The Atonement of Christ: What did it REALLY Achieve ? 9

[37818]

Every sinner Christ died for is saved , even from their mothers womb, from the penalty of death for their sins, because Christ for them has already paid their deserved and merited penalty, which is also remission of sins. See the wages of sin is death Rom 6:23

But that universalism is not true.

 

[MrW]

Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved.

So I was not saved from my Mother’s womb. I was born a sinner and I remained a sinner until I believed on the Lord Jesus Christ and was born AGAIN, and became a saint. The same applies to everyone saved after the Cross of Christ.

 

[Brightfame52]

Christ death alone accomplished this perfection and secured unto them the Sanctification of the Spirit and remission of sins Heb 10:16-17

16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

 

[Brightfame52]

But that universalism is not true.

Where did I post all mankind is saved or will be saved ? Dont misrepresent me, thats dishonesty.

 

[MrW]

Where did I post all mankind is saved or will be saved ? Dont misrepresent me, thats dishonesty.

You said iChrist’s sacrifice saved every sinner Christ died for.

Christ died, not for our sins only, but for the sins of the whole world, so your statement is universalism, and incorrect, because many are lost and eventually cast into the lake of fire.

 

[Brightfame52]

@MrW

You said iChrist’s sacrifice saved every sinner Christ died for.

Yes I said that. But I didnt say the other, the other is universalism

 

[MrW]

@MrW



Yes I said that. But I didnt say the other, the other is universalism

But it didn’t save every sinner Christ died for.

If it did, the whole world would be saved, because He died for the whole world.

And if all are saved, that is universalism.

 

[Brightfame52]

Christs death ensures for all whom He died Spiritual Life to serve the Living God !

Heb 9:12-14

12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.


13 For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:


14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

The writer of Hebrews here in showing the superiority of the sacrifice of Christ and His blood over that of sacrificial animal blood, which did produce some effects such as " sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:" HOW MUCH MORE will the sacrificial blood of Christ purge the conscience from dead works, for those He died and effects them unto serving the Living God. This service unto the Living God cant be done by a spiritually dead sinner, hence denoting Spiritual life shall be given.

The word serve in Heb 9:14 is the greek word latreuó and does mean to worship

Its the word Paul used here Phil 3:3

For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.

The circumcision here Paul means has nothing to do with physical circumcision, but circumcision of the heart by the Spirit Rom 2:28-29

28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

The death of Christ shall effect the circumcision that is of the heart, in the Spirit so that those Christ died for shall serve/worship the Living God. This comes with the death of Christ. So anyone that never comes to serving the Living God through the Spirit, Christ couldn't have died for them, lest there was a defect in His death and its effects its promised to effect.

Those who teach that people Christ died for still wind up dead in sin, unregenerate in unbelief teach against Christ and His Blood. 70

 

[Brightfame52]

But it didn’t save every sinner Christ died for.

If it did, the whole world would be saved, because He died for the whole world.

And if all are saved, that is universalism.

It did save every sinner Christ died for. If a person dies unsaved in their sins and unbelief its because Christ didn't die for them.

 

[MrW]

No sir. Absolutely not Bible.

Hebrews 3: 18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?
19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

It’s not because Christ didn’t die for them because the Bible says He died for everyone. No, the fault is not with the Lord, it’s with those who refuse to believe on Him.

Hebrews 4:2
For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard [it].

John 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, [even] to them that believe on his name.

 

[Scarlett O.]

It did save every sinner Christ died for. If a person dies unsaved in their sins and unbelief its because Christ didn't die for them.

i just can't let this one slide.

The concept is not rocket science. I KNOW you and all other reformed members will scoff at me, but here is the truth of God's Word.

Christ died for ALL. Only those who believe that will be saved.

Here's the proof:

• John 3:16 = "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
• John 6:40 = [the important precursor to your verse 44] = "For it is My Father's WILL that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in Him shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day."
• John 11:25 = "Jesus said to her, ' I am the resurrection and the life. WHOEVER believes in Me will live, even though he dies."
• 2 Corinthians 5:14-15 = ."For Christ's love compels us for we are CONVINCED that ONE died for all and therefore ALL died. He died for ALL, that those who live might no longer live for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised again.."

I know that scripture will not convince you for I have read your posts here and on other forums.

As I said, I just could not let this pass.

 

[Brightfame52]

The virtue of Christs death !

It was by His death that the old testament saints received remission of their sins, Hence Heb 9:15

And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

This was indicated when Moses and Elijah spoke with Lord about His death, These two perhaps being representative of the Law and the Prophets. Lk 9:30-31

Old testament saints had an interest in the death of Christ and what it accomplished.

 

[Brightfame52]

i just can't let this one slide.

The concept is not rocket science. I KNOW you and all other reformed members will scoff at me, but here is the truth of God's Word.

Christ died for ALL. Only those who believe that will be saved.

Here's the proof:

• John 3:16 = "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
• John 6:40 = [the important precursor to your verse 44] = "For it is My Father's WILL that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in Him shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day."
• John 11:25 = "Jesus said to her, ' I am the resurrection and the life. WHOEVER believes in Me will live, even though he dies."
• 2 Corinthians 5:14-15 = ."For Christ's love compels us for we are CONVINCED that ONE died for all and therefore ALL died. He died for ALL, that those who live might no longer live for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised again.."

I know that scripture will not convince you for I have read your posts here and on other forums.

As I said, I just could not let this pass.

Those verses have to do with Gods Elect universally, I have no problem with them.

 

[Brightfame52]

No sir. Absolutely not Bible.

Hebrews 3: 18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?
19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

It’s not because Christ didn’t die for them because the Bible says He died for everyone. No, the fault is not with the Lord, it’s with those who refuse to believe on Him.

Hebrews 4:2
For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard [it].

John 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, [even] to them that believe on his name.

Yes, if anyone dies in their sins in unbelief, its because Christ didnt die for their sins which includes unbelief.

 

[MrW]

Christ died for every human, without exception.

 

[Brightfame52]

Christ died for every human, without exception.

Thats false, a false witness.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Those verses have to do with Gods Elect universally, I have no problem with them.

Where does it say that? I don't see it at all. None of those scriptures and there were more I could have added say "us" or "elect" or "some". That has to be an addition to God's Word,

I didn't post those scriptures so that you would have a "problem" with them. I was just pointing out what the truth is.

 

[37818]

Matthew 20:28, ". . . Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many. . . ."

Matthew 22:14, ". . . For many are called, but few are chosen. . . ."

 

[MrW]

Thats false, a false witness.

It’s written by John, in the Bible. Can’t be false.

1 John 2:2 (KJV)
And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for [the sins of] the whole world.

 

[Brightfame52]

It’s written by John, in the Bible. Can’t be false.

1 John 2:2 (KJV)
And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for [the sins of] the whole world.

You posted, so its a false witness.