The Crux of Keeping the Sabbath Day Contention

[DHK]

Oh lawd!! Just because they did what was right in their eyes does not mean it was okay to do it.

All scripture is for all believers, is applicable to all believers. In fact, they enjoy all scripture.

On both counts I never said anything different. Why are you saying that I don't believe the Bible, implying somehow that I am an unsaved unbeliever denying the inspiration of the Bible.
That is very kind of you.

I fully realize scripture is for all; I never said otherwise. But as I have said many times It is not applicable to all. I hope you don't APPLY this passage in teaching your children to find a spouse:

Judges 21:16 Then the elders of the congregation said, How shall we do for wives for them that remain, seeing the women are destroyed out of Benjamin?
Judges 21:21 And see, and, behold, if the daughters of Shiloh come out to dance in dances, then come ye out of the vineyards, and catch you every man his wife of the daughters of Shiloh, and go to the land of Benjamin.
--It is Scripture SG. Will you teach your sons to go and steal their wives from girls attending dances??
Is this the relevant truth that we glean from Scripture?
Do the dietary laws of Israel APPLY to us today SG?
Is all the Scripture APPLICABLE to us today?
The obvious answer is no.
But there is a certain clan of posters who, seeing that I have stayed away from the Calvinist forum, have followed me here, just so they can disagree with everything I post. Right?

 

[DHK]

Well here is your problem you think that is a command when it is a commentary on the depravity of man.

What is your problem?
I didn't say the passage is a command.
Is the passage relevant to us today, in that we should do as they did? And the obvious answer is no.
In the same sense we don't need to keep the Sabbath as the Israelites did.
If you would like to address the OP please do that.
If you have come here to just to make personal attacks like some others I know, I request you to leave. I am sure you can find more profitable things to do.

 

[DHK]

Where did I mention the sabbath and SDA? I'm just responding to your discarding of the scriptures. Although from you it should come as no surprise.

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If you are not talking about the Sabbath in this thread then stop talking or posting here.
Have you read the topic?
Have you read the OP?
Have you read the previous nine pages?
Or do you just want to derail the thread?

 

[blessedwife318]

What is your problem?
I didn't say the passage is a command.
Is the passage relevant to us today, in that we should do as they did? And the obvious answer is no.
In the same sense we don't need to keep the Sabbath as the Israelites did.
If you would like to address the OP please do that.
If you have come here to just to make personal attacks like some others I know, I request you to leave. I am sure you can find more profitable things to do.

You referred to it as a command so I just assumed you ment it was a command. Just trying to be helpful by pointing out that it's not really a command Why would you ask if we should follow their example if you didn't think it was a command?

I'm sorry you don't think contending for truth is profitable.

Of course the passage from Judges is revalvent. It shows the depravity of man. If you understood 2 Tim 3:16 you would know that even the OT can teach us and since the Word of God is Living and active it is always relevant in someway. That's the beauty of the Bible is there is always something to learn from what ever part you just read. Of course a high view of Scripture comes from a high view of God and well....

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[DHK]

2 Tim 3:16 "ALL SCRIPTURE is given by inspiration from God AND is to be used for doctrine"
Luke 24: 27 Then beginning with Moses and with all the prophets, He explained to them the things concerning Himself in all the Scriptures."

Your methods.. .condemned by both Paul AND Christ.

What "NT texts" do imagine they were reading in Acts 17:11 ???

"They studied the SCRIPTURES daily to SEE IF those things were so" Acts 17:11

You are in the process of completely destroying your own arguments for "sola scriptura" with Herbert.

You can't have it "both ways"

Herbert as RCC and you are an SDA. Both of you have little in common.
What you have failed to do in this thread is to provide a single verse which commands NT believers to keep the Sabbath Day. There is no such command in scripture.

 

[DHK]

You referred to it as a command so I just assumed you ment it was a command. Just trying to be helpful by pointing out that it's not really a command Why would you ask if we should follow their example if you didn't think it was a command?

Why not follow the conversation?
First here is what I really said:

To Bob Ryan:
Since sola scriptura is only valid when context is taken into consideration, and the context here is the believers of the NT, I am going back to your post and wipe out all OT scripture, for they don't speak of the NT believer. That is step one.

But SG ignores the heart of what I said, and replies:
So, OT scripture isn't applicable to us today? Srsly?
--Obviously, I never said that. I was speaking of Scripture being taken in its context, and that is what I emphasized. You do know that Psalm 14:1 says "There is no God." right? Context!

At this point you jumped in and said "Jesus would disagree with me..." etc.
--No he wouldn't. The subject previously was the Sabbath, and more immediate was taking scripture in context. It is also "all scripture is not applicable to us today," as I have also previously said in this thread. But you wouldn't know that unless you have read the thread.

In answer to SG's statement:
"So, OT scripture isn't applicable to us today? Srsly?"

I replied:
Not all of it.

All of it is inspired and all of it is instructive in some way.
But just as we are not commanded to keep the Jewish Sabbath neither are we commanded to do as they did in the Book of Judges:
Judges 21:25 In those days there was no king in Israel: every man did that which was right in his own eyes.
--Notice I did not say that it is a command to keep. I was using the passage as an example.
Jesus did the same thing with illustrations didn't he. He gave an illustration of the Good Samaritan, and then applied it or issued a command of love from it. He made it relevant to our day.
But this isn't relevant and neither is the passage before it. We don't steal our wives from dances! Duh!

I'm sorry you don't think contending for truth is profitable.

What truth? This thread is about the Sabbath Day!
It sounds like you are contending to be like the one who has to be right!
Stop derailing the thread. If you want to post, post to the OP.

Of course the passage from Judges is revalvent. It shows the depravity of man. If you understood 2 Tim 3:16 you would know that even the OT can teach us and since the Word of God is Living and active it is always relevant in someway. That's the beauty of the Bible is there is always something to learn from what ever part you just read. Of course a high view of Scripture comes from a high view of God and well....

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"It shows...."
It is instructive, as I said. I never denied that.
I said it is not applicable. We do not apply what they were doing to our lives. Instead we apply the truth of the Good Samaritan to our lives.

But then you are off topic. The passage is not applicable to the Sabbath, which this thread is about. You have not contributed anything at all to the topic of this thread.

 

[Internet Theologian]

Who said anything different? .

Actually you did. You stated something along the line that all Scriptures are inspired in some way. Nope. You're wrong. You trivialize some passages especially the OT Scriptures. They are all inspired in the same way. Several have tried to show you this and get you on the right track.

I'm not sure why you're pretending you never said that. Interesting.

When a statement begins "In my experience..." then it means "my experience," in my experience.

Really? You're quoting me now? Using quotation marks is putting words in someone's mouth. For the record I never said that. As to the OP all Scripture is intended for us including the 10 commandments. I am glad the thread was started as it apparently has shown us all how we reverence the Scriptures, all of them, or not. Perhaps now a thread should be started on Exodus 20:16 and of its significance.

 

[Iconoclast]

What is your problem?
I didn't say the passage is a command.
Is the passage relevant to us today, in that we should do as they did? And the obvious answer is no.
In the same sense we don't need to keep the Sabbath as the Israelites did.
If you would like to address the OP please do that.
If you have come here to just to make personal attacks like some others I know, I request you to leave. I am sure you can find more profitable things to do.

Looks like her "problem" is she knows what the Bible teaches about the Lord's Day and then she reads your unscriptural posts encouraging sabbath desecration and she and others do not like what you post.
Who are you to suggest she leave? Blessed wife posts more solidly than you do on a consistent basis. It is the other way around.....she has a biblical grasp of the OT. That eludes you as you suggest the new covenant is only for Israel.

 

[Iconoclast]

Actually you did. You stated something along the line that all Scriptures are inspired in some way. Nope. You're wrong. You trivialize some passages especially the OT Scriptures. They are all inspired in the same way. Several have tried to show you this and get you on the right track.

I'm not sure why you're pretending you never said that. Interesting.

Really? You're quoting me now? Using quotation marks is putting words in someone's mouth. For the record I never said that. As to the OP all Scripture is intended for us including the 10 commandments. I am glad the thread was started as it apparently has shown us all how we reverence the Scriptures, all of them, or not. Perhaps now a thread should be started on Exodus 20:16 and of its significance.

Well IT.....we have all learned by now, you do not have to actually say something.No.....a couple of the mods will take it upon themselves to make up what they wanted you to say,then they attack you for such phantom posting....lol.
It is easier to make up the.post, than to actually deal with any real post.

 

[SovereignGrace]

On both counts I never said anything different. Why are you saying that I don't believe the Bible, implying somehow that I am an unsaved unbeliever denying the inspiration of the Bible.
That is very kind of you.

You have a persection complex. Get over yourself. I never said you did not believe the bible. Per usual, you twist what I say. However, you fracturing the bible? You need called onto the carpet for it. Ppl say the OT is for the Jews and the NT is for Gentiles..or better NT church believers fractures His word. In some way, some shape, some form, or some fashion, all the bible applies to us. I may not have an answer to them all, but MM handled your 1 Chronicles 26:18 verse quite well. Just because you or I may not have an answer to how it applies to us today, does not mean someone else does not, either.

I fully realize scripture is for all; I never said otherwise. But as I have said many times It is not applicable to all. I hope you don't APPLY this passage in teaching your children to find a spouse:

Judges 21:16 Then the elders of the congregation said, How shall we do for wives for them that remain, seeing the women are destroyed out of Benjamin?
Judges 21:21 And see, and, behold, if the daughters of Shiloh come out to dance in dances, then come ye out of the vineyards, and catch you every man his wife of the daughters of Shiloh, and go to the land of Benjamin.
--It is Scripture SG. Will you teach your sons to go and steal their wives from girls attending dances??
Is this the relevant truth that we glean from Scripture?

Yes. I know not to do that. The Israelites had made an oath at Mizpah to not give a daughter to any Benjamite. It seems they realized the tribe of Benjamin would eventually die off because of the oath they made at Mizpah. So they went to Jabesh Gilead at killed all but 400 virgins. They made sent a peace offering to the Benjamites at Rimmon. When they came, the Israelites gave them the 400 virgins, but they were not enough to give every man a wife. Ergo, those verses you posted. The Israelites of the other 11 tribes could not give them of their virgins due to that oath. So they went to that festival and literally took a wife.

What I glean from that? Do not make an oath without realizing the full implications. They took they oath, and then realized one tribe would be wiped out. Do not be hasty in any decision you make.

Do the dietary laws of Israel APPLY to us today SG?

I will say eating their diet would be more beneficial. I love pork, but it kills. However, I may not an answer, I am sure someone can preach a wonderful sermon to show how they were a picture a spiritual truth.

Is all the Scripture APPLICABLE to us today?
The obvious answer is no.

In some way, shape, form, or fashion, they are applicable. I may not have an answer to every verse you throw at me, but that does not mean you've won the debate.

But there is a certain clan of posters who, seeing that I have stayed away from the Calvinist forum, have followed me here, just so they can disagree with everything I post. Right?

We aren't rabid dogs looking to devour you or toss you on your ears. But you have been shown how wrong you are many times, but keep plodding along. Quit posting foolishness and we would say nary a word. Someone has a persecution complex. Cautious

 

[Internet Theologian]

Is all the Scripture APPLICABLE to us today?
The obvious answer is no

You're merely writing your own rules then fighting your own rules while believing you are representing Scripture.

All Scripture is is inspired of God and is profitable.

But there is a certain clan of posters who, seeing that I have stayed away from the Calvinist forum, have followed me here, just so they can disagree with everything I post. Right?

You should be thankful 'the clan' cares that much about truth.

 

[SovereignGrace]

You're merely writing your own rules then fighting your own rules while believing you are representing Scripture.

All Scripture is is inspired of God and is profitable.



You should be thankful 'the clan' cares that much about truth.

The quoted part has Iconoclast and NOT DHK?!? Huh? Wha??

 

[blessedwife318]

The quoted part has Iconoclast and NOT DHK?!? Huh? Wha??

Icon didn't say that. That's weird.

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[DHK]

Actually you did. You stated something along the line that all Scriptures are inspired in some way. Nope. You're wrong. You trivialize some passages especially the OT Scriptures. They are all inspired in the same way. Several have tried to show you this and get you on the right track.

I'm not sure why you're pretending you never said that. Interesting.

You are still off topic. This thread is on the Sabbath, not your grievances.
I am not wrong. I have maintained that all scripture is inspired just as 2Tim.3:16 teaches.
You infer that I lie. You should be reported immediately. I am fed up with you derailing threads by your personal attacks.

Really? You're quoting me now? Using quotation marks is putting words in someone's mouth. For the record I never said that. As to the OP all Scripture is intended for us including the 10 commandments. I am glad the thread was started as it apparently has shown us all how we reverence the Scriptures, all of them, or not. Perhaps now a thread should be started on Exodus 20:16 and of its significance.

http://www.baptistboard.com/threads...bath-day-contention.98242/page-8#post-2218540

I've witnessed this in the past where the OT Scriptures are trivialized and made to be non-effective for the believer and not applicable to them.

"I have witnessed" speaks of your experience. We are basing this discussion on scripture not your experiences, not on your anecdotal experiences, what you have seen, etc.
If you don't know how to use a Bible I suggest you learn.

 

[Internet Theologian]

The quoted part has Iconoclast and NOT DHK?!? Huh? Wha??

Don't know how that happened but I fixed it lolzzzzzzzzzzzz....

 

[Internet Theologian]

"I have witnessed" speaks of your experience. We are basing this discussion on scripture not your experiences, not on your anecdotal experiences, what you have seen, etc.

I didn't make that statement. Either. Note Exodus 20:16

If you don't know how to use a Bible I suggest you learn.

Thanks.

 

[DHK]

Looks like her "problem" is she knows what the Bible teaches about the Lord's Day and then she reads your unscriptural posts encouraging sabbath desecration and she and others do not like what you post.
Who are you to suggest she leave? Blessed wife posts more solidly than you do on a consistent basis. It is the other way around.....she has a biblical grasp of the OT. That eludes you as you suggest the new covenant is only for Israel.

Did you have something to add to this thread which is on the Sabbath?
Or are you here only to add to the insults and personal attacks already given?
If the latter I suggest you leave, go elsewhere, and bother someone else. Do not derail. This thread.

 

[DHK]

You have a persection complex. Get over yourself. I never said you did not believe the bible. Per usual, you twist what I say. However, you fracturing the bible? You need called onto the carpet for it. Ppl say the OT is for the Jews and the NT is for Gentiles..or better NT church believers fractures His word. In some way, some shape, some form, or some fashion, all the bible applies to us. I may not have an answer to them all, but MM handled your 1 Chronicles 26:18 verse quite well. Just because you or I may not have an answer to how it applies to us today, does not mean someone else does not, either.

I never said the Bible was not inspired.
I never said the Bible was not profitable or instructive.
I did say that many parts are not applicable to us today. You want to deny that because of your faulty heremeutical methods. Jesus nailed the law on the cross. The law is no longer "applicable to us today." This thread is on the Sabbath, which is not binding on us today, as are the dietary laws of Israel.
You know I am right but don't want to admit it. But on and on you simply come here to attack me and not to debate the topic or the OP which you haven't addressed. You should be reported for derailing this thread.

Yes. I know not to do that. The Israelites had made an oath at Mizpah to not give a daughter to any Benjamite. It seems they realized the tribe of Benjamin would eventually die off because of the oath they made at Mizpah. So they went to Jabesh Gilead at killed all but 400 virgins. They made sent a peace offering to the Benjamites at Rimmon. When they came, the Israelites gave them the 400 virgins, but they were not enough to give every man a wife. Ergo, those verses you posted. The Israelites of the other 11 tribes could not give them of their virgins due to that oath. So they went to that festival and literally took a wife.

What I glean from that? Do not make an oath without realizing the full implications. They took they oath, and then realized one tribe would be wiped out. Do not be hasty in any decision you make.

I will say eating their diet would be more beneficial. I love pork, but it kills. However, I may not an answer, I am sure someone can preach a wonderful sermon to show how they were a picture a spiritual truth.

In some way, shape, form, or fashion, they are applicable. I may not have an answer to every verse you throw at me, but that does not mean you've won the debate.

We aren't rabid dogs looking to devour you or toss you on your ears. But you have been shown how wrong you are many times, but keep plodding along. Quit posting foolishness and we would say nary a word. Someone has a persecution complex. Cautious

You are not addressing the OP.
You are simply hurling personal attacks at me.
Go get a life and and follow someone else. Address the Op and quit being an embarrassment to yourself. If you don't know how to debate then go back to school and learn.
Nothing, and I mean nothing, you have contributed has added to the subject of this thread.

 

[Iconoclast]

Did you have something to add to this thread which is on the Sabbath?
Or are you here only to add to the insults and personal attacks already given?
If the latter I suggest you leave, go elsewhere, and bother someone else. Do not derail. This thread.

I posted a link that answers all your falsehoods on this topic you must have missed it.

 

[SovereignGrace]

I never said the Bible was not inspired.
I never said the Bible was not profitable or instructive.
I did say that many parts are not applicable to us today. You want to deny that because of your faulty heremeutical methods. Jesus nailed the law on the cross. The law is no longer "applicable to us today." This thread is on the Sabbath, which is not binding on us today, as are the dietary laws of Israel.
You know I am right but don't want to admit it. But on and on you simply come here to attack me and not to debate the topic or the OP which you haven't addressed. You should be reported for derailing this thread.


You are not addressing the OP.
You are simply hurling personal attacks at me.
Go get a life and and follow someone else. Address the Op and quit being an embarrassment to yourself. If you don't know how to debate then go back to school and learn.
Nothing, and I mean nothing, you have contributed has added to the subject of this thread.

Look sunshine...your persection complex needs to go. You'll end up with whiplash looking back at us mean ole Calvinists breathing down your neck wanting to...desiring to...devour you. Get real.

Christ was the summation of the Sabbath. We entered into the Sabbath and are at rest in Him. We are kept by Him, and we keep the Sabbath because He kept it when we could not.

It's not my fault you can't see that, sunshine.