The Abomination Of Desolation

[robycop3]

It won’t be rebuilt, it will only end in disaster. Offering God animal sacrifice after He Sacrificed His only Son, is a huge blasphemy.

I feel sorry for the workers who attempt it already.

I’d merely get the popcorn ready and watch the great stupid happen.

Honestly mate, get that 375, go for Bigfoot.

The Judaism worship of today is a huge blasphemy. The temple WILL be rebuilt for the AOD to take place in. The previous failure was because it wasn't time for it yet. The Jews are well aware of the previous failure.

 

[robycop3]

I agree that the pig sacrifice by Antiochus IV Epiphanes was foreshadow of the AOD. I also agree that that the desolation was included in the "days of vengeance", but this also included the AOD of Matthew 24:15. When you compare Luke's version of the Olivet Discourse with Matthew's, you see they are describing the same thing. In Matthew, Jesus told His disciples "when you see" the AOD, and in Luke, Jesus told them "when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies". In Luke's gospel, Jesus is defining the abomination that causes desolation. The Roman armies carried idols (images of their gods) wherever they went. These idols of foreign gods are an abomination to the Jews. The Roman army was an abomination to the Jews because of the idol images they carried. Furthermore, the Roman army literally CAUSED the desolation of Jerusalem. Hopefully, this has put this question to rest.

Daniel didn't write of the destruction of J & the AOD in the same prophecy, The destruction of J is in Daniel 9:26, while the AOD is in 11:31 & 12:11. So, the destruction & the AOD are different events. If the destruction had been the AOD, the apostles would've had to have been in the middle of it to have seen it. However, no one has seen the AOD because it hasn't yet occurred.

And I thought you were smarter than to believe that jive about the Roman ensigns, something that was invented by the stupidest of the preterists years back.

2 Thessalonians 2:4 says that the Man of Lawlessness will "take his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God".

You left out the first part of the verse:He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, If the Romans deified an emperor, they didn't worship him alone; they added him to their pantheon of gods/goddesses. And the emperors themselves worshipped the same pantheon.

This could easily refer to emperor worship. The Man of Lawlessness was very likely Nero. Note that in verse 6 that he was restrained "now", which is repeated verse 7. Furthermore, verse 7 tells us that "the mystery of lawlessness is already at work". Unless you change the meaning of "now" and "already", these are past events - when Herod's temple was still standing.

I have very-plainly explained why Nero, nor Caligula, nor any other Roman ruler was the beast. The TRUE beast MUST fulfill EVERY Scriptural criterion for the beast, TO THE LETTER. Both Hitler & Stalin fulfilled more of them than Nero did.

Let's clear up your misunderstanding of Revelation 13. The beast out of the sea (v. 1) is Rome. The beast coming up out of the earth (aka False Prophet) is apostate Israel.

No, the sea beast represents both the antichrist & his empire, while the beast from the earth represents both a religious org & its boss, the false prophet. It will be subservient to the first beast.

The image of the beast was possibly an image of the current emperor. Since Vespasian was emperor when Jerusalem was destroyed, it was probably his image. The image of the beast may also refer to Titus, as a representative of the beast.

No, the image of the beast will be an image of the true beast, who hasn't yet come.

Revelation 1:7 begins with a quote from Daniel 7:13 - "Behold, He is coming with the clouds". Clouds symbolize judgment. Verse 7 continues with a reference from Zechariah 12:10 "every eye will see Him, even those who pierced Him, and all the tribes of the earth will mourn over Him". Who were those who pierced Jesus? The Jews. Which tribes will mourn? The Jewish tribes. Apostae Israel mourned when Jesus "came in judgment" in AD 70. History records that these events were fulfilled in the Jewish Wars ending in AD 70. Unfortunately, you prefer to believe the fantasy of the futurist views.

No, "every tribe on earth" means EXACTLY THAT! The Israelis are included, of course, but they're only 12 of the thousands of earthly tribes. And while those who pierced Him are dead, they'll see His return from hades.

Actually, the Jewish wars didn't end til 73 AD when Masada fell. And a FAR-WORSE event befell the Jews, starting AD 135-136 when Hadrian's forces expelled them from their land & gave it to the Philistines, who hadn't rebelled against Rome.("Palestinian" is Latin for 'Philistine'.) After that, it's well-known the Jews were hated & persecuted wherever they went. It's even reflected in Shakespeare's character Shylock. It culminated in the nazi holocaust in which 6 million of the world's 13 million Jews perished.

God's power kept them from being exterminated for some 1900 years, and, beginning in 1945, empowered them to defeat their Moslem enemies & gain some revenge on the nazis. You know the rest.[/QUOTE]

 

[SavedByGrace]

the Eucharist

this is unbiblical heresy!

 

[George Antonios]

Here's where the abomination of desolation(Hereafter referred to as the "AOD") is referred to in Scripture:

Daniel 11:31And forces shall be mustered by him,(the beast/antichrist) and they shall defile the sanctuary fortress; then they shall take away the daily sacrifices, and place there the abomination of desolation.

Daniel 12:11“And from the time that the daily sacrifice is taken away, and the abomination of desolation is set up, there shall be one thousand two hundred and ninety days.

Matt. 24:15“Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand),

Mark 13:14So when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not” (let the reader understand), “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

So, we see the AOD is PLACED, SET UP, & WILL STAND. And I believe the main component of the AOD is:

Rev. 13: 14 And he(the false prophet) deceives those who dwell on the earth by those signs which he was granted to do in the sight of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who was wounded by the sword and lived.

I believe that statue will be what is set up in the coming temple. We have the model, or "type" for it in the original AOD when Antiochus Epiphanes, in the 160s BC, set up a statue of Zeus in the old temple & sacrificed a pig upon the altar. Differences are that the beast will have a statue of himself in the temple, & he won't sacrifice anything, instead, halting all sacrifices & declaring himself God.

So, the AOD will be 3 things:

1.) a statue of the beast/antichrist that'll be set up in the new temple in Jerusalem that the Jews will build.

2.) The beast will halt all sacrifices in that temple.

3.) Worst of all, while sitting in the temple, the beast will declare himself to be God.

Agreed, except for the difference that he will be sacrificing Jews (Dan.3:6; Ps.14/53:4, 16:4, 27:2, 44:11, 22; Zech.11:16; Mic.3:1-3).

 

[George Antonios]

No, what we see is you trying to be tricky and leave out the key passages that destroys this tale of fiction. AOD has already occurred. It's such a simple hermeneutic to compare scripture with scripture and let it interpret itself:

15 When therefore ye see the abomination of desolation, which was spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place (let him that readeth understand),
16 then let them that are in Judaea flee unto the mountains:
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all these things be accomplished. Mt 24

14 But when ye see the abomination of desolation standing where he ought not (let him that readeth understand), then let them that are in Judaea flee unto the mountains:
30 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, until all these things be accomplished. Mk 13

20 But when ye see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that her desolation is at hand.
21 Then let them that are in Judaea flee unto the mountains; and let them that are in the midst of her depart out; and let not them that are in the country enter therein.
32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all things be accomplished. Lk 21

Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any TWOedged sword,

Ah, that good old double application, gets' em every time.

 

[Lodic]

Daniel didn't write of the destruction of J & the AOD in the same prophecy, The destruction of J is in Daniel 9:26, while the AOD is in 11:31 & 12:11. So, the destruction & the AOD are different events. If the destruction had been the AOD, the apostles would've had to have been in the middle of it to have seen it. However, no one has seen the AOD because it hasn't yet occurred.

And I thought you were smarter than to believe that jive about the Roman ensigns, something that was invented by the stupidest of the preterists years back.

As you know, Daniel 9 is about the 70 Weeks prophecy. 11:31 & 12:11 provide more details about the destruction of Jerusalem, including the AOD. Can you disprove the Roman ensigns theory? Scripture and history prove that the Roman armies brought the desolation and the AOD (in whatever form it may have taken). Incidentally, Jesus warned the disciples that some of them would have seen it, since it was within their generation. Therefore, they must have because it happened just as Jesus said.

You left out the first part of the verse:He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, If the Romans deified an emperor, they didn't worship him alone; they added him to their pantheon of gods/goddesses. And the emperors themselves worshipped the same pantheon.

I don't see how that refutes my argument.

I have very-plainly explained why Nero, nor Caligula, nor any other Roman ruler was the beast. The TRUE beast MUST fulfill EVERY Scriptural criterion for the beast, TO THE LETTER. Both Hitler & Stalin fulfilled more of them than Nero did.

You've only explained why you believe none of those guys was the Beast. Nero fits all the criteria. He was the 6th "king" of Revelation 17:9-11. Apostate Israel was the False Prophet. These line up perfectly.

No, "every tribe on earth" means EXACTLY THAT! The Israelis are included, of course, but they're only 12 of the thousands of earthly tribes. And while those who pierced Him are dead, they'll see His return from hades.

Actually, the Jewish wars didn't end til 73 AD when Masada fell. And a FAR-WORSE event befell the Jews, starting AD 135-136 when Hadrian's forces expelled them from their land & gave it to the Philistines, who hadn't rebelled against Rome.("Palestinian" is Latin for 'Philistine'.) After that, it's well-known the Jews were hated & persecuted wherever they went. It's even reflected in Shakespeare's character Shylock. It culminated in the nazi holocaust in which 6 million of the world's 13 million Jews perished.

"Every tribe on earth" clearly indicates the Jewish tribes, and they "saw" Him when Jerusalem fell. While the Jewish Wars ended with Masada, the persecution and slaughter of the Jews was not the focus of the "end times" prophecies. The focus was the end of the Old Covenant system with their animal sacrifices, which ended in AD 70.

God's power kept them from being exterminated for some 1900 years, and, beginning in 1945, empowered them to defeat their Moslem enemies & gain some revenge on the nazis. You know the rest.

Indeed. His protection was very clearly demonstrated in the 6 Day War. However, this only shows that God protects them, just as He protected and guided the U.S. throughout our history.

 

[robycop3]

As you know, Daniel 9 is about the 70 Weeks prophecy. 11:31 & 12:11 provide more details about the destruction of Jerusalem, including the AOD. Can you disprove the Roman ensigns theory?

Easily. They were not set up. Their purpose was for unit ID. When soldiers became scattered in battle, they headed toward the ensign of their unit. This method of keepin units together was still used in WW1.

Scripture and history prove that the Roman armies brought the desolation and the AOD (in whatever form it may have taken). Incidentally, Jesus warned the disciples that some of them would have seen it, since it was within their generation. Therefore, they must have because it happened just as Jesus said.

The Romans destroyed J & the temple as Daniel & Jesus said. But they did NOT do the AOD. They didn't set up anything in the temple; they pulled it down, looking for gold between its stones.

I don't see how that refutes my argument.

You don't WANT to see, but it's quite plain. The beast won't recognize any god but himself, while every Roman emperor worshipped the Roman pantheon. That rules them out as being the beast.

You've only explained why you believe none of those guys was the Beast. Nero fits all the criteria.

No, he doesn't come CLOSE. When was he ever in Jerusalem? When was he cast alive into hell?

He was the 6th "king" of Revelation 17:9-11.

No, he was ruler of the 6th kingDOM. There were many more than 5 kings of Rome before him.

Apostate Israel was the False Prophet. These line up perfectly.

No, they don't line up at all. Nero & Israel had nothing to do with each other, except Judea was a province of the empire.

"Every tribe on earth" clearly indicates the Jewish tribes, and they "saw" Him when Jerusalem fell.

No, 'every tribe on earth' means every tribe on earth, unless you don't believe Scripture. And the "Jewish tribes" are only Judah, Benjamin, & Levi. The rest of the Israelis aren't Jews. And they didn't see anything when J fell except its destruction. Jesus hasn't yet returned.

While the Jewish Wars ended with Masada, the persecution and slaughter of the Jews was not the focus of the "end times" prophecies. The focus was the end of the Old Covenant system with their animal sacrifices, which ended in AD 70.

Jesus ended that on the cross.

Indeed. His protection was very clearly demonstrated in the 6 Day War. However, this only shows that God protects them, just as He protected and guided the U.S. throughout our history.

God punished them severely for some 1900 years. When the godless Napoleon Bonaparte was asked if he believed in miracles, he answered with out hesitation, "Oui! The Jews!"

Your whole premise is built on opinion & guesswork. It's been soundly proven Nero was NOT the beast. Gabriel plainly told Daniel about the AOD, and Daniel wrote it'd be both placed & set up in the temple. After the statue of Zeus placed & set up in it by Antiochus Epiphanes, no such further act occurred in that temple again. So, a new temple must be built for it to occur in. THAT'S COMMON SENSE!

And Jesus did NOT physically, visibly return in 70 AD. He said Himself His return would be in great power & glory, visible as lightning, seen by all, saying no one would mistake His return for anything else & He would be seen by all. And He specifically warned against those who would spread rumors that He'd already returned & was hiding in the desert, etc. Seems you believed one of those rumor-spreaders by saying He'd returned in 70 AD!

I dismiss your whole thingy as horse feathers, phony as a Chevy Mustang.

To say the AOD was Roman ensigns is beyond ridiculous. I suggest you stop reading the fiction written by Gentry, Preston, etc. & stick to Scripture & legitimate, accurate history boox.

 

[Lodic]

Easily. They were not set up. Their purpose was for unit ID. When soldiers became scattered in battle, they headed toward the ensign of their unit. This method of keepin units together was still used in WW1.

Just for the sake of our discussion, let's say the Roman standards were not the AOD. That still wouldn't prove that the Roman armies did not bring the AOD as Luke's gospel described.

You don't WANT to see, but it's quite plain. The beast won't recognize any god but himself, while every Roman emperor worshipped the Roman pantheon. That rules them out as being the beast.

I am willing to review whether any claim is true or not. This simply fails to refute my argument.

No, he doesn't come CLOSE. When was he ever in Jerusalem? When was he cast alive into hell?

The Beast was Nero as a representative of Rome. "Rome" came to Jerusalem. Nero's suicide cast him into Hell.

No, he was ruler of the 6th kingDOM. There were many more than 5 kings of Rome before him.

No, 'every tribe on earth' means every tribe on earth, unless you don't believe Scripture. And the "Jewish tribes" are only Judah, Benjamin, & Levi. The rest of the Israelis aren't Jews. And they didn't see anything when J fell except its destruction. Jesus hasn't yet returned.

Let's see - "Every tribe" must be taken literally, but Nero was not literally the 6th "king". In context, Revelation speaks of the "kings" beginning with Julius Caesar.

Your whole premise is built on opinion & guesswork. It's been soundly proven Nero was NOT the beast. Gabriel plainly told Daniel about the AOD, and Daniel wrote it'd be both placed & set up in the temple. After the statue of Zeus placed & set up in it by Antiochus Epiphanes, no such further act occurred in that temple again. So, a new temple must be built for it to occur in. THAT'S COMMON SENSE!

It's your premise that is more fairy tale and guesswork, while my premise is built on extensive study of the Scriptures. You claim that your views are common sense, but you deny the common sense when I explain to you how Daniel's prophecies came to pass.

And Jesus did NOT physically, visibly return in 70 AD. He said Himself His return would be in great power & glory, visible as lightning, seen by all, saying no one would mistake His return for anything else & He would be seen by all. And He specifically warned against those who would spread rumors that He'd already returned & was hiding in the desert, etc. Seems you believed one of those rumor-spreaders by saying He'd returned in 70 AD!

I've never claimed that Jesus returned physically in AD 70. He came "in judgment", just as God came in judgment on different nations in the Old Testament. While I've learned a lot from Gary DeMar, Ken Gentry, Milton Terry, et al, I study Scriptures for myself, following the Bereans' example. I might suggest you do the same, instead of swallowing the "futurist" view without question.

 

[robycop3]

Just for the sake of our discussion, let's say the Roman standards were not the AOD.

They WEREN'T.

That still wouldn't prove that the Roman armies did not bring the AOD as Luke's gospel described.

They didn't. The word "desolation" appears 54 times in the NKJV, 58 times in the NASV, & only five of them refer to the AOD. There were quite a few desolations in Scripture. The Luke desolation is merely the destruction of J. And there's absolutely NO RECORD of the Romans' having set up anything in the temple !

I am willing to review whether any claim is true or not. This simply fails to refute my argument.

OK, you claim Nero was the beast. Please tell us who his false prophet deputy was, & when they both were cast alive into the lake of fire.

The Beast was Nero as a representative of Rome. "Rome" came to Jerusalem. Nero's suicide cast him into Hell.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA !
Nero was NEVER in J! And his suicide KILLED him! He was NOT cast alive into hell !

Let's see - "Every tribe" must be taken literally, but Nero was not literally the 6th "king". In context, Revelation speaks of the "kings" beginning with Julius Caesar.

No, the previous kingDOMS were Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia & Greece. The one that then was, was Rome.

It's your premise that is more fairy tale and guesswork, while my premise is built on extensive study of the Scriptures. You claim that your views are common sense, but you deny the common sense when I explain to you how Daniel's prophecies came to pass.

Evidently you haven't studied them TOO extensively, or you'd toss the "Nero=beast" garbage. You just GUESSED how Daniel's prophecies came to pass.

I've never claimed that Jesus returned physically in AD 70. He came "in judgment", just as God came in judgment on different nations in the Old Testament.

No, Jesus has NOT yet come back physically or visibly at all. However, He is present SPIRITUALLY, as He said He'd be, whenever/wherever 2 or more are gathered in His name. And that includes on social media, so be careful what you post!

While I've learned a lot from Gary DeMar, Ken Gentry, Milton Terry, et al, I study Scriptures for myself, following the Bereans' example. I might suggest you do the same, instead of swallowing the "futurist" view without question.

But you add those teachings of MEN, who by & large are quacks, to the teachings of Scripture, while I use history and reality.

The request to preterists, "PLEASE SHOW US FROM HISTORY WHEN IT HAPPENED", gets'em every time !

 

[Lodic]

OK, you claim Nero was the beast. Please tell us who his false prophet deputy was, & when they both were cast alive into the lake of fire.

As I've mentioned before, the False Prophet was Apostate Israel. Presumably, their priests were cast into the lake of fire.

Nero was NEVER in J! And his suicide KILLED him! He was NOT cast alive into hell !

Nero didn't have to personally go to Jerusalem. While I'm not really clear on the details of the Beast and the False Prophet getting tossed into the Lake of Fire (Rev 19:20), I'm not overly concerned with that detail. The Preterist view may leave a few questions, but it answers so many more. On the other hand, the futurist view is strictly guesswork with no real answers. You have to admit that you don't know how everything is supposed to work out in your view, but you are confident enough in that view that you stick with it. Likewise, the futurist view is weak and illogical to me, so I will stick with Preterism.

But you add those teachings of MEN, who by & large are quacks, to the teachings of Scripture, while I use history and reality.

The futurist views are teachings of men, whereas Preterism is sound doctrine. Furthermore, Preterism is proved by history.

 

[George Antonios]

As I've mentioned before, the False Prophet was Apostate Israel. Presumably, their priests were cast into the lake of fire.

Wow.
At this rate, why not just go with:
"The false prophet was the Lilliputians and their leaders were cast into Williwonka's chocolate factory"?
I mean, if you're gonna go for it then just go for it man, don't hold back.

 

[37818]

As I've mentioned before, the False Prophet was Apostate Israel. Presumably, their priests were cast into the lake of fire.

Wow.

 

[37818]

Preterism is sound doctrine.

Not when the Biblical millennium is denied. Revelation 22:18-19, ". . . For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the tree of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. . . ."

 

[Lodic]

Not when the Biblical millennium is denied. Revelation 22:18-19, ". . . For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the tree of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. . . ."

I have never added to nor changed the prophecies in Revelation nor any other Biblical prophecy. Rather, I hold to the Preterist interpretation of those prophecies, just as you hold to the view that these events are in our future. For the record, I do believe that the physical, visible return of Christ is in our future. Hopefully sooner rather than later, but that could tomorrow, or another thousand years.

 

[Lodic]

Wow.
At this rate, why not just go with:
"The false prophet was the Lilliputians and their leaders were cast into Williwonka's chocolate factory"?
I mean, if you're gonna go for it then just go for it man, don't hold back.

That's your response???? And here I was looking for a serious discussion about the topic.

 

[robycop3]

As I've mentioned before, the False Prophet was Apostate Israel. Presumably, their priests were cast into the lake of fire.

MMRRPP ! WRONG !
The FP will be a man. And your assumption further wrecks your "Nero=beast" hooey. Nero and Israel never associated, and Israel CERTAINLY didn't demand that everyone worship Nero. And there's not one quark of Scripture nor history saying any priest was cast into the LOF.

Nero didn't have to personally go to Jerusalem.

And he didn't. That's part of why he wasn't the beast.

While I'm not really clear on the details of the Beast and the False Prophet getting tossed into the Lake of Fire (Rev 19:20), I'm not overly concerned with that detail.

That's because "that detail" is a sure proof Nero wasn't the beast.

The Preterist view may leave a few questions,

It leaves a LOT of questions because it's completely false.

but it answers so many more.

with INCORRECT answers, such as your (and Gentry's) "Nero=the beast" bunk.

On the other hand, the futurist view is strictly guesswork with no real answers. You have to admit that you don't know how everything is supposed to work out in your view, but you are confident enough in that view that you stick with it. Likewise, the futurist view is weak and illogical to me, so I will stick with Preterism.

It's your right to be wrong by sticking with something completely disproven by history and Scripture. And OF COURSE we don't know how the future's gonna play out, but GOD has given us a good idea.

The futurist views are teachings of men, whereas Preterism is sound doctrine. Furthermore, Preterism is proved by history.

Preterism is totally man-made. History DISproves it. Otherwise, you could tell us who the beast REALLY was, who the FP was, that the mark of the beast looked like, when the great trib occurred worldwide, and, most of all, when JESUS PHYSICALLY & VISIBLT RETURNED, seen by all.

Scripture plainly shows us what the AOD will be, and history shows us it hasn't happened yet. You can't get around it.

"PRETERISM-PHONY AS A $3 BILL!"

 

[robycop3]

The fact that this has become just another anti-preterism thread is partly mine. So, I'm gouing back to the OP & thread title-the AOD.

I posted Scriptures showing the AOD will be something that's placed & set up, with the first one being the statue of Zeus placed & set up in the temple by Antiochus Epiphanes in the 160s BC. There'll be a future one , as Jesus said"when you see the AOD mentioned by Daniel...". So we know the type. And Scripture goes on to say the false prophet would command men to make an image or statue of the beast/antichrist who had received what shoulda been a fatal head wound, but recovered. And Paul wrote that the beast/man of sin would enter the temple & proclaim himself God. Scripture also says that man won't recognize any other god but himself, so that knocks out any Caesar being the beast, as all Caesars worshipped at least some of the Roman pantheon of gods/goddesses.

So the scenario for the AOD appears to be that the beast will enter the new temple the Jews will build in Jerusalem, halt all sacrifices, & declare himself God while having his statue set up in that temple. That'll be the sign which shall cause all Christians to flee Jerusalem at once, without any delay. I'm GUESSING the reason will be that, having declared himself God, the beast will have his forces hunt down & kill anyone worshipping any other god, starting in Jerusalem.

But anyway, Scripture paints a picture of what the AOD will be. Saying it was Roman ensigns, etc. is simply against Scripture.

 

[Lodic]

The FP will be a man. And your assumption further wrecks your "Nero=beast" hooey. Nero and Israel never associated, and Israel CERTAINLY didn't demand that everyone worship Nero. And there's not one quark of Scripture nor history saying any priest was cast into the LOF.

I am absolutely certain the False Prophet was Apostate Israel, who had aligned itself with the Roman Empire. Quite possibly the chief priests were tossed into the Lake of Fire.

It leaves a LOT of questions because it's completely false.

Preterism leaves a few questions about some of the details, but so does Futurism. Furthermore, the futurist view calls for a lot of false assumptions and poor exegesis. Your view calls for changing the meaning of "soon", "this generation", "quickly", etc. This is an area where we Preterists take the Scriptures quite literally, where you Futurists take the symbolic approach.

Preterism is totally man-made. History DISproves it. Otherwise, you could tell us who the beast REALLY was, who the FP was, that the mark of the beast looked like, when the great trib occurred worldwide, and, most of all, when JESUS PHYSICALLY & VISIBLT RETURNED, seen by all.

Scripture plainly shows us what the AOD will be, and history shows us it hasn't happened yet. You can't get around it.

The Futurist view was pretty much invented by John Nelson Darby around 1830, and it was later popularized by Scofield. Before the 19th Century, the predominant view of these prophecies was Preterist. Any other view is false.

I've lost track of how many times I've told you who the beast and false prophet were - Rome / Nero and Apostate Israel. The Mark of the Beast was not a literal mark, but symbolic of alignment with the Roman Empire. While Jesus came in judgment on Jerusalem in AD 70, His physical and visible return is still in our future. The Great Tribulation was not worldwide, but upon Israel from AD 66-70 (3 1/2 years). Scripture and history plainly show us when these events happened, no matter how much you deny it.

 

[robycop3]

I am absolutely certain the False Prophet was Apostate Israel, who had aligned itself with the Roman Empire. Quite possibly the chief priests were tossed into the Lake of Fire.

With all due respect, you're absolutely INCORRECT! Most of the Jews submitted to Rome because they didn't want to be whacked, & besides, Rome brought them "law & order", good, safe roads, etc. And the high priests, current & former, were killed by the Idumeans & Zealots in 68 AD, so they weren't cast alive into hell. And if any of them deserved such a fate, it was Caiaphas, who had Jesus crucified. However, his home is still standing, & his ossuary was found, with his name plainly written on it. There's not a quark of Scripture nor historical record that any priest, or anyone else, was ever tossed alive into the lake of fire.

Preterism leaves a few questions about some of the details, but so does Futurism. Furthermore, the futurist view calls for a lot of false assumptions and poor exegesis. Your view calls for changing the meaning of "soon", "this generation", "quickly", etc. This is an area where we Preterists take the Scriptures quite literally, where you Futurists take the symbolic approach.

For the umpteenth time, please show us HISTORICAL PROOF that the eschatological events have already occurred! And I mean from a LEGITIMATE SOURCE, not the garbage those pret quack "authors" write.

The Futurist view was pretty much invented by John Nelson Darby around 1830, and it was later popularized by Scofield. Before the 19th Century, the predominant view of these prophecies was Preterist. Any other view is false.

Yes, preterism is false. For several millenia, men thought the earth is flat til FACT took over.

I've lost track of how many times I've told you who the beast and false prophet were - Rome / Nero and Apostate Israel.

And every time you've told me that has been just-as-false as it was the first time.
I posted FACTS that **PROVE** Nero was NOT the beast-HISTORICAL FACTS you CANNOT refute! But yet you still believe the garbage of Gentry, Preston, etc. which has proven as false as that of Hal Lindsey.

The Mark of the Beast was not a literal mark, but symbolic of alignment with the Roman Empire.

HORSE FEATHERS!
It will be issued by the beast.
You're trying to have your cake & eat it, too. Scripture plainly says the beast will issue the mark thru the false prophet, & there's absolutely NO record that Nero or Israel issued any kind of mark required to do business, nor aligned himself with the Jews in any manner. You're working against your own perceived beast!

While Jesus came in judgment on Jerusalem in AD 70, His physical and visible return is still in our future. The Great Tribulation was not worldwide, but upon Israel from AD 66-70 (3 1/2 years). Scripture and history plainly show us when these events happened, no matter how much you deny it.

No, Jesus has NOT yet returned in any manner. He plainly warned against believing He had returned by word of mouth because His return would be visible as lightning, seen by ALL.
And plainly, the great trib has NOT occurred, It will be WORLDWIDE, and the beast will be in power when it does occur, or else Jesus was wrong in Rev. 3:10! (Remember , the Philadelphia church STILL EXISTS ! !)

OTHER READERS:

Between Lodic & I, WHO has made their case? WHO has presented FACTS?

I believe Lodic is a Christian, but he's been led astray by some purveyors of bunk. I hope the HOLY SPIRIT steps in & shows him the TRUTH before others get led astray.

 

[Cathode]

There is another understanding worth considering.

There were prefigurements of Christ, so there is no reason prohibiting prefigurements of the anti christ.

Nero in his age was undoubtedly an anti christ.

However of all these prefigurements, there is a final figure which embodies them all and exceeds them.