Terror Spectacular

[LadyEagle]

Amen! :thumbs:

 

[saturneptune]

Amen! :thumbs:

You know, the thought occurs to me that the ONLY reason God has not done to the United States what He did to some other nations who have done a lot less than us is becuase He is using America to protect Israel.

I would strongly suggest those who think otherwise think about how self centered and pampered Americans are, how sinful our nation has been (abortion for example), the how unGodly our government is and compare that with some of the nations in the OT, and see we are way overdue. Why is that?

 

[KenH]

Oh, I've learned that many on here don't accept God at His word

See, that is exactly the argument I made in a thread in the General Baptist Discussions Section. Those of us who don't buy the ideas of premillennialism(especially the dispensationalist brand) have our trust in God and our belief in His Word questioned and we are called liberals, etc.

I have no idea why premillennialists think they have the right to be so uppity in the world of Christendom, but they need a real attitude change toward those whom they will be spending eternity with.

 

[KenH]

Why is that?

Because God no longer deals with nation-states. The last time He punished a nation as a whole was in 70 A.D. and that nation was Israel.

 

[saturneptune]

Because God no longer deals with nation-states. The last time He punished a nation as a whole was in 70 A.D. and that nation was Israel.

How do you know that all the nations that have risen and fallen since 70AD did not have God's hand in it? Even if they dont, why does 70 AD mean He cannot do it again?

Are you telling me that Israel forming in 1948, the six day war of 1967, and the Yom Kipar war of 1973 had nothing to do with God's plan?

 

[LadyEagle]

I have no idea why premillennialists think they have the right to be so uppity in the world of Christendom, but they need a real attitude change toward those whom they will be spending eternity with.

Perhaps it is the other way around. Some of us support Israel because we still believe what the Bible says, like Israel being the Apple of God's eye.

Because God no longer deals with nation-states. The last time He punished a nation as a whole was in 70 A.D. and that nation was Israel.

The Roman Empire doesn't count, eh? :laugh:

 

[KenH]

Are you telling me that Israel forming in 1948, the six day war of 1967, and the Yom Kipar war of 1973 had nothing to do with God's plan?

Everything that has happened and will ever happen has to do with God's plan. God is sovereign - even using the bad actions of people to carry out his purposes.

Now, no, the creation so Israel in 1948, the Six Day War, and the Yom Kippur War had nothing to do with a specific Bible prophecy, nor does the modern political state of Israel.

 

[KenH]

Some of us support Israel because we still believe what the Bible says

So since I don't buy into your eschatology I don't believe the Bible? Thanks for proving my point.

The Roman Empire doesn't count, eh?

The Roman Empire's collapse(unlike the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D.) was so gradual that I don't think so.

As I said above, everything that happens ultimately fulfills God's purposes. What is at issue here is the idea that the modern political state of Israel(most of whose citizens reject Christ Jesus as the Son of God) is the fulfillment of a specific prophecy. I reject the idea that such a Christ rejecting nation is such a fulfillment.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

So since I don't buy into your eschatology I don't believe the Bible? Thanks for proving my point.

I don't think you spend much time with it.

I reject the idea that such a Christ rejecting nation is such a fulfillment.

The nation will continue to reject Christ, until forced into repentance. Israel will turn to Christ. That's what scripture says.

 

[KenH]

I don't think you spend much time with it.

Thank you for proving my point about premillennialists once again.

That's what scripture says.

To be accurate that's what your interpretation of Scripture says.

 

[Rufus_1611]

You know, the thought occurs to me that the ONLY reason God has not done to the United States what He did to some other nations who have done a lot less than us is becuase He is using America to protect Israel.

I would strongly suggest those who think otherwise think about how self centered and pampered Americans are, how sinful our nation has been (abortion for example), the how unGodly our government is and compare that with some of the nations in the OT, and see we are way overdue. Why is that?

The United States of America had far greater blessings well before the nation state called "Israel" ever existed. However, the curses and judgment we are currently under have increased as our blind support for this antichrist nation state has increased. I'm not saying there is a cause and effect there, but this idea that our nation will be blessed according to our support for another nation state, particularly an antichrist one, is absurd. Our nation will be blessed in accordance to our level of repentance of individual and national sins.

Since labeling folks who don't bow to a foreign nation state as replacement theologians seems to be the easy out, let me state for the record, I am not a replacement theologian. One would have to ignore far too much scripture to believe that God does not have a plan for the Jewish people and to God be the glory for that plan. It makes sense that they were the group who He dealt with towards the beginning of the book and it would make sense that He will deal with them at the end of the book. However, Christians don't need to support antichrists in order to make that happen and we do not need to commit national suicide in that effort. Also, please consider which comes next? Does Jesus Christ enter Jerusalem first or does the Son of Perdition? Thus, if we are to support the political and governmental machinations that will bring the Son of Perdition into their land...who would we be supporting?

 

[KenH]

Now that this thread has gone way, way off of the topic of terrorism, I have a question. Is it possible on this board to discuss subjects about the Middle East, terrorism, etc. without someone inserting their personal eschatological beliefs into the fray?

 

[Rufus_1611]

Now that this threa has gone way, way off of the topic of terrorism, I have a question. Is it possible on this board to discuss subjects about the Middle East, terrorism, etc. without someone inserting their personal eschatological beliefs into the fray?

That would be interesting to see.

 

[KenH]

These discussions make me very, very glad that we have separation of church and state in this country(I know that those words aren't in the U.S. constitution but it is a de facto principle that we have operated under since 1776).

 

[Bro. Curtis]

Thank you for proving my point about premillennialists once again.

You're welcome.

To be accurate that's what your interpretation of Scripture says.

When bible prophecy talks of Israel, I believe it is addressing Israel. You, apparently, think the bible is talking about something else that isn't Israel. Seems like the problem isn't interpretation, but denial.

 

[KenH]

Seems like the problem isn't interpretation, but denial.

Believe what you want about me. Whatever floats your boat, Bro. Curtis, whatever floats your boat.

 

[LadyEagle]

[/color]

You're welcome.






When bible prophecy talks of Israel, I believe it is addressing Israel. You, apparently, think the bible is talking about something else that isn't Israel. Seems like the problem isn't interpretation, but denial.

Amen, preach it, Brother Curtis! :thumbs:

 

[KenH]

Believe what you want about me. Whatever floats your boat, LE, whatever floats your boat.

 

[just-want-peace]

Me, post #20

Oh, I've learned that many on here don't accept God at His word, & I used to let that bug me, but that's between them & Him. I have no intention of getting into an argument over their liberal ideas.

Much of the preceding is precisely the reason for this statement.

I accept that they don't believe that Israel is still "the apple of God's eye" and leave them to such belief. But some of them refuse to just let it go and accept that others believe differently!

Oh well, I do remember in college it was always the guys who wanted get high that constantly made fun of and ridiculed those who opted to remain "dry".

Same insecurity, I guess, that drives those who can't let a "challenge" go by without a counter-attack!

 

[KenH]

Same insecurity, I guess, that drives those who can't let a "challenge" go by without a counter-attack!

So your side never counter-attacks? Or if you side attacks no one with a different viewpoint should counter-attack?

And now you are comparing those who disagree with you on this board to drunks and people who use drugs?