrian Rodgers, Charles Stanley, and Paige Patterson (hardly Calvinists) even though I have differences with them theologically (see my previous posts in this thread where I mention this). So I have to wonder why you brought this up in such a manner. If you believe that those of us who want a serious theoglogian as a president are "arrogant" than that is your issue not mine. If you don't want to have anything to do with us then again that is your issue, not mine. I am perfectly willing to fellowship with non-Calvinists and I don't normally divide over the issue, and that is not what my reply was about. I am talking about the "popularists" preachers. So I have to wonder about your reply and what it really means....


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==Who said anything about a pope? And since when did a person being a theologian and president of the convention equal that person being "pope"? Do you think Paige Patterson was a pope?

Btw the person the convention elects represents the convention. So their job description is not what concerns me, what concerns me is what a man like Welch's election means about the doctrine of the SBC.

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==Welch was running around in his bus trying to see how many he could baptize. That is counting numbers. The concern needs to be with real salvation not "decisionism" and counting bodies in seats, or names on a roll.

Martin.

 

I do have to admit, that I am more 'impressed' with bodies in the seats, be it in the bus or busses, in the auditorium, in the SS class, in the Bible Study , in the prayer service , or in the church van, as our church moves them out for one of our 'mission' trips whether to South America, Central America, Georgia, or now, Mississippi and Louisiana, to help with the rebuilding and churches in the area after the hurricanes, anytime, than "the names on the roll". Why, if I did not happen to attend the Easter services at our church, due to being out of town, or ill, I would miss seeing some 'members' whose names are "on the church roll" for maybe at least a year and probably, in some cases, up to five or even te...
Ed

I'm not particularly sure much of this has anything, per se, to do with the OP, FTR.

 

One preacher on Easter morning would wish everyone a merry Christmas....because it would be next Easter before he saw many of them again!

YIKES!!!!

j

 

Humbly I ask: Have you ever listened to Johnny Hunt preach?

The reason I ask is that I have heard him preach - twice. Both times he preached a biblically solid message. Nothing "lite" or fluffy about it. I'm not sure that his being popular within the SBC is a disqualifying factor.

 

Every preacher elected President of the SBC since its Conservative Resurgence beginning in 1989 has been "died in the wool" preachers of inerrancy.

Johnny Hunt is a "Lean, mean preaching machine!!"

 

What little I have seen of him, I haven't been impressed. Maybe I need to research him further to see what you see, Blackbird. Does he post audio sermons on his Church's website?

Joseph Botwinick

 

Be my guest. See ya.



Joseph Botwinick

 

I am listening to one of his Sunday Sermons now. It will be interesting to hear more of him and learn more about him.

Joseph Botwinick