The Biblical Basis for some Catholic Distinctives

[Yeshua1]

the Baptism was to to have them bne identified as now being saved already by Grace of God, and as now belonging to His people.
Baptism is the outward sign of the interal salvation already done by God, and the person saved is making a public confession of that truth, something babies cannot do!

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Because if you were honest enough to watch these 2 videos, you would fall under conviction for your bias and investigate the reality of Marian apparitions with an open heart and mind, as I did. You ask why I don't continue with stigmata? I could do that because I have unexpectedly experienced stigmata myself in a a way that had an awesome impact on the witness and sealed the 2nd happiest and most important day of my life. "I bear on my body the marks of the Lord Jesus Christ (Galatians 6:17)."

If you are attempting to convince a Baptist that you are not a cult then you failed miserably. This will only serve to confirm you are a bunch of mystics.

 

[Yeshua1]

Yeshua, ever hear of the writings of Hippolytus? no? Here's a quote of his from a work called The Apostolic Tradition
"Baptize first the children, and if they can speak for themselves let them do so. Otherwise, let their parents or other relatives speak for them" (AT 21:16 [A.D. 215]). It was always part of the Traditions of the Church to Baptise infants and children when their parents asked for it. "For the promise was made to you (the adults hearing Peter) and your children......." Acts 2:39 He didn't exclude the children at all. On the contrary. Whole households were Baptised at the request of a single head of the household Acts 16:33 - "He took them in at that hour of the night and bathed their wounds; then he and all his family were baptized at once." Now, if the whole family is Baptised at once, do you not think there were any children?

One other point, since you insist that children weren't Baptised, I want you to produce one single Scripture that says withhold the waters of Baptism from children until a certain age. When you do, I'll eat my Bible, ribbons and all. God bless. Ginnyfree.

The qualification required in the NT was to be believing in jesus as Lord/Savior, can babkies do that? And ONLY the scriptures were inspired by God, No church father was, correct?

 

[Yeshua1]

If you are attempting to convince a Baptist that you are not a cult then you failed miserably. This will only serve to confirm you are a bunch of mystics.

We are just trying to get them to admit that Rome teaches a false Gospel!

 

[Yeshua1]

The Church of Christ was NOT the Church of Rome early on, and all of the recognized canon scriptures were accepted and jin use by early second century!

And Rome did add to the insspired books non inspired books, as its ONLY in those books they can find their doctrines from!

 

[tyndale1946]

If you are attempting to convince a Baptist that you are not a cult then you failed miserably. This will only serve to confirm you are a bunch of mystics.

Steve do not include me in that group I do not bash Catholics or any other group, I do not worship with them, they have their own way of worship... Half of the problems in this world would go away if we would just help each other out without seeing what denomination someone else is... Is your Christianity in Christ or your denomination?... The poor and disheartened of this world just want someone to care, do you?... We have never said anything against any religion in my church, it is not permitted by members or ministers... Gods people come from all walks of life and if they are not Gods people why do they worship him?... I don't worry about how another man or woman worships their God, that is not my concern, that is between them and their God, my concern is how I personally worship mine and how I treat my fellowman... Isn't that what Jesus taught?... Brother Glen

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

We are just trying to get them to admit that Rome teaches a false Gospel!

If they are teaching it then Episcopal/Anglicans, Presbyterians, Reformed, Methodists & some Lutherans are also teaching it.Whats more, many sincerely believe in it.I will be nice & say that it is scriptural interpretation vs intentional going down the wrong road. You can offset that with strong belief in the Trinity, In the divinity of Christ, the incarnation etc.

But what I'd like to know is, if these sacraments all provide grace used to live a christian life & hopefully work to get you into eternity, then what is the job of the Holy Spirit?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Steve do not include me in that group I do not bash Catholics or any other group, I do not worship with them, they have their own way of worship... Half of the problems in this world would go away if we would just help each other out without seeing what denomination someone else is... Is your Christianity in Christ or your denomination?... The poor and disheartened of this world just want someone to care, do you?... We have never said anything against any religion in my church, it is not permitted by members or ministers... Gods people come from all walks of life and if they are not Gods people why do they worship him?... I don't worry about how another man or woman worships their God, that is not my concern, that is between them and their God, my concern is how I personally worship mine and how I treat my fellowman... Isn't that what Jesus taught?... Brother Glen

splendid response Glen....I feel the same way.

 

[Deadworm]

Yeshua1 : "...all of the recognized canon scriptures were accepted and [j]in use by early second century!"

Not only do you refuse to watch videos that refute your position, but you pontificate on the canon without ever reading a solid academic book on canonicity (e. g. by Grant or von Campenhausen). If you had, you'd realize that there was no consensus about the NT canon until after 200 AD.

Yeshua: "And Rome did add to the inspired books non inspired books, as its ONLY in those books they can find their doctrines from!"

First, most Baptists are so close-minded that they lack the integrity to watch posted interviews that decisively refute their position. You are no exception. Both my posted video and my shorter summary of the Catholic biblical position refute your simplistic Gospel perspective. Contrary to your pontification, both provide solid biblical grounding in your Bible. Sigh!

Second, there is no evidence that the current Protestant canon was that used in Jesus' and Paul's day. NT writers use the Septuagint translation and that OT canon included the Catholic apocrypha. Nor can it be shown that the Apocrypha were added after the NT era. Indeed, Jesus uses Sirach 28:3 as inspiration for the Lord's Prayer. Indeed, in 1 Corinthians 2:9 Paul quotes the Apocalypse of Elijah with the canonical formula "It is written." And no, the wording is significantly different than Isaiah 64:4 and the early church father Origen identifies the Apocalypse of Elijah as the source of the quotation. Furthermore, Jude alludes to supernatural events recorded in 1 Enoch and the Assumption of Moses as authoritative.

 

[Yeshua1]

If they are teaching it then Episcopal/Anglicans, Presbyterians, Reformed, Methodists & some Lutherans are also teaching it.Whats more, many sincerely believe in it.I will be nice & say that it is scriptural interpretation vs intentional going down the wrong road. You can offset that with strong belief in the Trinity, In the divinity of Christ, the incarnation etc.

But what I'd like to know is, if these sacraments all provide grace used to live a christian life & hopefully work to get you into eternity, then what is the job of the Holy Spirit?

The Church of Rome teaches that God saves us after we co operate enough with Him thru the Sacraments to be worthy/meriting the salvation, NOT the message of the scriptures!

 

[Yeshua1]

splendid response Glen....I feel the same way.

Paul was very adament on this issue, as he stated that ANY doctriine that was different than the Gospel of Christ revealed to Him for us was to be judged as hellish doctrine, not from God!

 

[Walter]

Steve do not include me in that group I do not bash Catholics or any other group, I do not worship with them, they have their own way of worship... Half of the problems in this world would go away if we would just help each other out without seeing what denomination someone else is... Is your Christianity in Christ or your denomination?... The poor and disheartened of this world just want someone to care, do you?... We have never said anything against any religion in my church, it is not permitted by members or ministers... Gods people come from all walks of life and if they are not Gods people why do they worship him?... I don't worry about how another man or woman worships their God, that is not my concern, that is between them and their God, my concern is how I personally worship mine and how I treat my fellowman... Isn't that what Jesus taught?... Brother Glen

Thank you for a kind and charitable post.

 

[Yeshua1]

Steve do not include me in that group I do not bash Catholics or any other group, I do not worship with them, they have their own way of worship... Half of the problems in this world would go away if we would just help each other out without seeing what denomination someone else is... Is your Christianity in Christ or your denomination?... The poor and disheartened of this world just want someone to care, do you?... We have never said anything against any religion in my church, it is not permitted by members or ministers... Gods people come from all walks of life and if they are not Gods people why do they worship him?... I don't worry about how another man or woman worships their God, that is not my concern, that is between them and their God, my concern is how I personally worship mine and how I treat my fellowman... Isn't that what Jesus taught?... Brother Glen

To clarrify, I am NOT bashing Catholics, as i see them walking in spiritual blindness, but am very against the official teachings/doctrines/dogmas of the Church of rome!

 

[Yeshua1]

Yeshua1 : "...all of the recognized canon scriptures were accepted and [j]in use by early second century!"

Not only do you refuse to watch videos that refute your position, but you pontificate on the canon without ever reading a solid academic book on canonicity (e. g. by Grant or von Campenhausen). If you had, you'd realize that there was no consensus about the NT canon until after 200 AD.

Yeshua: "And Rome did add to the inspired books non inspired books, as its ONLY in those books they can find their doctrines from!"

First, most Baptists are so close-minded that they lack the integrity to watch posted interviews that decisively refute their position. You are no exception. Both my posted video and my shorter summary of the Catholic biblical position refute your simplistic Gospel perspective. Contrary to your pontification, both provide solid biblical grounding in your Bible. Sigh!

Second, there is no evidence that the current Protestant canon was that used in Jesus' and Paul's day. NT writers use the Septuagint translation and that OT canon included the Catholic apocrypha. Nor can it be shown that the Apocrypha were added after the NT era. Indeed, Jesus uses Sirach 28:3 as inspiration for the Lord's Prayer. Indeed, in 1 Corinthians 2:9 Paul quotes the Apocalypse of Elijah with the canonical formula "It is written." And no, the wording is significantly different than Isaiah 64:4 and the early church father Origen identifies the Apocalypse of Elijah as the source of the quotation. Furthermore, Jude alludes to supernatural events recorded in 1 Enoch and the Assumption of Moses as authoritative.

The early church accepted the canon of the OT that was at time of Christ, and that had no Aprocraph books included, and the first generation ECF pretty much had all of their scriptures quotes from what would be recognized duing that later Council!

 

[tyndale1946]

splendid response Glen....I feel the same way.

God is the only one that knows the heart of that man or woman and you don't... Serve your God and tend to your own business and half of the problems in this world would be solved... I have been trying to serve God for over 50 years and their have been atrocities on both sides... Oh man you are without excuse before your God... I have a full time job examining myself without judging someone else... Brother Glen

 

[Yeshua1]

God is the only one that knows the heart of that man or woman and you don't... Serve your God and tend to your own business and half of the problems in this world would be solved... I have been trying to serve God for over 50 years and their have been atrocities on both sides... Oh man you are without excuse before your God... I have a full time job examining myself without judging someone else... Brother Glen

We are commanded by God to earnestly contend for the true faith/true Gospel that saves lost sinners, per Jude 3, correct?

 

[tyndale1946]

We are commanded by God to earnestly contend for the true faith/true Gospel that saves lost sinners, per Jude 3, correct?

Explain to me one thing the thief on the cross... We know according to scripture, he wasn't saved by going to church... He didn't belong to any denomination, so we can rule that out... We can also rule out baptism, he wasn't... He didn't hear the gospel preached so we can also rule that out... Yet his heart was changed by God on a cross, after he had previously railed upon the Son Of God he cursed... The true/faith Gospel that saves lost sinners is the living one... Correct?.... Brother Glen

John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

 

[Yeshua1]

Explain to me one thing the thief on the cross... We know according to scripture, he wasn't saved by going to church... He didn't belong to any denomination, so we can rule that out... We can also rule out baptism, he wasn't... He didn't hear the gospel preached so we can also rule that out... Yet his heart was changed by God on a cross, after he had previously railed upon the Son Of God he cursed... The true/faith Gospel that saves lost sinners is the living one... Correct?.... Brother Glen

John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

Yes, that would be the one paul and all of the Apostles taught, but that is not the one Rome teaches!

 

[tyndale1946]

Yes, that would be the one paul and all of the Apostles taught, but that is not the one Rome teaches!

Why do you being Baptist which I also am concern yourself with what Rome teaches?... Concern yourself with what Christ teaches and leave these children of God alone!... Enough said... Brother Glen

 

[Squire Robertsson]

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