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Just like the Democrats who must vilify Mr. Trump because their policies are a disaster, this poster falsely claims I have not answered what I have answered. Then claims I am a hypocrite. And so it goes, dishonesty and deflection

That is news to God who has credited the faith o all the believers whose spirits are now in heaven.​

What is the news? That "All have rejected God as revealed to all in creation." Bogus doctrines require bogus claims
What is the truth, some of the lost put their faith in God and His Christ and God has credited their faith as righteousness. Romans 4:4-5, Romans 4:23-25

 

On the contrary, the "how" was the singular point of the post:

What part of John 3 did I "skip?" Note "these things (plural)."

The answer to "How can these things be?" is given by the Lord, He had to be lifted up. When we look at the Exodus account, we see the serpent was "lifted up" to correct an affliction.

The Son of Man's lifting up, that is, His death in our stead—is the means of Regeneration.

In other words, "No man can be born again/from above/of the Spirit if the Son of Man is not lifted up."

Correct. But that is another topic altogether. We are dealing with John 3, and specifically, how men can experience that which Christ spoke to Nicodemus about.

The Son of Man must be lifted up. God sent His Son for that very purpose. Why? So men should not perish, but that they might have everlasting life.

Sorry, I am not a Calvinist, nor am I Arminian in my Theology.

I will present my view of the "Free Will" debate, which I find to be one of the major divisive contentions among believers, and one that can be readily resolved through a little Bible Study: Man is born separated from God. He is without an inherent capability to understand the spiritual things of God. In order for that to take place, he is dependent on God to enlighten him. This has always been the case. Old Testament, New Testament. Old Covenant, New Covenant:

Acts 7:51

51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.

Here we see natural men (for no man was born again in Old Testament Eras) rejecting truth. God does not force one to receive nor reject, each individual makes that determination within the Ministry God performs within their hearts.

Now, something critical to this discussion is understanding that the Gospel of Christ was a mystery, an unrevealed truth prior to the coming of the Comforter on the Day of Pentecost. note the following passage:

Hebrews 10:26-29
26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:

29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

The writer contrasts the "then and now," meaning those during the Era of the Covenant of Law and those within the Era of the New Covenant (which he makes numerous arguments to show the New has been established).

Both have received the knowledge of the truth. How? By the Ministry of the Spirit of Truth. And it is the individual held responsible for rejecting the truth. "Moses Law" is euphemistic for the Covenant of Law. Verse 29 lists elements of the New Covenant.

And the one point I would make (there are many here) is that those rejecting the New Covenant will be held more responsible than those rejecting Moses Law. Why? Because the former rejected a temporary means of relationship with God, whereas the latter reject the Eternal means of relationship.

That is precisely what I pointed out. When Nicodemus asks "How can these things be, he is asking how everything the Lord states can be.

The answer is, "The Son of Man must be lifted up; this is why God sent His Son."

Truly the focus is on the will of God in John 1, and an element of John 3, but the focus is on why God sent His Son in John 3.

As it is throughout Scripture, but I think you missed the point.

And to you.

God bless.

 

Just like the Democrats who must vilify Mr. Trump because their policies are a disaster, this poster falsely claims I have not answered what I have answered. Then claims I am a hypocrite. And so it goes, dishonesty and deflection

 

Okay, no need to make me feel old.

Is it not logical that the "how" would follow the question of "how?" Rather than precede it?

So post the Scripture from John 3 that shows it is the will of God ass a central focus. That's all you have to do.

John 1 defines Regeneration as accomplished by God according to His will (denying Man's efforts), but John 3 is specific to Christ's death. Nicodemus asks how the things Christ states can be accomplished, and the answer is that Christ must be lifted up.

So show me this in John 3.

And you are mixing the context of John 1 with the context of John 3. In John 3, Nicodemus is told he must be born again. He does not understand is replies with the question "Can a man enter into his mother's womb and be born again?" which shows his thinking is physical, rather than spiritual. Christ elaborates (i.e., "You must be born of water and of the Spirit), which leads to "how can these things (plural) be done.

If you can show me another answer to Nicodemus' question I'll be glad to consider it.


God bless.

 

7 `Thou mayest not wonder that I said to thee, It behoveth you to be born from above;
8 the Spirit where he willeth doth blow, and his voice thou dost hear, but thou hast not known whence he cometh, and whither he goeth; thus is every one who hath been born of the Spirit.`
21 but he who is doing the truth doth come to the light, that his works may be manifested, that in God they are having been wrought.` Jn 3 YLT

 

John 3:8 speaks of the effect of the wind as compared to the effect of the Holy Spirit. We cannot see the wind but we can see the result of it. As with the Holy Spirit. Like the wind, the work of the Spirit is mysterious. It cannot be seen, though the changes produced certainly can.

As man cannot control the wind nor can he control the Holy Spirit but unlike the wind the Holy Spirit can and does respond to what man does. The question that needs to be answered is why is one born again? Why does God save a person? John has given us the answer in his letter. Whoever believes in Him, the Son of Man, will in Him have eternal life. That is why the Father sent the Son. He did not send Him to condemn but that the world might be saved through Him.

Jesus was telling Nicodemus that as a teacher of the law He should have known what the scriptures foretold of the coming Messiah and salvation through Him. He then elaborated by speaking of being lifted up/crucified to draw all men to Himself.

Those that believe in the living God will by His grace be saved.

Understanding John 3:1-8 will clear up many errors in ones understanding of salvation

 

@Silverhair, being the Pelagian that he is, probably believes that he chose to be born by his earthly parents also. All these ranting anti-Cals believe that the creature chooses to be born.

 

You do realize that John wrote more than 8 verses. You just have to keep reading to clear up your misunderstanding. John's letter makes it clear that God saves those that respond to Him, they believe.

 

Now is that the best you can do KY? You are right on one point I do not like Calvinism as I see it as a philosophy the trades in doublespeak and calls into question the character of God.

Pelagian, no, not one of those. I actually trust what the bible says about salvation. You know, man can respond via his God given free will to the various means that God has provided to draw him to Himself. Those that freely trust in Him He will, by His grace, save.

Just so you are not confused I will put this in simple terms, man cannot save himself but God only saves those that freely trust in Him.

Think you can follow that KY?

 

Calvinist, no, not one of those.

13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. Jn 1

Think you can follow that Silv?

You've no more say so in your heavenly birth than you did your earthly birth.

 

I understand that this may be a hard concept for you to grasp but the Holy Spirit is God just as the Son is God. Why do you struggle so much with biblical truth?

When we are told that those that believe in the Son, {God} we have eternal life. Joh 3:16

 

You call yourself a PB but you hold to the DoG/TULIP calvinist philosophy.

Ya, I follow it but the question is do you actually understand it KY? It tells us that man cannot save himself only God can and vs 12 tells us why and who God saves.
Joh 1:12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name,

Reading things in context will clear up many of your misunderstandings KY. But what you have to remember is that this was written to Jews who were under the misconception that they being Jews meant they we saved. But it also has application to us gentiles.

 

While this does refer to the "how," it does not change the fact that regeneration and that the new birth is accomplished by the lifting up of Christ is the central focus.

Secondly, we have to take into account that the Lord is speaking about existing conditions, whereas the new birth requires the Cross in order to be accomplished. It is similar to John 14:



John 14:15-17
King James Version

15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.


God bless.

 

Regeneration will not begin until the Comforter is sent on the Day of Pentecost. The existing Ministry of the Spirit in the lives of men will change from the Spirit being with men to the Spirit being in them forever in unending eternal union.

Probably the worst thing about Nicodemus' first question is that, as a teacher, he did not think of the prophecy of Scripture (i.e., Ezekiel 36:24-27, Ez. 39) but responds with physical terms. It is to this question that this that the Lord answers ...

John 3

4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.


And now our question:


9 Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be?

10 Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?

11 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.

12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?

13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:

15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

In regards to the will of God, this is not in question. We must be careful not to go into extremes that leave man's will exempt from the redemptive process. It is true that it is God's will that men be born again, but man can actively reject that will. I view his reception of God's will as reactionary, whereas his rejection is proactive, expressing his natural aversion to that which is righteous.

We must also be careful not to merge economies. New Testament conditions cannot be placed in Old Testament Eras. Nicodemus had no ability to understand the new birth, but he had the ability to understand the Promises of God as given in the Old Testament Scriptures. Thus his rebuke.


God bless.