The Gap Theory

[agedman]

I read a whole lot of conjecture on this thread, and a few rabbit trails. Typical of the BB.

Ultimately, I think all of us who have had basic university level course work would acknowledge that at times we are to learn what we would disagree as a "Biblical" view.

The fact that some on this thread can actually present argument for or against the theory is a demonstration of learning that is able to help others through the massive deceptions and ill conceived views that hook the public interest.

One just proclaiming it wrong or evil, is not enough. One must show what facts, they would contend for that view or consider what facts they would use to refute it.

It is important to continue education and develop the skill to restate to the level of the professor's desire whatever the teaching may be. Ultimately, it matters very little if there is agreement, but being able to state what is expected to the degree expected.

Personal agreement or disagreement may be held or expressed, depending upon the expectations of the professor and teaching style.

Learning is never to be solely an intellectual pursuit because that will puff up the person.

Learning is to be a tool to access when witnessing - being able to converse on a knowledgeable level with all men is a great part of being educated.

 

[Aaron]

So where would you fit int he dall of satan, and rebellion in heaven, as he fell before Adam and Eve fell!

It isn't part of the narrative. Genesis 1 describes only the creation of the heavens, the space overhead—not Heaven, as in the world of spirits—and the earth. It isn't about the creation of angels.

I would say he fell before the foundation of the earth.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

I would say he fell before the foundation of the earth.

How do you deal with the fact that there was no "here" here before the foundation of the Earth was laid?

 

[kyredneck]

Oh the irony; how many of the loudest gap theory bashers make no bones of inserting a thousands of years gap in between the 69th and 70th week of Daniel? Lol...

 

[Jkdbuck76]

So I have a professor who believes in the Gap theory, I do not.

Do you? Why or Why not?

No. I do not have a professor. That is because I graduated college
in 1999.

 

[percho]

So where would you fit int he dall of satan, and rebellion in heaven, as he fell before Adam and Eve fell!

And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.

Where was Satan the devil on this day. This Satan the devil that old serpent.
And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: from Rev 12:9

This devil. from Heb 2:14 he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

The power of death? What death? The death that would come about to: But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot: Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, from 1 Peter 1:19,20 This lamb? of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
from Rev 13:8

On day four the Christ, the lamb was going to succumb to death of which Satan the devil had the power thereof.

When did he obtain this power? Was the power of death and darkness present on the earth in verse 2 of Gen. 1?

To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, from Acts 26:18


Why was the Lamb already slain?

 

[Deacon]

John Sailhamer in his book, Genesis Unbound, proposes that Genesis 1:1 refers to the creation of the universe, which took place during an undefined period of time.
Genesis 1:2 is described as the preparation of the Promised Land for human habitation and the creation of the first humans during a literal week just thousands of years ago.

He calls this theory historical creationism but it is a form of the Gap theory - probably the best presentation of it I have read.

Rob

 

[Aaron]

How do you deal with the fact that there was no "here" here before the foundation of the Earth was laid?

Not sure what you're asking.

Are you of the impression that this expanding, three-dimensional plane of space-time is the only world?

 

[Aaron]

Ohhhhhhhhhhh! You think the angels were banished to the earth!

Poppycock.

 

[quantumfaith]

John Sailhamer in his book, Genesis Unbound, proposes that Genesis 1:1 refers to the creation of the universe, which took place during an undefined period of time.
Genesis 1:2 is described as the preparation of the Promised Land for human habitation and the creation of the first humans during a literal week just thousands of years ago.

He calls this theory historical creationism but it is a form of the Gap theory - probably the best presentation of it I have read.

Rob

I have not read Sailhammer's work on the topic. Will have to put that on the list. From what you have stated, it is completely within reason that the movement from Genesis 1:1 to Genesis 1:2 is hinting at the Big Bang and subsequent inflationary event leading to (from our perspective) the early "chaos" of the cosmos.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Not sure what you're asking.

Are you of the impression that this expanding, three-dimensional plane of space-time is the only world?

No, I mean there was no Earth for Satan to be rule over before the foundation of the Earth was laid. The Bible says Satan is "god" of this world. It doesn't say anything about Him being given authority anywhere else. That is because, whether there is life on the other worlds in this universe or not is irrelevant, the Bible just deals with this one.

 

[Aaron]

No, I mean there was no Earth for Satan to be rule over before the foundation of the Earth was laid.

So? His creation and fall are not part of the narrative and did not happen in time. There was a beginning of time, and there will be an end of time, and the creation and fall of angels are an event outside of time.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

So? His creation and fall are not part of the narrative and did not happen in time. There was a beginning of time, and there will be an end of time, and the creation and fall of angels are an event outside of time.

The very first thing God did was create light in verse 3 of Genesis 1, which He says in verse 4 divided day from night. Therefore, all the rest of creation occurred in time, not outside of it.

 

[Deacon]

I have not read Sailhammer's work on the topic. Will have to put that on the list. From what you have stated, it is completely within reason that the movement from Genesis 1:1 to Genesis 1:2 is hinting at the Big Bang and subsequent inflationary event leading to (from our perspective) the early "chaos" of the cosmos.

I dismissed the Gap theory years ago but after reading Sailhammer's book, I dropped my initial objection.
There are a pleathora of books on creation - most of them are junk IMO but Genesis Unbound is a worthwhile contribution to creation studies; it's a top shelf keeper! It was recently reprinted and very much worth the time spent reading it - even if you don't fully agree.

According to Sailhamer, the initial word in Genesis ("in the beginning") is an undefined period of time.
He compares it to the phrase, "in the beginning of a race". It could encompass the first few steps or quite a bit of the entire race.

His theory in effect takes the aspect of science out of the biblical interpretation.

Concerning the initial post: If I was a student of someone who took a position different from mine, I'd learn and politely express interest without injecting an opinion - students are there to learn from him - not you.
To close your mind to a position and refuse to learn earns you a failing grade.

Rob

 

[percho]

If before the foundation of the world the Lamb of God was determined to come, being made a little lower than the angels for the purpose of death, (Heb. 2:9, 1 Peter 1:19,20) a status yet to be created, that is lower than the angels, to destroy him who had the power of death, by death (Heb 2:14) that is Satan the devil, does that not at the very least imply death/darkness was present on the earth in Genesis 1:2?

Was not the very purpose of the "creation," of the man in the image of God for the bringing forth of the Christ, the Son of God, as of a lamb?

Acts 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.


What was, the God, doing?

I do not believe the earth of Gen. 1:1 was in the condition of the earth of Gen. 1:2.

God was about address this change through a Son born of a woman taken from a man made in his image, created a little lower than the angels. Reconciling the world unto himself.

 

[percho]

No, I mean there was no Earth for Satan to be rule over before the foundation of the Earth was laid. The Bible says Satan is "god" of this world. It doesn't say anything about Him being given authority anywhere else. That is because, whether there is life on the other worlds in this universe or not is irrelevant, the Bible just deals with this one.

Did the foundation of the earth and the foundation of the world take place at the same time or was the foundation of the world a system laid down on an existing earth for the purpose of God to reconcile unto himself?

That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: Eph 1:10 KJV

because the creation itself also will be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. Romans 8:21 NKJV

Why?

For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it in hope; Verse 20

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Did the foundation of the earth and the foundation of the world take place at the same time or was the foundation of the world a system laid down on an existing earth for the purpose of God to reconcile unto himself?

Genesis 1, (NASB)
2 The earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was moving over the surface of the waters.​

In the use of the Hebrew tohuw bohuw, in the above verse -- "formless and void" -- God was saying there was nothing here. The words are translated to their literal English meaning in that passage. Emptiness, nothinginess, void. There was no Earth, just the space God had reserved in which to speak it into being. Further, God wasn't moving across the surface of waters that were on Earth, since it is made quite clear here that there was nothing here, not water, not anything. God was "moving across the surface of the waters" that were the vapors of space. Moses had no word for "nebulae" or "space gases" so he spoke of what he knew.

That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: Eph 1:10 KJV

because the creation itself also will be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. Romans 8:21 NKJV

Why?

For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it in hope; Verse 20

All very true, but totally irrelevant to the discussion of whether or not Earth was spoken into being with the heavenly bodies, formed from the vapors of space ("surface of the waters") as were the other heavenly bodies, as per verses six and seven.

 

[quantumfaith]

I dismissed the Gap theory years ago but after reading Sailhammer's book, I dropped my initial objection.
There are a pleathora of books on creation - most of them are junk IMO but Genesis Unbound is a worthwhile contribution to creation studies; it's a top shelf keeper! It was recently reprinted and very much worth the time spent reading it - even if you don't fully agree.

According to Sailhamer, the initial word in Genesis ("in the beginning") is an undefined period of time.
He compares it to the phrase, "in the beginning of a race". It could encompass the first few steps or quite a bit of the entire race.

His theory in effect takes the aspect of science out of the biblical interpretation.

Concerning the initial post: If I was a student of someone who took a position different from mine, I'd learn and politely express interest without injecting an opinion - students are there to learn from him - not you.
To close your mind to a position and refuse to learn earns you a failing grade.

Rob

Rob,

Have you read Genesis 1-4 A Linguistic, Literary and Theological Commentary by C. John Collins.... Just wonder if Sailhammer's work is similar in nature.

 

[Aaron]

The very first thing God did was create light in verse 3 of Genesis 1, which He says in verse 4 divided day from night. Therefore, all the rest of creation occurred in time, not outside of it.

The first thing He did was create the deep, from which the earth and heavens were formed.

But this has nothing to do with the creation of angels. They were already there, Job 38:4-7.

 

[Aaron]

God was "moving across the surface of the waters" that were the vapors of space.​

No, it was the deep. It was liquid water. From those waters God formed the heavens and the earth.​