The Heavenly Zion and Jerusalem. .....the Church

[SovereignGrace]

Then it wouldn't be a "millennium" by very definition of the word, would it?

We see it as figurative language.

 

[TCassidy]

It's just that in my studies, I see Him reigning now, the millennium being ongoing as we speak.

I see Him as reigning in the hearts of His people now, but allowing other to violate His laws to their own peril, and reigning over the whole Earth with a scepter of Iron, not tolerating any rebellion, during the Millennium.

 

[DHK]

I see Him as reigning in the hearts of His people now, but allowing other to violate His laws to their own peril, and reigning over the whole Earth with a scepter of Iron, not tolerating any rebellion, during the Millennium.

I agree with that.

 

[SovereignGrace]

this earth will be destroyed and an new earth and a new heaven will be created.
His Kingdom, even in a new earth will be forever and forever. I look forward to that also.

Now this are my thoughts also. Minus the 1,000 year literal reign. But there are some common beliefs amongst us.

I have talked to some who hold to a refurbished earth that is cleansed by fire. Like Eden was pre-fall.

 

[DHK]

Now this are my thoughts also. Minus the 1,000 year literal reign. But there are some common beliefs amongst us.

I have talked to some who hold to a refurbished earth that is cleansed by fire. Like Eden was pre-fall.

True. That is what I believe the Millennium will be like. Right now it is under a curse. That curse will be lifted. That is how the lion will lie down with the lamb. The harmony of nature will be restored. Man will live much longer. In order to do so the atmosphere will have to be changed. The entire earth must be cleansed. No doubt this will be a supernatural act of God.

 

[TCassidy]

Right now it is under a curse.

I agree. The curse has not yet been lifted. That is why dandelions grow in your lawn, weeds grow in your garden, and your dog gets fleas. Not to mention every vile illness that befalls mortal man.

When Christ reigns in the Fullness of His Power and Authority dandelions will not grow in my lawn, weeks will not grow in my garden, my dog will not get fleas, and this vile affliction I have fought for over 15 years will be gone.

There is coming a day,
When no heart aches shall come,
No more clouds in the sky,
No more tears to dim the eye,
All is peace forever more,
On that happy golden shore,
What a day, glorious day that will be.

What a day that will be,
When my Jesus I shall see,
And I look upon His face,
The One who saved me by His grace;
When He takes me by the hand,
And leads me through the Promised Land,
What a day, glorious day that will be.

There'll be no sorrow there,
No more burdens to bear,
No more sickness, no pain,
No more parting over there;
And forever I will be,
With the One who died for me,
What a day, glorious day that will be.

What a day that will be,
When my Jesus I shall see,
And I look upon His face,
The One who saved me by His grace;
When He takes me by the hand,
And leads me through the Promised Land,
What a day, glorious day that will be.

Even so, come Lord Jesus!

 

[SovereignGrace]

True. That is what I believe the Millennium will be like. Right now it is under a curse. That curse will be lifted. That is how the lion will lie down with the lamb. The harmony of nature will be restored. Man will live much longer. In order to do so the atmosphere will have to be changed. The entire earth must be cleansed. No doubt this will be a supernatural act of God.

My only problem is that during this reign, people are still dying.

 

[TCassidy]

My only problem is that during this reign, people are still dying.

That is one of the main reasons I reject the "Kingdom Now" theology. Sin still reigns and death by sin.

But in that coming Kingdom, death will no longer reign.

 

[SovereignGrace]

That is one of the main reasons I reject the "Kingdom Now" theology. Sin still reigns and death by sin.

But in that coming Kingdom, death will no longer reign.

The thing is this...in any camp, you're going to get differing views. I glean from this post of yours no one dies during the 1,000 year reign of Christ? Others say there is death during it.

I see, as you stated, Christ reigning in the hearts of His children. The kingdom of Light is here in a spiritual manner, not literal sense. Same with Satan and his kingdom. He reigns in the hearts of the unregenerate, but not a literal kingdom. I don't see a palace or castle he is ruling from, nor a throne(I spelled it correctly (Sister BlessedWife318 ) he is sitting upon. Jesus is the Strong Man "In fact, no one can enter a strong man’s house without first tying him up. Then he can plunder the strong man’s house."[Mark 3:27] Christ overtakes Satan, breaks the yoke he has upon them, casts him out and now reigns as King of their lives.

 

[TCassidy]

I glean from this post of yours no one dies during the 1,000 year reign of Christ? Others say there is death during it.

I don't know of any Historic Chilliasts who teach that death will still reign during Christ's Millennial reign.

Can you point me to where you read or heard that? I would be interested in seeing what their rational is for that theory.

 

[SovereignGrace]

I don't know of any Historic Chilliasts who teach that death will still reign during Christ's Millennial reign.

Can you point me to where you read or heard that? I would be interested in seeing what their rational is for that theory.

Seems like OldRegular debated someone on here and they admitted it. Could be wrong. I have read it before...iirc.

 

[Internet Theologian]

He created all things. He doesn't "own" all things. Look in Job. He allowed Job to have "control" over Job's life, and today he has given Satan control over this world. That is control, not ownership.

You more than gladly, almost giddily give satan his rule over the kingdoms. In fact you suggested all this when Jesus was tempted in the wilderness. Nice try though. And hey, your keyboard didn't magically make me say something I didn't yet.

 

[Internet Theologian]

That was one of the reasons, the famed atheist, Madeline O'hare attacked the Bible and tried to get it banned from public schools--because of such asinine reasoning like yours. She did use that argument.

Well, this time the asinine reasonings are yours to which we are all responding. She would have probably schooled you as well. It's not hard, really.

 

[SovereignGrace]

From Ted Montgomery...

Many believe that there will be no sin during the Millennium. I completely disagree. The wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23), and death will be the final enemy to be destroyed (1 Corinthians 15:26). Not until the end of the Millennium will death be eliminated (Revelation 20:14).

During the Millennium, all rebellion and evil will be exposed and punished by Jesus and the glorified saints. Therefore, at that time, there will be much less motivation to sin—and, as a result, much less death—than there is in the world now.

http://www.tedmontgomery.com/bblovrvw/emails/Millennium2.html

 

[TCassidy]

Well, this time the asinine reasonings are yours to which we are all responding. She would have probably schooled you as well. It's not hard, really.

No. You tried to ridicule him by making a ridiculously extreme example that neither fits his doctrine nor contributes to the discussion.

And, no, the asinine reasoning is not his. I was yours. And it was wrong. And it was a cheap shot. Own it.

 

[Internet Theologian]

No. You tried to ridicule him by making a ridiculously extreme example that neither fits his doctrine nor contributes to the discussion.

And, no, the asinine reasoning is not his. I was yours. And it was wrong. And it was a cheap shot. Own it.

Um.

Nonsense.

Firstly, no one attempted to ridicule him, it wasn't a cheap shot, nor was it wrong. It was to expose the asininity of a purely literal biblical interpretation.

Now, calling my post blasphemy (me actually, not my post) and etc, that was no cheap shot, no. no. Not at all. Did you see me whine about that? Not.

 

[TCassidy]

From Ted Montgomery...

You will have to take that up with Mr. Montgomery.

Let's see. Bachelor of Science in Mathematics. Bachelor of Science in Visual Science. Doctor of Optometry. I see ( did you see what I did there? ). He is an optometrist so he knows all about the bible? While studying Math he took advanced courses in Hebrew and Greek exegesis?

I wish somebody would have told me! I could have saved 10 years of Seminary training! I could have just stopped with my BSNE!

Does my Seminary education qualify me to be an Optometrist? If not, why not? If his being an Optometrist qualifies him to be an exegete shouldn't it work the other way too?

Sorry, ran off with the sarcasm there for a minute.

 

[TCassidy]

Um.

Nonsense.

Firstly, no one attempted to ridicule him, it wasn't a cheap shot, nor was it wrong. It was to expose the asininity of a purely literal biblical interpretation.

It was nonsense and you know it was nonsense. The Literal Hermeneutic has already been explained to you in my post above.

"The literal hermeneutic is not literalistic or the application of wooden literalism as some antagonists argue."

 

[Internet Theologian]

It was nonsense and you know it was nonsense. The Literal Hermeneutic has already been explained to you in my post above.

"The literal hermeneutic is not literalistic or the application of wooden literalism as some antagonists argue."

No, I totally disagree with you, my illustration wasn't nonsense. I feel no guilt at all though you want me to so badly.

You just happen to be a 'literalist' and didn't like it yourself. Just because there is a proper definition of a literalist that one quotes/knows doesn't mean the person doesn't delve off into wooden literal interpretation. Such as the 'cattle on a thousand hills' subject. In other words this isn't about how you literally interpret, it is how DHK does. The illustration fit like a glove.

Now this didn't fit like a glove:

God created all things; Satan created nothing. What you have posted is blasphemy! an insult to God--attributing the creation of God to Satan.

Not whining, because this is his typical behavior. But isn't that asinine, ad hominem nonsense my friend? Oh, and not to mention his equating me with an atheist. Biggrin

 

[TCassidy]

I feel no guilt at all though you want me to so badly.

I couldn't care less about what you "feel." This is about the truth. Not about your "feelings."