The Gospel of YOUR Salvation !

[BrotherJoseph]

Brother Darrell,

I never received a response to this post #236, thus I am quoting it again and hope for a response.

Brother Darrell,

Thanks for your replies. I have not read them all, but hope to read them in the upcoming days and if I have any thoughts I will post replies. As I see it, because you believe Jesus died for all men, you have a problem because there are so many verses of scripture that teach so much was actually, not potentially accomplished by the atonement that it must only be applicable to the elect, otherwise there would be nobody going to Hell. Consider all the following verses/thoughts-

Scripture teaches us the atonement was more than just a pardon, but in fact a substitutionary atonement, thus it must be limited. Peter declares, "24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed". If our sins were already "bore" and we our "healed" by his stripes, God cannot than make someone "bore" their own sins again and "unheal" them.
Moreover, Jesus was said to actually have been literally "made sin" on behalf of those he died for. We read, "For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin" (1 Corinthians 5:21a). He poured out the wrath of God on his son by forsaking him on the cross, thus he cannot pour out his wrath again on those he died for.

Further, the word "ransom" is also used in scripture in reference to the atonement, "For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many" (Mark 10:45). God would not be just to collect a ransom two times-one on Calvary and once on the sinner by sending them to Hell.

Finally, the atonement could not apply to all men because of what scripture tells us it actually accomplished (not potentially accomplished). The Bible has many passages of scripture that makes this undeniably clear-
"For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified" (Hebrews 10:14)
"For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life" (Romans 5:10)
"Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him." (Romans 5:9)
"Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:" (Galatians 3:13)
"In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace" (Ephesians 1:7)
"By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all." (Hebrews 10:10)

Thus according to the scriptures above, the atonement accomplished perfection (our position before God), reconciliation, justification, redeemed us, forgave us our sins, and sanctified us (i.e. set us apart) before God, therefore how could it possibly apply to every human being who ever lived? It simply can't.


God bless,

Brother Joe

 

[BrotherJoseph]

You're forgetting that these people...knew about God.

These are not people ignorant of God.

Now ask yourself...why did they know in the first place? Do you think that God revealed His will to them so he could have an excuse to judge them?




Notice that "what may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them."..

Brother Darrell,

The passage we are discussing that you commented on above is Romans chapter 1. So what is they knew there was a God as it is written "Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble." (James 2:19) ? Are we to infer that God loves the devils too because they also know there is one God? Therefore, I will reiterate what I asked you in a prior post on Romans 1, "This passage says not one word about the "love of God". What verse in the above passage mentions the "love of God", moreover what verse in the above passage says that this "love" extends to every human being?"

Also, God doesn't need an "excuse" to judge the wicked. "That the wicked is reserved to the day of destruction? they shall be brought forth to the day of wrath" (Job 21:30) also, "The Lord hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil" (Proverbs 16:4), and again, "And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto [B]also they were appointed[/B]" and finally, "What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction" (Romans 9:22)

Brother Joe

 

[BrotherJoseph]

Nobody is indwelt until they receive the Gospel....

On the contrary, everyone is indwelt with the Holy Spirit before they put faith in the gospel. Do you believe Cornelius was unsaved prior to Peter preaching the gospel to him? Also, how do you explain John the Baptist being indwelt from his mother's womb? "...and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb" (Luke 1:15)

One is nor regenerated so they can believe, but are born again because they believe.....

You have already correct admitted that faith is a fruit of the Spirit (as it states in Galatians), therefore how can one have faith without first having the Spirit in them that produces that faith? Also, Jesus said, "A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit" (Matthew 7:18), thus how can a sinner with an evil nature bring forth the good fruit of faith as Jesus said, "neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit"?

We cannot deny the part the Word of God, in this Age the Gospel of Christ, has in man's new birth:


1 Peter 1:22-23

King James Version (KJV)

22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.


James 1:18

King James Version (KJV)

18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures......

Brother Darrell, the "word" mentioned in James 1:18 and 1 Peter 1:23 that makes one born again is not the preached word, but rather Jesus himself mentioned in John 1:14, "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us". The scriptures themselves do not give life, but testify that Jesus himself does this as Jesus said, "Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me" (John 5:39)

This is of the pre-Pentecost Era.

No-one was born again at this time......

You say this in response to what Jesus said in John 8:43, "Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.", but if nobody was born again before the pre-Pentecost era why did Jesus tell Nicodemus, "3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." (John 3:3)? Moreover, if what your asserting is true, that one becomes born again at the time they believe the gospel, why did Jesus compare how one becomes born again to being like unto the wind that you cannot tell "whence it cometh, and whither it goeth", "8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit" (John 3:8)? This would not be true in the case of gospel regeneration, because one could point to a specific time they trusted the gospel and thus received the Holy Spirit, thus how could that be like the wind?

No, mankind is not free to choose. He cannot choose to be saved.

Only God can enlighten a man and give him that opportunity.

You actually cancel your point in saying he is free to choose, and I reject free will totally.......

I said, "mankind is free to choose according to his nature which is totally evil". In a similar manner a dog can choose to walk, but not fly because he has no wings, likewise those without the spirit can only choose to reject the gospel because mankind is totally depraved. For gospel regeneration to be true, you need to deny that mankind is totally depraved, otherwise how can they repent and believe the gospel?

That era has nothing to do with regeneration. No-one was born again until after Pentecost. Only in this Age have men been made acceptable to come into God's presence in Heaven. Sins still remained to the account of even men like Abraham and David, Elijah and Moses........

I am not gong to debate you on what you said about Abraham, David, etc, though I disagree with you, it would just take us off the topic of this thread. At any rate, I quoted Genesis 6:5, " "And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually" only to prove my point that a man not indwelt with the Holy Ghost cannot believe the gospel due to his nature, or do you think the nature of mankind has changed since Genesis 6:5? Paul said in Romans 8:8, "So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.", but wouldn't it be very pleasing to God if someone in the flesh without the Holy Ghost could have faith in the gospel to become born again, as you assert is possible?

However, that does not mean men are quickened so they can believe.

You realize you defeat the Sovereignty of God as well as Eternal Security with this well intentioned, but unscriptural position, don't you?

This does not negate eternal security because men are quickened so they WILL (not can) believe. "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:" (John 10:27), notice they will not fail to follow Jesus and believe. Also scripture makes it clear that all who believe will subsequently never perish. "And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die" (John 11:26)

Brother Joe

 

[BrotherJoseph]

You are correct, though, Christ makes it clear that even Moses was dead:...

How can a man dead in sins, do anything spiritually such as believing the gospel? They can't, that is why one must first be regenerated in order to believe and obey the gospel.

Could you show me where it says that we must be regenerated to believe?:...

I can give you tons of passages throughout the entire Bible that constitutes the doctrine of "total depravity". This doctrine means that by nature a human being cannot do anything that God would consitute good such as repent and believe the gospel, therefore one must logically conclude that you first have to be regenerated and have the Holy Spirit to believe the gospel. Do you believe the doctrine of total depravity is taught in scripture?

You're missing the primary point: they had to hear the Gospel to be held guilty of failure to obey.

What scripture tells you one must hear the gospel in order to be found guilty? My Bible tells me that everybody is guilty because they do not keep the law of God, hence that is why someone needs Christ's death to be righteous "Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God" (Romans 3:19).

Also, if one has to hear the gospel to be held guilty, why preach the gospel at all, because if nobody hears it, according to your logic, nobody will then be found guilty? I guess, per your logic, more people are going to Hell these days because the gospel is being preached to more people across the world, then was in the days of the apostles when the heathen nations had not the gospel (e.g. American Indians, etc)?

Brother Joe

 

[BrotherJoseph]

That does not nullify the fact that those things are in fact revealed by the Spirit. That's the whole point Paul is making, that the Gospel was a mystery not revealed to men at all, and revealed now to men by the Spirit:


1 Corinthians 2:6-10

King James Version (KJV)

6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:

7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.


Most see the quote as speaking about Heaven, but it is not. It speaks about the Gospel...
The context is not one which supports the doctrine that men have to be saved to understand and believe. .

Let us look at the passage a little more in depth. You left off at verse 10, I will post through verse 12, "10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God."

Reread the portions I have highlighted in bold in verse 10-12. It is apparent God reveals them #1 "by his Spirit" (verse 10), thus you must first have his Spirit for him to reveal them to you. # 2 man can knoweth "the things of God...,but the Spirit of God" (verse 11), thus a prerequisite to knowing things such as the gospel is first having the Spirit in you. #3 God's children first "received...the spirit which if is of God, that we might know the things...of God" (verse 12). In this verse what comes first the receiving of God's spirit or the knowing the things of God? It clearly states we receive the Spirit of God THAT we might know the things...of God.

He died for the world:


John 1:29

King James Version (KJV)

29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

Brother Darrell, if the word "world" in John 1:29 means every human being , nobody would Go to hell as the Lamb of God it states has "taketh away" their sin. One who has no sin imputed to them, does not get dammed.

God bless,

Brother Joe

 

[savedbymercy]

Saved, then Called !

2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

In the matter of Salvation and the Gospel, One must be saved [born again] first, in order to be called, then they[The Saved/Called] believes the Gospel of their Salvation Eph 1:13, for its not the Gospel of your Salvation if you are not saved ! Thats Pauls order here in our text, God has first Saved us, by His Purpose and Spirit, and afterwards Called Us.

The saving here is done by the Holy Ghost Titus 3:5

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

The saving here is from the power of sin, not the penalty of sin !
The Work of Christ alone saved us from the penalty of sin, and the Spirit as a effect of that, shall save us from the power of sin by new birth/regeneration !

So He saves us in this regard by giving us New Life, sent by Christ 1 Cor 15:45

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

And out of this giving of Life is given Spiritual Ears to Hear, to Hear the Gospel of Our Salvation Eph 1:13

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Ye must be of the Truth to Hear the Truth Jn 18:37

37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice[In the Gospel].

Understand something, there is no Spiritual Hearing without or apart from Spiritual Life, just like there is no physical hearing apart from physical life and a hearing ear thats not deaf !

Now lets observe again the very same order of first being Saved [born again] by the Spirit, then Called by the Gospel unto belief of the Truth 2 Thess 2:13-14

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

The Sanctification of the Spirit here is the same activity described in Titus 3:5, its a saving and setting apart work, which is preceded the Belief of the Truth via the Call of the Gospel Vs 14 !

There is no way around this order, its Saved then Called ! The Gospel is the Power of God to the Saved 1 Cor 1:18

18 For the preaching of the cross or Gospel is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved[In a Spiritually saved state] it is the power of God.

The Aramaic Translation captures the meaning here:

The message of the crucifixion is insanity to the lost, but to those of us who have life it is the power of God.

That is who Have Life from Christ by the Spirit, it is the Power of God !

The Gospel to the Ones who have Life begins to cure our unbelief, grants us repentance from lies to the belief of the Truth See 2 Tim 2:25 !

Being saved here in 1 Cor 1:18 is in the present tense, and passive voice, the saved will be continually being saved [from error] by the Power of the Gospel,

But now if we be not saved or have not Spiritual Life at the Preaching of the Gospel, then we are in peril of being of those who are lost and perishing, and though they may physically hear the Gospel Doctrines and Truths, but yet still in the state of nature, the Gospel serves to them in the Purpose of God, as a message of death unto death 2 Cor 2:14-16

14 Now thanks be unto God, which always causeth us to triumph in Christ, and maketh manifest the savour of his knowledge by us in every place.

15 For we are unto God a sweet savour of Christ, in them that are saved, and in them that perish:

16 To the one we are the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things?

But in order to be called by the Gospel to Faith, we must already be experimentally Saved by the Spirit !

 

[savedbymercy]

The Gospel being the Power of God

Rom 1:16

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

When is the Gospel being the Power of God ? Its only when those hearing it are being caused to believe it. Its not the power of God when its merely being preached, but when its being accompanied by the Holy Spirit, He performing His powerful Sanctifying Work with it, 2 Thess 2:13-14

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through/in sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Belief of the Truth is the result of the Spirits Sanctification, He must make us first experimentally Holy unto the belief of the Truth,

So when the Gospel is a companion with the Spirit, it comes bringing with it Salvation, Conversion, producing faith, belief and conviction, assurance of the Truth, as here stated by Paul 1 Thess 1:4-5

4 Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.

5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.

That word Power here dunamis is the same word Paul uses in Rom 1:16

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

This Gospel as it is being the Power of God in the Hands of the Spirit, it converts us out of the Prison of Unbelief, delivering us unto the belief of the Truth !

Thats when the Gospel is the Power of God, when it makes believers out of us, If one hears the Gospel, and continues in unbelief, then to them, it was not being the Power of God, for God's Power cannot be overcome by mans will, that would be Blasphemous to even consider ! To them therefore, it was designed by God to be a message of death 2 Cor 2:14-16

14 Now thanks be unto God, which always causeth us to triumph in Christ, and maketh manifest the savour of his knowledge[The Gospel of God] by us in every place.

15 For we are unto God a sweet savour of Christ, in them that are saved, and in them that perish:

16 To the one we are the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things?

 

[savedbymercy]

The Gospel being the Power of God !2

When God is causing the Gospel to be His Power unto Salvation, to them believing, its when the Born again Elect Vessel of Mercy Hears it, and of course head of Christ, they obey Him, Obey His Gospel, submit themselves to Him, as was foretold in the Psalms both in Ps 18:44

44 As soon as they hear of me, they shall obey me: the strangers shall submit themselves unto me.

They wont be like those who dont obey the Gospel Like these Rom 10:16

16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

Or those who dont submit to its Righteousness Rom 10:3

3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

But in the Fay of God's Gospel Power and strength they wiil be made willing Ps 110:3

3 Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.

They shall be made willing servants, Like Saul, all the sudden became a willing servant by the Power of God Acts 9:3-6

3 And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:

4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?

5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

6 And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.

Saul whom we now know as Paul was made willing in the Day of Christ's Power, and that Light that shined around about him in Vs 3, also symbolizes the Light of the Gospel 2 Cor 4:5-6

5 For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake.

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

God gives the Light of the Gospel by Sovereignly shining it in our Heart by the Power of the Holy Spirit, this was also promised to the Gentiles Isa 42:6

I the Lord have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

Lk 2:32

A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel.

Acts 13:46-48

46 Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God/Gospel should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.

47 For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.

48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

They Glorified the Word of the Lord, by after hearing it, they submit themselves unto it as the Word of God foretold Ps 18:44

44 As soon as they hear of me, they shall obey me: the strangers shall submit themselves unto me.

The Gentiles were strangers Eph 2:12

12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

 

[Don]

But in the Fay of God's Gospel Power and strength they wiil be made willing

Would you please define "Fay," especially in the context in which you've used it? Thanks.

 

[savedbymercy]

Would you please define "Fay," especially in the context in which you've used it? Thanks.

It should be day !

 

[Don]

Thank you.

 

[savedbymercy]

Salvation is of the Lord !

Jonah 2:9

9 But I will sacrifice unto thee with the voice of thanksgiving; I will pay that that I have vowed. Salvation is of the Lord.

Many today in false religion will make this claim that " Salvation is of the Lord", but only to fulfill the words of Paul here 2 Tim 3:5

Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

They talk a good game, but thats it ! This applies most especially to those people who teach and believe that the Almighty desires the Eternal Salvation of many who shall never be saved through Christ, which thinking proves that there is no real belief that Salvation is 100 % of the Lord, and God failed to accomplish through Christ all that He desired which contradicts Job 23:13

13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.

All such belief and teaching of Salvation that allows for that Dishonors God and all of His Attributes !

But Preaching and Teaching that Honors God and the Truth that all Salvation is of the Lord, the Triune God, is when it sets forth the Role of the Father in Salvation, then of the Son, and then the Holy Spirits !

 

[savedbymercy]

The Gospel comes with Power to God's Elect !

We read of Rom 1:16

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

Yet this is not true of all and everyone, but only to God's Elect in the time of their conversion by it, predetermined by the purpose of God. Another passage which speaks of the Gospel being the Power of God is here 1 Thess 1:4-5

4 Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.

5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.

Paul says thats how we know your ELECTION OF GOD because we are observing the effects of the Gospel towards you in the hands of the Spirit of God, its bringing with it assurance !

This word assurnace means assurance of Faith as it is used in Heb 10:22

22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

Its [The Gospel in the Hand of the Spirit] produces assurance of Faith, for what is Faith but the assurnace of things hoped for Heb 11:1

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

That word substance hypostasis means:

confidence, firm trust, assurance

Some translations read:

Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen.ESV

Now faith is assurance of things hoped for, a conviction of things not seen. ASV

This is what the Gospel brings if and when in the purpose of God its being His Power unto Salvation.

When its this, believing confidence is produced. This is to the Elect Paul says !

To the non elect, the Gospel comes IN WORD ONLY and leaves them in unbelief, and at best they become a stony heart believer who shall defect from it in the by and by Matt 13:20-21

20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;

21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended. See sequel in Lk 8:13

13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.

They have no root, which is Life from Christ ! Rom 11:18

Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.

To sum it up, when the Gospel is being the Power of God unto Salvation Rom 1:16 it comes to the Elect in the Power of the Holy Spirit, bringing with it assurance of Faith, and that is why it is the Power of God unto Salvation, not to everyone, but to everyone who is believing, and hence if they who hear it are not believing it, then to them, in the purpose of God, it was not the Power of God, and it was not specifically sent to them to hear as a word of Salvation !

 

[savedbymercy]

Sometimes a Savor unto death !

2 Cor 2:15-16

15 For we are unto God a sweet savour of Christ, in them that are saved, and in them that perish:

16 To the one we are the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things?

Today in false religion, the relgions of the beast, the prevailing thought is that the Gospel is to be Preached in matters of Salvation to all without exception, that all have a chance to believe it and get saved. Its to be preached to all the world Matt 24:14

14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Rev 14:6

6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,

However that is a false notion, for the Gospel in the purpose of God, was purposed to be a message of death [not good news] and condemnation to them that are perishing, to them that are lost 2 Cor 4:3

3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

The word lost here apollymi is the same word Paul uses in 2 Cor 2:15 but its translated perish

15 For we are unto God a sweet savour of Christ, in them that are saved, and in them that perish:

To them in Gods Purpose, unknowing to them, the Gospel message is a message to them that seals their doom and perdition.

In 2 Cor 2:16 it reads

16 To the one we are the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things?

To those who are in a lost state or a perishing state, the Gospel Minister and his Message of the Gospel is a savor of death unto death !

In the greek we have the word death in the genetive case as to say, we are a savor ek out of,from/ death unto eis death. The word eis a prep that means:

into, in, unto, to, upon, towards, for, among

eis (a preposition) – properly, into (unto) – literally, "motion into which" implying penetration ("unto," "union") to a particular purpose or result.

The purpose of God unto them that are lost, the Gospel to them serves a purpose of death.

They in the purpose of God had been appointed to disobedeince 1 Pet 2:8 and wrath 1 Thess 5:9 and condemnation Jude 1:4

4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained[written decree] to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

The Gospel in the decree of God unto them that perish is a occasion for them to stumble 1 Cor 1:23

23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

1 Pet 2:8

8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

God has appointed that they stumble and be disobedient to the Word of the Gospel.

This also proves that Paul and Peter preached the same Gospel to the jews and greeks !

 

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Sometimes a Savor unto death ! 2

In 1 Pet 2:8

8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

They were passively appointed to active disobedience, to stumble at the Word of the Gospel or of Christ. Now the verb disobedient apeitho means:

I disobey, rebel, am disloyal, refuse conformity.

apeithéō – literally, refuse to be persuaded (by the Lord).

to refuse or withhold belief (in Christ, in the gospel; opposed to

For instance, those in Israel who disobeyed the Gospel Rom 10:16,21

16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

21 But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people

This obeying not of them in Vs 16 of being disobedient Vs 21, God appointed that, for them to be that way, to not obey the Gospel, to be a disobedient and gainsaying people,

It was His active will for them to act that way, for their greater condemnation, Jesus justly said of them Jn 15:22

22 If I had not come and spoken[The word] unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloak for their sin.

Which means, without His coming among them to Preach the Word of the Gospel with more Light Jn 3:19 than ever before, so they could hear it and reject it, they would not have had the greter condemnation of sin to be accountable for Jn 19:11

11 Jesus answered, Thou couldest have no power at all against me, except it were given thee from above: therefore he that delivered me unto thee hath the greater sin.

John Gill on this verse, the greater sin:

therefore he that delivered me unto thee, hath the greater sin; , "than thine", as the Syriac version adds; and to the same purpose the Persic. Pilate had been guilty of sin already in scourging Christ, and suffering the Roman soldiers to abuse him; and would be guilty of a greater in delivering him up to be crucified, who he knew was innocent: but the sin of Judas in delivering him into the hands of the chief priests and elders, and of the chief priest and elders and people of the Jews, in delivering him to Pilate to crucify him, according to the Roman manner, were greater, inasmuch as theirs proceeded from malice and envy, and was done against greater light and knowledge; for by his works, miracles, and ministry, as well as by their own prophecies, they might, or must have known, that he was the Messiah, and Son of God: and it is to be observed, that as there is a difference in sin, and that all sins are not equal, the circumstances of things making an alteration; so that God's decree concerning the delivery of his Son into the hands of sinful men, does not excuse the sin of the betrayers of him.

But now that He did come among them as appointed, they have the greater condemnation, and it was the Lords doing all the time Matt 21:42

42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing[ordained to be], and it is marvellous in our eyes?

This is a qutation taken from Ps 118:22

of which Peter also draws from in his 1 Pet 2:7-8

7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,

8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

God had a Purpose of condemnation in sending Christ among the jews to preach the Gospel, not a saving purpose.

This correlates with the wise words of simeon on the purpose of the Christ child Lk 2:34

And Simeon blessed them, and said unto Mary his mother, Behold, this child is set[appointed] for the fall and rising again of many in Israel; and for a sign which shall be spoken against;

As well as Jesus words Jn 9:39

39 And Jesus said, For judgment[Gods sentence of decree] I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.

To these, the Gospel was always to be a savor unto death !

 

[savedbymercy]

Sometimes a Savor unto death ! 3

God had decreed that most of the people of physical natinal israel, the jews, would be disobedient to the sent preached Gospel/Word, prophesied by the Prophet Isaiah Isa 6:8-10

8 Also I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, Whom shall I send, and who will go for us? Then said I, Here am I; send me.

9 And he said, Go, and tell this people[the jews], Hear ye indeed[The Gospel], but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not.

10 Make the heart of this people [The jews]fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed.

This is God's Purpose for sending the Gospel of Christ to the majority of the jews !

It was not to convert and heal them !

And that Prophecy in Isa 6 was applied to the jews of Jesus day as we read Matt 13:13-15

13 Therefore speak I[Jesus ] to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

14 And in them[the jews] is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:

15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

This proves that God did not want these to have Faith through hearing the word Rom 10:17 because He intentionally closed their ears and eyes to the Word !

Also this Purpose continued post the Ministry of Jesus on Earth into the Apostles Paul time, for he applies the fulfillment of Isaiah 6 to his day here Rom 11:7-8

7 What then? Israel[The physical ethnic nation] hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear) unto this day.

Also Acts 28:25-27

25 And when they agreed not among themselves, they departed, after that Paul had spoken one word, Well spake the Holy Ghost by Esaias the prophet unto our fathers,

26 Saying, Go unto this people, and say, Hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and not perceive:

27 For the heart of this people is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes have they closed; lest they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

This passage is quoted by Paul late in the Book of Acts !

Yes God had given this people natural ears to hear and natural eyes to see , but with those things natural and not spiritual, they still abide in death,

But with only natural eyes and ears, though we hear, we cannot understand, and God so decreed that to this people Isa 6:9

9 And he said, Go, and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not.

See hearing the word naturally void of spiritual understanding is fruitless !

Again Acts 28:26

26 Saying, Go unto this people, and say, Hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and not perceive:

There can be no spiritual hearing divrced of understanding, so Jesus says Jn 8:43

43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

And its only those who hear and understand the word that brings forth fruit Jesus says Matt 13:23

23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

And without hearing and understanding there is no healing or conversion Matt 13:15

15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Now this principle of operation did not only apply to the non elect jews , but to the non elect gentile world also, the Gospel to them is also sent for their greater condemnation in disobedience !

 

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The natural man cannot spiritually believe the Gospel !

Another proof of scripture that New Birth is of necessity before faith comes in the Gospel of Christ, is the often neglected 1 Cor 2:14

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.


But the natural, nonspiritual man does not accept or welcome or admit into his heart the gifts and teachings and revelations of the Spirit of God, for they are folly (meaningless nonsense) to him; and he is incapable of knowing them [of progressively recognizing, understanding, and becoming better acquainted with them] because they are spiritually discerned and estimated and appreciated.AMP

But people who are unspiritual don’t accept the things from God’s Spirit. They are foolishness to them and can’t be understood, because they can only be comprehended in a spiritual way.CEB

Lets make no mistake, the Gospel is a revelation to God given Faith by the Spirit Rom 1:16-17

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein[The Gospel] is the righteousness of God revealed[by the Spirit] from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

The word revealed apokaluptó
means :

I uncover, bring to light, reveal,properly, uncover, revealing what is hidden (veiled, obstructed), especially its inner make-up; (figuratively) to make plain (manifest), particularly what is immaterial (invisible).

Its done by the Spirit 1 Cor 2:10

10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

The word deep here is the word bathos and means:

depth; deep water; met: fullness, immensity; an extreme degree; profundities, deep-laid plans.

These deep laid plans are equivalent to saying :

things hidden and above man's scrutiny, especially the divine counsels,

The Gospel of Christ makes known the Divine Counsels of God, which is why Paul said when testifying of the Gospel of Gods Grace in Christ these words Acts 20:24-27

24 But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.

25 And now, behold, I know that ye all, among whom I have gone preaching the kingdom of God, shall see my face no more.

26 Wherefore I take you to record this day, that I am pure from the blood of all men.

27 For I have not shunned to declare unto you all the counsel of God.

The word counsel boulé means:

counsel, deliberate wisdom, decree.

properly, a resolved plan, used particularly of the immutable aspect of God's plan – purposefully arranging all physical circumstances, which guarantees every scene of life works to His eternal purpose.

the counsel of his will, Ephesians 1:11. and this relates to Salvation and the Gospel Eph 1:11-13 !

In essence this scripture 1 Cor 2:14 informs us that the natural man, you and i void of the Spirit or New Birth, cannot spiritually believe the Gospel, or another way of saying it, cannot believe the things of the Spirit of God !

 

[savedbymercy]

The natural man cannot spiritually believe the Gospel !2

Paul teaches that man by nature does not accept the deep spiritual truths of the Gospel, simply because they must be spiritually discerned, examined, investigated or appraised and digested.

The things of the Spirit of God spoken of are all things proper in declaring the Person and Work of Jesus Christ and Him crucified, as the beginning context of 1 Cor 2 sets forth 1 Cor 2:1-2

And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God.

2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.

Some manuscripts will read the Mystery of God instead of the Testimony of God !

As for myself, brethren, when I came to you, I did not come proclaiming to you the testimony and evidence or mystery and secret of God [concerning what He has done through Christ for the salvation of men] in lofty words of eloquence or human philosophy and wisdom;AMP

And I, having come to you, brothers, did not come in accordance with superiority of speech or of wisdom while proclaiming to you the mystery of God.DLNT

The totality of the Gospel preached to jew and gentile is a Mystery nonetheless Eph 6:19

19 And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,

Some erronously think that the Mystery of the Gospel is Limited to the union of both jew and gentile in Christ, being made one, though that is true, its not exclusive, for John Gill writes :

to make known, the mystery of the Gospel; or the mysterious doctrines of it, such as the doctrines of a trinity of persons, of the union of the two natures in Christ, justification by his righteousness, regeneration by his Spirit and grace, the saints' union to Christ, and communion with him, the resurrection of the dead, &c. which are called mysteries, because they were hid until revealed; and though revealed, the "modus" and "ratio" of them are not to be accounted for. Now the apostle's work was to make known these mysteries, to prove the truth of them from the word of God, and to defend them against the opposers of them; and that he might be able to do this he entreats the prayers of the saints.

For remember, the Gospel must be inclusive of the Person and Work of Christ, what it accomplished and who for !

Therefore the Gospel must be revealed or made known to us by the Spirit of God.

This is the very meaning of the word declaring 1 Cor 2:1

And I, brethren, when I came to you declaring unto you the testimony of God, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom.

Its the word kataggelló:

I declare openly, proclaim, preach, laud, celebrate

to announce, declare, promulgate, make known; to proclaim publicly, publish

Like in Eph 6:19

19 And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known/declare the mystery of the gospel,

It also accompanies the idea of revealing something as in the word reveal in 1 Cor 2:10

But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

The greek word for reveal apokaluptó means:

to make known, make manifest, disclose, what before was unknown;

Simply meaning the Spirit uses Gospel Preachers to make known the Mysteries of the Gospel, so Ministers are :

Let a man so account of us, as of the ministers of Christ, and stewards of the mysteries of God. See 1 Cor 4:1-2

Yet these Gospel Mysteries of the Person and Work of Jesus Christ cannot be believed by the natural man 1 Cor 2:14 !

 

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The natural man cannot spiritually believe the Gospel ! 3

Now because the Gospel Truths needed to be Spiritually discerned in order to be believed/embraced in Faith, the Messengers of it, before they could begin their world wide campaign starting in Jerusalem, they had to tarry and wait for the Promise of the Spirit Lk 24:46-49

46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

48 And ye are witnesses of these things.

49 And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.

Acts 1:4

And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

Acts 2:33

Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

The first preachers of the Gospel needed the Power of the Holy Spirit to equip them for their campaign and to equip their hearers with ears to hear, those who had been ordained to Eternal Life Acts 13:48 !

They Preached the Gospel with the Holy Ghost sent from heaven 1 Pet 1:12

12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.

Then and only then would it come to the Elect with Power 1 Thess 1:4-6

4 Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.

5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.

6 And ye became followers of us, and of the Lord, having received the word in much affliction, with joy of the Holy Ghost.

The word power here dynamis is the same greek word used in Lk 24:49

And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.

This is the Day of Power Prophesied by David here Ps 110:3

3 Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.

This promise they shall be willing denotes their conversion by the Gospel through the Spirit, like how the Thessalonians in the Day of Gospel Power 1 Thess 1:5, turned from idols to serve the True God 1 Thess 1:9

9 For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God;

That word serve douleuó:

I am a slave, am subject to, obey, am devoted.

properly, to serve as a slave, having all personal ownership-rights assigned to the owner; (figuratively) to willingly give over the prerogative to be self-governing.

That word willingly means:

Done, given, or accepted voluntarily or ungrudgingly

Which looks back to the promise in Ps 110:3

3 Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.

That word willing nedabah:

voluntariness, freewill offering

So this voluntariness is the result of the Day of Christ's Power, the Giving of His Spirit !

 

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The natural man cannot spiritually believe the Gospel ! 4

Now the natural man is simply any person who has not be Born Agan, who has not been Spiritually renewed Titus 3:5

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Note: This Spiritual renewing of the Holy Ghost saves us !

The word renewing anakainósis means:

renewing; a renewal or change of heart and life.

This change brings with it a renewed understanding. For instance the word heart means:

The vital center and source of one's being, emotions, and sensibilities.

The seat of the intellect or imagination

The greek word kardia

the heart; mind, character, inner self, will, intention, center.

specifically, of the understanding, the faculty and seat of intelligence

The scripture indicates that we understand with the heart, for Jesus commenting on those who could not believe on Him says Jn 12:39

Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,

40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.

And the word know in 1 Cor 2:14

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Its the greek word ginóskó and means:

I am taking in knowledge, come to know, learn; aor: I ascertained, realized.

to know, understand, perceive, have knowledge of;

In fact some translations even read instead of know :

The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit.NIV

The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned.ESV

But the natural, nonspiritual man does not accept or welcome or admit into his heart the gifts and teachings and revelations of the Spirit of God, for they are folly (meaningless nonsense) to him; and he is incapable of knowing them [of progressively recognizing, understanding, and becoming better acquainted with them] because they are spiritually discerned and estimated and appreciated.AMP

Its translated understand in the KJV here Lk 18:34

34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.

Acts 8:30

30 And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?

Also the word denotes more than a natural, theoretical, notional, mental, academic understanding or knowing,

But denotes an experimental knowledge of these things, a Spiritual feeling of them, as they permeate our spiritual affections given in New Birth and Spiritual life, there is a spiritual intimacy we realize with the things of God, as His Spirit makes them known in our renewed hearts, and this the natural man cannot have or experience with the things of God, which the Gospel is !