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The Arminian Trinity

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JonShaff

Fellow Servant
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"...even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace have you been saved)" (Eph. 2:5). Here Paul locates the time when regeneration occurs. It takes place 'when we were dead.' With one thunderbolt of apostolic revelation all attempts to give the initiative in regeneration to man are smashed. Again, dead men do not cooperate with grace. Unless regeneration takes place first, there is no possibility of faith.
This says nothing different from what Jesus said to Nicodemus. Unless a man is born again first, he cannot possibly see or enter the kingdom of God. If we believe that faith precedes regeneration, then we set our thinking and therefore ourselves in direct opposition not only to giants of Christian history but also to the teaching of Paul and of our Lord Himself. Sproul.
Paul gives commentary as to what "Dead" means and looks like, if we keep reading...

Eph 2:2-3 ESV in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience— among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind.

This passage says nothing of whether or not we can respond to God. Saying "dead men do not cooperate with grace" is saying something that the texts does not speak on itself, right wrong or indifferent.
 

Yeshua1

Well-Known Member
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They do.

We certainly mean no harm in giving them a label. If we understand that they hold to an Arminian position, for example, we call them Arminians, but they can take that the wrong way, and many times, I would guess that reaction is one of pride. They think themselves independent and self-sufficient thinkers, with no need to study church history or these historic debates over doctrine.
I really think few here see loss of salvation, as only ones who do would be those in groups such as SDA...
 

thatbrian

Well-Known Member
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I really think few here see loss of salvation, as only ones who do would be those in groups such as SDA...

Ah, that might be what bothers them.

I wonder if calling them 1-point Calvinists would bug them more, though?! :)
 

MB

Well-Known Member
They still think John calvin invented Calvinism, even thoughits major points came after Him.
Actually Calvinism should be called Gnosticism. Calvin did not invent what is mistakenly called Calvinism Augustine invented it.

I've been posting here for 10 years and as yet have never met a true Arminian. Calvinist refuse to acknowledge that there are Born again Christians following Christ who do not hold to any doctrine that comes from there former Catholic Brethern. They feel all men follow other men instead of Christ. I follow no one but Christ. There is no one in Calvinism that has any authority on the doctrine of Christ. They teach a doctrine of men because when they can't defend there Calvinism they try to use Quotes from there well know Brethren of the past.

Calvinist think it a shame that there are Christians who have not done a study of Calvin and Augustine. I have God's word to study and it tells me I need no other teacher than the Holy Spirit. I have read some of Augustine and quite a bit of Calvin yet I find nothing from either to be inspiring.
MB
 

Yeshua1

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<Sigh> No, the "major points" came before John Calvin. 1500 years before John Calvin!
I know, started with jesus, peter, paul, and John, then Augustine and others, than John got his understanding. just was saying many critics seem to think that he founded the whole theology!
 

Yeshua1

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Actually Calvinism should be called Gnosticism. Calvin did not invent what is mistakenly called Calvinism Augustine invented it.

I've been posting here for 10 years and as yet have never met a true Arminian. Calvinist refuse to acknowledge that there are Born again Christians following Christ who do not hold to any doctrine that comes from there former Catholic Brethern. They feel all men follow other men instead of Christ. I follow no one but Christ. There is no one in Calvinism that has any authority on the doctrine of Christ. They teach a doctrine of men because when they can't defend there Calvinism they try to use Quotes from there well know Brethren of the past.

Calvinist think it a shame that there are Christians who have not done a study of Calvin and Augustine. I have God's word to study and it tells me I need no other teacher than the Holy Spirit. I have read some of Augustine and quite a bit of Calvin yet I find nothing from either to be inspiring.
MB
Calvinism is found in the scriptures though, as that is where Augustine and calvin found it!
 

TCassidy

Late-Administator Emeritus
Administrator
Calvinism is a system of theology.
No. In order to by a system of theology it would have to include the other theological disciplines.

"Calvinism" is a word that has no definition. It means whatever the user wants it to mean.

Systematic Theology is, by definition, topical. While Biblical Theology is, by definition, biblical.

Particular Redemption is a subject based on the bible and does not include the other Theological disciplines,

Theology (Proper) – The study of the character of God
Angelology – The study of angels
Anthropology – The study of the nature of man.
Bibliology – The study of the bible
Christology – The study of Christ
Ecclesiology – The study of the church
Eschatology – The study of last things
Hamartiology – The study of sin
Pneumatology – The study of the Holy Spirit
Soteriology – The study of salvation

Soteriology is inclusive of all expressions of the Ordo Salutus.
 

kyredneck

Well-Known Member
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It does not change the comment I made that would fault him for not contributing to the iron sharpening process

Ah, but I suggest to you that you are judging harshly and that Hank is indeed contributing to the 'sharpening process' by just being Hank, you just don't see it. He even 'liked' this post of yours'.
 

Iconoclast

Well-Known Member
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As Jehovah, this had always been the case concerning Jerusalem down through the centuries, not only during the incarnation.



4 who doth will all men to be saved, and to come to the full knowledge of the truth; 1 Tim 2 YLT

'All anthropos', as in 'not of the Jews only', but Gentiles also:

23 and that he might make known the riches of his glory upon vessels of mercy, which he afore prepared unto glory,
24 even us, whom he also called, not from the Jews only, but also from the Gentiles? Ro 9



9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some count slackness; but is longsuffering to you-ward, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. 2 Pet 3

Notice the big YOU. As the apostle to the circumcision Peter was addressing a Jewish audience, and the 'perishing' is the same as in Luke:

1 Now there were some present at that very season who told him of the Galilaeans, whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices.
2 And he answered and said unto them, Think ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they have suffered these things?
3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all in like manner perish.
4 Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and killed them, think ye that they were offenders above all the men that dwell in Jerusalem?
5 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish. Lu 13
23 Woe unto them that are with child and to them that give suck in those days! for there shall be great distress upon the land, and wrath unto this people.
32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all things be accomplished. Lu 21

...and the longsuffering and the repentance is the same as in Revelation:

21 And I gave her time that she should repent; and she willeth not to repent of her fornication. Rev 2
The problem is...you used too many verses in context...is that even allowed?
 

Iconoclast

Well-Known Member
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It's highly unlikely that a Roman Centurion, a Gentile, was regenerated at the outset of Jesus' earthly ministry.

Matt. 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: “Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans.
6 Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel.


So why does Ezekiel 36 apply to Gentiles?
Gentiles were always part of God's eternal to become part of the True israel of God.kyred shows you the necessity of the new birth, it is not optional.
 

Iconoclast

Well-Known Member
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Sorry, but citing some verses is not an explanation.

Ezekiel 36 is about Israel's redemption and restoration as a nation comprised of God's chosen people. Calvinists cherry pick a couple of verses out of it and claim the meaning is that one must be regenerated (be given a new heart) before one can have faith.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL
Your dispensational error blinds you to the truth here ITL.
 

Iconoclast

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Actually Calvinism should be called Gnosticism. Calvin did not invent what is mistakenly called Calvinism Augustine invented it.

I've been posting here for 10 years and as yet have never met a true Arminian. Calvinist refuse to acknowledge that there are Born again Christians following Christ who do not hold to any doctrine that comes from there former Catholic Brethern. They feel all men follow other men instead of Christ. I follow no one but Christ. There is no one in Calvinism that has any authority on the doctrine of Christ. They teach a doctrine of men because when they can't defend there Calvinism they try to use Quotes from there well know Brethren of the past.

Calvinist think it a shame that there are Christians who have not done a study of Calvin and Augustine. I have God's word to study and it tells me I need no other teacher than the Holy Spirit. I have read some of Augustine and quite a bit of Calvin yet I find nothing from either to be inspiring.
MB
Your post is nonsense.You repeat this trying to talk yourself into it. If you stated what you believe biblically it would show who you are and I guarantee there would be no unique position that you only have come to.
 

Earth Wind and Fire

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Yea. Right.

2 Beware of the dogs, beware of the evil workers, beware of the concision:
3 for we are the circumcision, who worship by the Spirit of God, and glory in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh: Phil 3

29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God. Ro 2

6 But it is not as though the word of God hath come to nought. For they are not all Israel, that are of Israel:
7 neither, because they are Abraham`s seed, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, it is not the children of the flesh that are children of God; but the children of the promise are reckoned for a seed. Ro 9

15 For neither is circumcision anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
16 And as many as shall walk by this rule, peace be upon them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God. Gal 6

18 And I also say unto thee, that thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it. Mt 16

14 Symeon hath rehearsed how first God visited the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
16 After these things I will return, And I will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen; And I will build again the ruins thereof, And I will set it up:
17 That the residue of men may seek after the Lord, And all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, Acts 15
Well done
 

Earth Wind and Fire

Well-Known Member
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Sorry, but citing some verses is not an explanation.

Ezekiel 36 is about Israel's redemption and restoration as a nation comprised of God's chosen people. Calvinists cherry pick a couple of verses out of it and claim the meaning is that one must be regenerated (be given a new heart) before one can have faith.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL
I would not say a new heart, but I would say insight
 
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