The Historic Baptist View of the Nicene Creed

[JonC]

I agree with that. It is what I mean by 'eternally begotten.' But if He was not begotten in some way, then in what way is He the Son?

In the Creed, "begotten" refers to nature (that Jesus is God) in opposition to heresies of the time placing Jesus less than the Father. "Eternally begotten" meaning eternally God, always YHWH, and this not changing with the Incarnation.

 

[Blank]

I voted 'yes' but it wasn't registered. Maybe I am too new?

 

[ParticularWife]

My belief about Nicene Creed is that it taligns with biblical doctrines. It was a needed articulation of the Trinity and the divinity of Christ. It was safeguarding orthodoxy. Benjamin Keach endorsed the use of confessions and catechisms, which he saw as tools for instructing believers and guarding the church's teaching. I don't know if he ever wrote specifically about the Creed, but he was likely to have mentioned it he had any disagreement.

"We believe all that is contained in the Creed because it is taken from Scripture, and we reject only what is added to it by men."

– Huldrych Zwingli & Samuel Macauley Jackson, Zwingli: Selected Writings (Volume 2, p. 217).

“This mystery of the Trinity is the foundation of all our communion with God, and our comfortable dependence on Him.”

– Hercules Collins, An Orthodox Catechism (1680), Question 24.

“The ancient councils, such as Nicaea, ... delivered nothing contrary to the Scriptures but simply expounded the same, as was necessary to refute the heresies of their time.”

– John Calvin & Henry Beveridge, Institutes of the Christian Religion, Book IV, Chapter 9, Section 8

 

[David Lamb]

I voted 'yes' but it wasn't registered. Maybe I am too new?

I can't check now, because I have already voted, but I seem to remember that after selecting your vote, you have to click on "submit." Did you do that?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

 

[JesusFan]

I see the Nicene Creed helpful to a certain extent, but not "authoritative" as THE summary of the church. It is certainly NOT infallible and should never be used in place of actual Scripture.

We ministered in the strong Latter Day Saints Wyoming/Utah area (who deny much of the Nicene Creed) so it WAS beneficial to distinguish ANY trinitarian group from that or Jehovah's Witness cults

Agreed, as that is also How I view the Confessions of Faith such as the 1689 Baptist Confession

 

[JesusFan]

The eternal Son of God is neither begotten nor made to have always been the Son of God. Not light from light, but the true Light.

Jesus always existed eternally as the Word of God the Father, and when incarnated as the Lord Jesus then begotten as Son of God , as was always God, but not always as the Son

 

[Blank]

I can't check now, because I have already voted, but I seem to remember that after selecting your vote, you have to click on "submit." Did you do that?

I don't recall, but since it didn't register my vote, you'd think I'd be able to vote again

 

[37818]

. . . then begotten as Son of God , . . .

Was the bodily resurrection per Psalm 2:7 per Acts of the Apostles 13:33, God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee.

 

[JonC]

I can't check now, because I have already voted, but I seem to remember that after selecting your vote, you have to click on "submit." Did you do that?

I voted 'yes' but it wasn't registered. Maybe I am too new?

The @Mikey set the poll with a close date.

 

[JesusFan]

Was the bodily resurrection per Psalm 2:7 per Acts of the Apostles 13:33, God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee.

Before He became the man Jesus, and then the Son of God, was the eternal word of the Father

 

[Van]

There is no wrong translation here, Paul defined the word.

Please do not sidetrack this thread debating that Christ was created by the translation choice of begotten.

 

[Van]

Your first reason for not affirming the Nicene Creed doesn't seem correct, because you imply that the creed says that God the Father created or made God the Son. It doesn't. It says: "And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of his Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father; by whom all things were made; who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Ghost of the Virgin Mary," Note the words I have put in bold, "begotten not made." That is biblical. For instance, John 1:14 says:

“And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.” (Joh 1:14 NKJV)

John 3:16 says:

“"For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.” (Joh 3:16 NKJV)

So we are not relying on Psalm 2:7 and whether or not "begotten" is the correct translation there.

Begotten mistranslates the Greek "monogenes." As I have said, "today I have set forth my uniquely divine Son" is the idea. The Hebrew word mistranslated by the KJV as "begotten" means in this context "brought forth or set forth" as to reveal or display.

 

[Blank]

The @Mikey set the poll with a close date.

Got it, thanks.

 

[37818]

Before He became the man Jesus, and then the Son of God, was the eternal word of the Father

Before the Word became a man He was always the Son of God, per John 1:18, No man hath seen God at any time; the *only | existent | Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
Appearing as the LORD God, in Genesis 12:7, And the LORD appeared unto Abram, . . .

* μονογενής from μόνος + γίνομαι

 

[JesusFan]

Before the Word became a man He was always the Son of God, per John 1:18, No man hath seen God at any time; the *only | existent | Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
Appearing as the LORD God, in Genesis 12:7, And the LORD appeared unto Abram, . . .

* μονογενής from μόνος + γίνομαι

Isn't the rendering though also could be the "only begotten God?"

 

[JesusFan]

Begotten mistranslates the Greek "monogenes." As I have said, "today I have set forth my uniquely divine Son" is the idea. The Hebrew word mistranslated by the KJV as "begotten" means in this context "brought forth or set forth" as to reveal or display.

Only Begotten referred to the concept of Jesus having no created beginning, as H was and also will remain the unquie Person eternally sharing in same essence of God the Father, as both are equally God

 

[37818]

Isn't the rendering though also could be the "only begotten God?"

Yes. Based on traditional translation.

μονογενής from μόνος + γίνομαι

But γίνομαι by itself is never translated as "begotten." But is translated "made."

 

[Van]

Only Begotten referred to the concept of Jesus having no created beginning, as H was and also will remain the unquie Person eternally sharing in same essence of God the Father, as both are equally God

Just about all modern translations have determined monogenes does not mean and has never meant begotten. You effort to redefine begotten has no basis in reality.

 

[JesusFan]

Just about all modern translations have determined monogenes does not mean and has never meant begotten. You effort to redefine begotten has no basis in reality.

Did at the time of the Creed being formulated, as they were just confirming Deity of Jesus