The Gap Theory of Genesis

[Thinkingstuff]

I've made that point before with him, so it won't do any good.

We all speak of the sun moving through the sky and things like this. It's called looking at things from our perspective. I could say that the sun rose at 6:23 A.M. this morning. In absolute terms that statement makes no sense. The sun doesn't rise at all, much less at a particular time. But, in terms of my perspective, it did rise at a particular time. Much is the way we humans, regardless of scientific understanding, speak and write. Thus the bible uses the same phrases, even though there are many verses that point to things then not understood by science.

Where you there? You don't know. Neither do I. We have ancient documents showing what they believed in their age. The fact that we use terms that have been in use for millenia is different from terms newly appropiated. People just spoke about how they observed things.

 

[RAdam]

Where you there? You don't know. Neither do I. We have ancient documents showing what they believed in their age. The fact that we use terms that have been in use for millenia is different from terms newly appropiated. People just spoke about how they observed things.

We have ancient documents showing what secular science and false religion believe in their age. Then we have the bible that has statements that do not go along with either of those, but rather suggest things that secular science wouldn't discover for centuries.

 

[Thinkingstuff]

We have ancient documents showing what secular science and false religion believe in their age. Then we have the bible that has statements that do not go along with either of those, but rather suggest things that secular science wouldn't discover for centuries.

Show me what.

Now let me blow your mind. The bible wasn't hand writen by God. Only four things I know of were hand writen by God himself. The mark on Cain. The Ten commandments, The wall in the book of Daniel, and what ever it was Jesus was writing in the dirt. Now here is another truth about the bible. Not all of the word recorded in the bible are directly from God. In fact, many words are from men reporting their experiences and their perspective based on their current understanding of the world. Did God use that? Sure. So you go ahead and attempt to show me that the bible is a scientific journal explaining things beyond our understanding. The breeding policy that Jacob used is based of observation on simple genetics but it doesn't show that Jacob had a clue about DNA. Just because Laban hadn't a clue doesn't mean other people were. So go ahead try to show me that the bible is a science book.

 

[Alcott]

It's called looking at things from our perspective.

And from what other perspective can we, or the ancients, look at things? With space-time nonexistent, there is no way to put a schedule on it. But like the 4 corners of the earth and the sun hurrying around, the perspective elective is selected to be our corrective directive, whether objective or subjective, without invective.

 

[RAdam]

Show me what.

Now let me blow your mind. The bible wasn't hand writen by God. Only four things I know of were hand writen by God himself. The mark on Cain. The Ten commandments, The wall in the book of Daniel, and what ever it was Jesus was writing in the dirt. Now here is another truth about the bible. Not all of the word recorded in the bible are directly from God. In fact, many words are from men reporting their experiences and their perspective based on their current understanding of the world. Did God use that? Sure. So you go ahead and attempt to show me that the bible is a scientific journal explaining things beyond our understanding. The breeding policy that Jacob used is based of observation on simple genetics but it doesn't show that Jacob had a clue about DNA. Just because Laban hadn't a clue doesn't mean other people were. So go ahead try to show me that the bible is a science book.

That's a sad view of the word of God you have, but I'm surprised. The bible wasn't written as a science textbook, but it is completely scientifically accurate. The bible wasn't written as a history textbook, but it is completely historically accurate. The bible is accurate in every way and contains information not readily understood by man in general at the time of its writing. I despise when people marginalize the supernatural origin of the bible the way you have.

There are verses in the bible that inspired scientists in their search for major discoveries. Matthew Maury, the father of oceanography, was inspired by Psalm 8 to discover and chart systematic ocean currents. Too bad you weren't around to correct his view of the bible.

 

[Revmitchell]

That's a sad view of the word of God you have,

Very sad without any doubt. And a very low view of scripture.

 

[saturneptune]

I look at the Creation this way. It is so far beyond the human imagination to analyze it, there is no choice but to take the account in Genesis literally. As was mentioned above, the Bible is not a book of science or history, but a living, breathing book of faith and grace.

And if I am wrong about the young earth way of looking at things, so what? It is not going to make one ounce of difference in my eternal destiny. What is so ironic about the whole matter is that you could probably settle the question once you get into the presence of the Lord, but my guess is, at that point, you will not care.

 

[matt wade]

In regards to Jerry Vines, I'd like to see what he does believe exactly. I found this:



http://www.sermonsearch.com/content.aspx?id=11205

I don't want to pay the 5 dollars to see the rest of the sermon, so I don't know where it is going with it...

FYI...I sent an email to Dr. Jerry Vines asking his opinion of the Gap Theory and he answered very quickly. His response is as follows:

It would be too lengthy to reply on an email. I do lean toward the gap theory. It is very much a minority view among Bible scholars these days, however. You can find my thoughts on the matter in my book, “24/7.” I would be interested in your research. God bless you.

 

[Salty]

FYI...I sent an email to Dr. Jerry Vines asking his opinion of the Gap Theory and he answered very quickly. His response is as follows:

Just curious, did you link this Bap Board thread to him?

 

[matt wade]

Just curious, did you link this Bap Board thread to him?

No, I just asked him straight away what his opinion on the Gap Theory was. I didn't feel that this debate would be of a lot of interest to him .

 

[preachinjesus]

This may, or may not, be germane to the topic of the thread but you don't have to hold to the gap theory to hold to an old earth.

For instance, I hold to a very old universe and earth while still accepting a literal read of he creation epic. I'd be interested to see if the OP is still around and what other theories they incorporated into their book.

 

[worddigger]

This may, or may not, be germane to the topic of the thread but you don't have to hold to the gap theory to hold to an old earth.

For instance, I hold to a very old universe and earth while still accepting a literal read of he creation epic. I'd be interested to see if the OP is still around and what other theories they incorporated into their book.

If you send me a PM I will give you a .pdf copy of the complete 261 page book. The file is 17mb.

 

[Thinkingstuff]

That's a sad view of the word of God you have, but I'm surprised. The bible wasn't written as a science textbook, but it is completely scientifically accurate. The bible wasn't written as a history textbook, but it is completely historically accurate. The bible is accurate in every way and contains information not readily understood by man in general at the time of its writing. I despise when people marginalize the supernatural origin of the bible the way you have.

There are verses in the bible that inspired scientists in their search for major discoveries. Matthew Maury, the father of oceanography, was inspired by Psalm 8 to discover and chart systematic ocean currents. Too bad you weren't around to correct his view of the bible.

I disagree with you entirely. The bible is very accurate and truthful in all it asserts which is different from being scientifically accurate or historically accurate. Historically it comes from one perspective a jewish one. I am certain that during Joshua's raid into the promised land that the people of the area felt very differently about what was occuring. Women and children and animals being slaughtered as well as the men. Can you imagine? Historically both views would be in consideration. However, the bible is foremost about salvation. Also you forget the nature of revelation in the bible. God is progressively revealed in the bible culminating in Jesus Christ. If men didn't understand something its clearly represented in the bible. And since it wasn't important to salvation there is no need of correction save allowing man to have progressive revelation of God to include changes in his world view. Your contention is that every word in the bible is from God so that would mean these words are from God

"If you are the Son of God, tell these stones to become bread."

or

"If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down. For it is written:
" 'He will command his angels concerning you,
and they will lift you up in their hands,
so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.'"

or

"All this I will give you," he said, "if you will bow down and worship me."

If this is your contention then I find your view of the bible problematic. The truth that no one admits to is this. No one really knows how God created the universe and his words only shed a little light on how he did it. And how God intended it to be understood is not how you probably understand it. You hold to the simple reading which is ok but God is not limited to that. however, its seems you limit God to that. So God's intent on how creation was is based on your reading comprehension which often misses things below the surface.
You say I have a low view of scripture. I say fie on you! I have a high view of scripture. It is you that has a low view. It seems you believe all scripture to be dictated verbatum which limits God. I believe some scripture to be dictated but by in large most scripture was writen via inspiration similar to that of an orchestra playing a singular work of music. God is the conductor. He directs the violinist who using his ability and talent with the violin plays his piece. God directs the brass players as they use their talent of their horns and play their piece. God directs woodwinds and they play their piece just as God intended it. But the music that lifts is exactly what God wants us to hear. Its entirely Gods work but its also the work of each section. That is the power of our God. I think you limit him.

 

[RAdam]

Historically, it speaks of things outside the Jewish nation with absolute accuracy. The bible is the only source of ancient chronology that we have, everything else is a muddled mess.

I didn't say every word was spoken by God, I said every word is God's, meaning it came from Him. When it records the words of Satan to the Son of God, it records them with complete accuracy. How? Noone was there except Satan and Jesus. It came supernaturally from God. Job said God hung the earth on nothing. How did he know that? It came supernaturally from God. Isaiah named Cyrus and would God would move his heart to do over 150 years before the event happened. How? It came supernaturally from God. The historical events in the bible are meticulously record with the utmost accuracy not only on the events themselves but also with respect to placing them in the chronology so that we can date when they occured. No other record of this kind exists anywhere. No other ancient people have an accurate understanding of their own history and the history of the ancient world like the Jews do, and now Christians under the NT. The Persians, the Greeks, the Babylonians, the Egyptians, all their histories are a muddled mess. The bible is truly unique as a completely accurate record that contains completely accurate history and science.

 

[abcgrad94]

If you send me a PM I will give you a .pdf copy of the complete 261 page book. The file is 17mb.

Are you here to make friends and debate and learn or are you just here to promote your book? If you want to debate, then debate. If you want to promote your book, then buy an ad!:BangHead:

 

[worddigger]

Are you here to make friends and debate and learn or are you just here to promote your book? If you want to debate, then debate. If you want to promote your book, then buy an ad!:BangHead:

The gentleman expressed an interest in reading it and I offered to give him a free copy, because he was the only person that responded in this thread who even remotely indicated a genuine interest in studying anything.

 

[webdog]

The gentleman expressed an interest in reading it and I offered to give him a free copy, because he was the only person that responded in this thread who even remotely indicated a genuine interest in studying anything.

Mighty presumptuous of you. Those that disagree with your view have equally studied the topic...we just disagree with your conclusion.

 

[worddigger]

Mighty presumptuous of you. Those that disagree with your view have equally studied the topic...we just disagree with your conclusion.

Well forgive me. Perhaps I should restate the matter. I received the distinct impression that many people here were not interested because of remarks like:

"Do away with the presentation and go back to believing in God's Word, rather than a lie of Satan."

"There is a Greek word for Gap......Boloney! Believe Gods record and don't ADD to it."

"There are no gaps in God. The gap theory is the imagination of early dispensationalist leaders."

"Please don't continue to allow yourself to be sucked into this lie."

Such remarks leave the impression that this place is not exactly an objective environment to "debate and learn" anything, other than how to put other people down who you don't agree with. This place has a hateful spirit to it. I won't seek fellowship here. The administrator may remove my account. I will not be back.

 

[robycop3]

There are hundredsa millionsa fossils in thousandsa museums worldwide, and plain evidence of many geological events that couldn'ta occurred in a short time(erosion of the Appalachian Mts, the formation of "devil's tower" of "Close Encounters Of The Third Kind" fame) all over earth. And over 9/10 of all animal species that ever existed are now extinct. But Scripture sez that at least one pair of EVERY species of animal & bird was aboard the ark, so mosta the extinctions had already occurred.

As for "neanderthal man", there's no dispute that "he" existed, nor that he built shelters & used fire. But does that mean he was a man? Not at all. No man has ever built a more-complex structure than a common beehive or weaver-bird nest. God built this ability into them, but He didn't make them intelligent as He did us. Bees "speak" thru their "dances" & birds thru their "songs", but they can't read one worda Scripture. God coulda simply added the ability to use fire to those which He built into neanderthals.

And there's the little problem of the speeda light. the farthest object we can see with the unaided eye is the Andromeda Galaxy, which is 10 times the siza the Milky Way & is so distant that it takes light some 2.5 MILLION years to reach us. God has allowed us to discover that the maximum speeda light is some 186 K miles/second in a vacuum. We can slow light down to about 38 MPH in certain transparent gels, but we cannot speed it up past the max it reaches in a vacuum.

I believe GOD has preserved all those fossils & geologic evidence to show us empirical. tangible evidence of past ages or epochs. Simple fact is, were it not for GOD'S WILL, there'd be no fossils, etc.

Do I believe in evolution ? NO. If evolution were true, there'd be no bacteria, protozoans, etc. They woulda all evolved into "more advanced" life forms. And neanderthal & other 'cavemen' weren't made in God's own image any more than gorillas are. Only HOMO SAPIENS fills that bill.

Fact is, the earth & the universe are QUITE old. No one can prove otherwise.

 

[abcgrad94]

Such remarks leave the impression that this place is not exactly an objective environment to "debate and learn" anything, other than how to put other people down who you don't agree with. This place has a hateful spirit to it. I won't seek fellowship here. The administrator may remove my account. I will not be back.

We're not putting YOU down, worddigger. We're putting down the theory. This board is not a place for the faint of heart, true. If you earnestly believe something to be true, be prepared to defend it because this is a debate section and that's what we do here. If someone shoots your theory full of holes, defend it or change your view. Don't run away and take your cookies with you.

Maybe you just got off on the wrong foot by touting your book right off the bat. See, there are many published writers here, but we get to know each other before advertising our credentials. So, try again. Try getting to know us in the fellowship forums if the debate area isn't for you. Don't run away all offended. We're not as mean as you think we are.