The Christian Party

[Yeshua1]

Scripture does say much about political movements. Some are arguments from silence, granted, but Christ and the Apostles did not engage political forces. Instead they referred to them in lump as "the World".

The question is whether Christians are called out from the World or are called to be a part of both systems. The NT Church believed the former while most today the latter.

Its not either or!

 

[Yeshua1]

I agree. BUT how we act in this world, and who or Whom we represent is important.

I believe Christians should stand for Christ, which mean not only voicing opposition to abortion but also reaching out to those who would consider abortion to be an option.
Christians should stand for Christ, which means caring for the sick and the poor.

But our stand should be for Christ and in Him - not politics. When we become entangled with politics we isolate (in the US) a vast number of lost people who we are trying to reach with the gospel by yoking ourselves to the World and to a political entity that is by definition opposed to God.

What I am saying is that I hold the same Christian values and concerns that you hold. Where you may look to a political party (either the GOP, DNC, Green Party, Libertarian Party, or whatever) to lend your voice, I believe the Church is the best entity.

So no Christian can be a Judge period?

 

[SGO]

Yes, its called the Fall of Adam!

That is a statement from you.
It is not scripture.
And it does not answer, "Everything on earth has sin in it!"
Please show the actual verse (s) that say everything on earth has sin in it.

 

[SGO]

Be nice if we could stop this murder by legislation - but what we need is to change the heart.

So let's not legislate anything.

It's ok to murder if you have it in your heart, especially if it will improve your conditions.
It's ok to steal, if you want it, take it.
It's ok to lie, don't worry about someone calling you on it, because there is no legislation.
Go over the speed limit. They took away the law.
Beat up or slander anyone you want, no legislation.
No law, no guilt, no consequences.

 

[Salty]

So let's not legislate anything.

It's ok to murder if you have it in your heart, especially if it will improve your conditions.
It's ok to steal, if you want it, take it.
It's ok to lie, don't worry about someone calling you on it, because there is no legislation.
Go over the speed limit. They took away the law.
Beat up or slander anyone you want, no legislation.
No law, no guilt, no consequences.

I am not suggesting that we never legislature - If you need to have it spelled out - then I will do so.

 

[SGO]

Although it would seem to suggest you are advocating no law I know better and overstepped my bounds in order to make a point.
I apologize for using you as an example.

"Be nice if we could stop this murder by legislation - but what we need is to change the heart."

Change hearts would be great but how many would rather post on forums like this than go out and win souls besides me?

Legislation would show it down a little maybe. Make people think twice.

Don't work through a party and don't work to change the law for laws are changed through political parties are they not?

 

[JonC]

Though Paul was a Roman citizen his loyalty was to Israel.

Where does your loyalty lie?

 

[Salty]

Where does your loyalty lie?

IMHO you can have more than one loyalty

For example
In the AFC - I am a loyal to the Buffalo Bisons
In the NFC - I am am loyal to the Green Bay Packers

And that will never be a problem - Unless they both win this weekend.................

And then ----- I will let Squire decide........

 

[Quantrill]

What of Adam tilling the soil with the sweat of his face? Is that like being forced to work among the denizens of the red light district? Are there exactly as many enticements and opportunities to for temptation when one is working on the farm?

This new learning amazes me.



That's interesting. Where there is great power and influence and money, there is absolutely no extra temptation at all than if one is selling tickets to the ball game.

What amazes you? Are you that ignorant of Scripture. Apparently so. Did you ever hear of Cain. (Gen. 4:3-4). What a farmer he was. Yet Cain was of the wicked one. He was of the world. He was of the devil. (1 John 3:12)

Temptation lies in accordance with every job. God is with the individual. Not his job.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

Where does your loyalty lie?

My heart lies with Jesus Christ. My loyalty lies with Jesus Christ. This is why I am loyal to my brethren and sistern in Jesus Christ. Which is why I am loyal to my country which is founded on Jesus Christ.

Which is why I oppose your teaching of not supporting America by avoiding voting and politics.

I have answered your question. You never answered mine I asked earlier. Are you a deist? Where does your heart lie?

Quantrill

 

[ad finitum]

What amazes you? Are you that ignorant of Scripture. Apparently so. Did you ever hear of Cain. (Gen. 4:3-4). What a farmer he was. Yet Cain was of the wicked one. He was of the world. He was of the devil. (1 John 3:12)

Temptation lies in accordance with every job. God is with the individual. Not his job.

Quantrill

There is always an anecdote to which one may apply. However, the apparent statistics between farmers and politicians seem to indicate the latter are more susceptible to corruption due to the factors already mentioned. Politicians (most of whom are also lawyers) are famously the subject of mass execution fantasies. Farmers not so much.

Otherwise, one might scoff at the wisdom of avoiding the red light district.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

So let's not legislate anything.

It's ok to murder if you have it in your heart, especially if it will improve your conditions.
It's ok to steal, if you want it, take it.
It's ok to lie, don't worry about someone calling you on it, because there is no legislation.
Go over the speed limit. They took away the law.
Beat up or slander anyone you want, no legislation.
No law, no guilt, no consequences.

Well if it’s OK to murder?!?

 

[Quantrill]

There is always an anecdote to which one may apply. However, the apparent statistics between farmers and politicians seem to indicate the latter are more susceptible to corruption due to the factors already mentioned. Politicians (most of whom are also lawyers) are famously the subject of mass execution fantasies. Farmers not so much.

Otherwise, one might scoff at the wisdom of avoiding the red light district.

An anecdote? Is Scripture an anecdote?

You spoke foolishly. When you are shown to be mistaken, Scripture is an anecdote.

Your fear of politicians is all the more reason for Christians to be involved in politics and in voting. See, you and your ilk whine about voting and now you whine about mass executions done by politicians. Well, you who don't vote bear the responsibility of that.

Quantrill

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

There is always an anecdote to which one may apply. However, the apparent statistics between farmers and politicians seem to indicate the latter are more susceptible to corruption due to the factors already mentioned. Politicians (most of whom are also lawyers) are famously the subject of mass execution fantasies. Farmers not so much.

Otherwise, one might scoff at the wisdom of avoiding the red light district.

Funny

 

[JonC]

My heart lies with Jesus Christ. My loyalty lies with Jesus Christ. This is why I am loyal to my brethren and sistern in Jesus Christ. Which is why I am loyal to my country which is founded on Jesus Christ.

Which is why I oppose your teaching of not supporting America by avoiding voting and politics.

I have answered your question. You never answered mine I asked earlier. Are you a deist? Where does your heart lie?

Quantrill

Your heart lies with Christ so you are obligated to vote (for whatever secular power you believe the most godly).

I think that tells us all we need to know about your theology. Thank you for the engagement.

 

[Quantrill]

Your heart lies with Christ so you are obligated to vote (for whatever secular power you believe the most godly).

I think that tells us all we need to know about your theology. Thank you for the engagement.

Whose 'we'? You got a mouse in your pocket?

Yes, it tells you all you need to know. Of which I am not ashamed. Which is why I answer your questions. So, why don't you answer mine?

Are you a deist? Where does your heart lie?

What engagement? I have more engagement with a crawfish.

Quantrill

 

[ad finitum]

An anecdote? Is Scripture an anecdote?

You spoke foolishly. When you are shown to be mistaken, Scripture is an anecdote.

Wow, what a fool I've been. Thanks for telling me.

Your fear of politicians is all the more reason for Christians to be involved in politics and in voting. See, you and your ilk whine about voting and now you whine about mass executions done by politicians. Well, you who don't vote bear the responsibility of that.

Quantrill

This is the first information I've heard that I didn't actually vote. However, this creates a mystery. I wonder where that "I voted" sticker came from on my shirt? If only you were here to help me solve that one too.

But thanks for straightening me out about avoiding the red light district. There's no need to avoid such places after all. A farm is just as perilous to one's morals.

Let it never be said that one doesn't get the best advice from Christians.

 

[JonC]

Whose 'we'? You got a mouse in your pocket?

Yes, it tells you all you need to know. Of which I am not ashamed. Which is why I answer your questions. So, why don't you answer mine?

Are you a deist? Where does your heart lie?

What engagement? I have more engagement with a crawfish.

Quantrill

We are just about anyone who has been here for over a few years.

When members start off with or resort to ad hominem (what you have been doing) it is a sign that they cannot defend their own positions. It is a move from a substandard understanding.

No, I am not a deist (I am not sure why you would wonder as I have never posted anything remotely akin to that belief).

My heart lies with Christ and the Kingdom of God, not with the powers of this World. That is why I am not becoming involved with political parties.

To engage, you need to be caple of engagement. This comes with maturity. As you grow I think you will become more able to discuss views other than your own.

But start with your own view. Work it out so that you do not have to result to name calling and ad hominem. Once you are capable of defending your position then ease into trying to understand the positions of others.

 

[Salty]

Six hour warning
This thread will be closed no sooner than 630 am EST /330 am PST

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Your heart lies with Christ so you are obligated to vote (for whatever secular power you believe the most godly).

I think that tells us all we need to know about your theology. Thank you for the engagement.

Ie No secular power is godly.