The history of how Sunday worship came about.

[Alofa Atu]

Paul was coming to 1 location where all the Christians in that area had gathered themselves together.

Where is that in 1 Corinthians 16:1-4?

 

[pythons]

Where is that in 1 Corinthians 16:1-4?

"that there be no gatherings when I come"

You act confused as to where Paul said he was going to be and that once he got there he didn't want anyone leaving. Ellen White has forced you to conclude that Paul was going to be running all over Corinth and Galatia every Sunday - personally gathering the collection up from each member of the Church. In other words Paul must have wanted to do all the gathering! Are you serious!

I can't say as I blame you here - Anti-Trinitarians have been programmed to protect their prophet even when it's not logical to do so. This is a classic case of that.

 

[Alofa Atu]

Leviticus 23, you should read it and notice that "the Sabbath" is a feast day

Paul said (under inspiration of the Holy Ghost), "Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth." (1 Corinthians 5:8)

just like the rest of them that are mentioned in the Chapter.

Not really. God makes distinction even in Leviticus 23:

The Seventh Day, the Sabbath of the LORD, the Lord's day (Isaiah 58:13; Revelation 1:10) is His Rest (Hebrews 3-4; Exodus 20:8-11; Genesis 2:1-3). It is a weekly unchanging (as God Himself is, for the Ten Commandments are a transcript of His character) cycle.

Yet the others were 'their' feasts, the feasts of Jerusalem, known as 'her feasts' and 'her sabbaths' in their 'seasons', which are in addition to God's day (notice after giving His day (vs 3), God then delineates the feasts, and their sabbaths, of Jerusalem:

Lev 23:4 These are the feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons.

Lev 23:37 These are the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, to offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD, a burnt offering, and a meat offering, a sacrifice, and drink offerings, every thing upon his day:
Lev 23:38 Beside the sabbaths of the LORD, and beside your gifts, and beside all your vows, and beside all your freewill offerings, which ye give unto the LORD.

Two things. Not one and the same thing.

Had you been present at the Council of Jerusalem (Acts 15)

I am present when I read the Bible (Acts 15), and I "Amen" the decision of my brothers there. Read more carefully:

Act 15:15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
Act 15:16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
Act 15:17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
Act 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
Act 15:19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
Act 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

Act 15:22 Then pleased it the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas, and Silas, chief men among the brethren:
Act 15:23 And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia:

Read the rest of Acts, along with Acts 13, and they met on Sabbath, for the reading of the word of God, which included this new epistle (letter) approved by the council, and by the Holy Ghost and by the scripture (Amos).

you would have rebuked the Apostles and went your own way. That much is crystal clear.

I find that you would have done that very thing:

Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

For Romanism breaks all of that.

[1] idols - statues of Mary, Peter, etc.

[2] fornication - priests with nuns, homosexuality, rape, systemic child abuse, etc

[3] from things strangled - eat all manner of unclean, irrespective of how it was slaughtered

[4] from blood - eat the blood with the flesh in regular life, but especially at the Mass​

They were quoting from Leviticus and Deuteronomy as valid law, see also 1 Peter 1:15-16.

https://archive.org/download/die-at-the-t/DIE at the T.pptx

DIE at the T

DIE At The T - Sermon - brother Aaron Earnest : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

 

[Alofa Atu]

gatherings

Look up this word.

 

[pythons]

Not really. God makes distinction even in Leviticus 23:

The Seventh Day, the Sabbath of the LORD, the Lord's day (Isaiah 58:13; Revelation 1:10) is His Rest (Hebrews 3-4; Exodus 20:8-11; Genesis 2:1-3). It is a weekly unchanging (as God Himself is, for the Ten Commandments are a transcript of His character) cycle.

Yet the others were 'their' feasts, the feasts of Jerusalem, known as 'her feasts' and 'her sabbaths' in their 'seasons', which are in addition to God's day (notice after giving His day (vs 3), God then delineates the feasts, and their sabbaths, of Jerusalem:

Verse 1
"Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the Lord, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts."

The 1st verse refutes what you're saying.

So, which feasts do you observe and which feasts do you ignore?

 

[Alofa Atu]

Verse 1
"Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the Lord, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts."

The 1st verse refutes what you're saying.

No, you misunderstood the text, for God instituted them and they originated from Him (thus they are "of the Lord" (meaning from Him), and the "my [God's] feasts" contrast the other pagan nations feasts, as in Egypt, Babylon, etc compared to these He just instituted, but they were for the people (her, their):

Num_15:3 And will make an offering by fire unto the LORD, a burnt offering, or a sacrifice in performing a vow, or in a freewill offering, or in your solemn feasts, to make a sweet savour unto the LORD, of the herd, or of the flock:

Num_29:39 These things ye shall do unto the LORD in your set feasts, beside your vows, and your freewill offerings, for your burnt offerings, and for your meat offerings, and for your drink offerings, and for your peace offerings.

Isa_1:14 Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.

Amo_8:10 And I will turn your feasts into mourning, and all your songs into lamentation; and I will bring up sackcloth upon all loins, and baldness upon every head; and I will make it as the mourning of an only son, and the end thereof as a bitter day.

Mal_2:3 Behold, I will corrupt your seed, and spread dung upon your faces, even the dung of your solemn feasts; and one shall take you away with it.

Eze_36:38 As the holy flock, as the flock of Jerusalem in her solemn feasts; so shall the waste cities be filled with flocks of men: and they shall know that I am the LORD.

Hos_2:11 I will also cause all her mirth to cease, her feast days, her new moons, and her sabbaths, and all her solemn feasts.​

So, which feasts do you observe and which feasts do you ignore?

Asked and answered.

 

[Alofa Atu]

Can anyone show me a weekly cycle in the scripture, wherein "the first [day] of the week", was a feast, or festal day for Jews or Christians? (Please remember, I am not asking for a yearly event, a monthly, or even a seasonal.) I will take any text from OT or NT.

 

[pythons]

No, you misunderstood the text, for God instituted them and they originated from Him (thus they are "of the Lord" (meaning from Him), and the "my [God's] feasts" contrast the other pagan nations feasts, as in Egypt, Babylon, etc compared to these He just instituted, but they were for the people (her, their):

Num_15:3 And will make an offering by fire unto the LORD, a burnt offering, or a sacrifice in performing a vow, or in a freewill offering, or in your solemn feasts, to make a sweet savour unto the LORD, of the herd, or of the flock:

Num_29:39 These things ye shall do unto the LORD in your set feasts, beside your vows, and your freewill offerings, for your burnt offerings, and for your meat offerings, and for your drink offerings, and for your peace offerings.

Isa_1:14 Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.

Amo_8:10 And I will turn your feasts into mourning, and all your songs into lamentation; and I will bring up sackcloth upon all loins, and baldness upon every head; and I will make it as the mourning of an only son, and the end thereof as a bitter day.

Mal_2:3 Behold, I will corrupt your seed, and spread dung upon your faces, even the dung of your solemn feasts; and one shall take you away with it.

Eze_36:38 As the holy flock, as the flock of Jerusalem in her solemn feasts; so shall the waste cities be filled with flocks of men: and they shall know that I am the LORD.

Hos_2:11 I will also cause all her mirth to cease, her feast days, her new moons, and her sabbaths, and all her solemn feasts.​

Asked and answered.

God didn't give those special days and times to the Gentiles, God gave them "TO ISRAEL" . So of course they were called "her solemn feasts". This would be no different than if I gave YOU a motorcycle, it would be called YOUR's.

 

[Alofa Atu]

God didn't give those special days and times to the Gentiles, God gave them "TO ISRAEL" .

That is what I said, and that was the point. I said that those feasts given to "Israel" by God were in contrast to the other nation's feasts which they (the Gentile nations, like Egypt, Babylon, etc.) had set up on their own (see Esther 1; Daniel 5, for an example).

Now as to "Israel", there is the type (Jacob of Isaac), and the true (Jesus Christ; Matthew 2:13-15,19-21; Hosea 11:1, etc). Thus, in the latter, all persons who are in Him (Galatians 3:28; Colossians 3:11) are to "keep the feast ... in sincerity and truth" (1 Corinthians 5:8, see also Joshua 24:14).

So of course they were called "her solemn feasts".

Thank you, I am glad you agree.

This would be no different than if I gave YOU a motorcycle, it would be called YOUR's.

Indeed. That was my point. I could use a motorcycle by the way, just in case you were hinting at anything. I could get around with a little more ease on this island with it. A high quality dirtbike would be even better, for some of the places here cannot be rightly called 'roads', but more like paths (gravel, dirt, broken up asphalt, and even times rivers of water coming down from the high mountains).

 

[pythons]

That is what I said, and that was the point. I said that those feasts given to "Israel" by God were in contrast to the other nation's feasts which they (the Gentile nations, like Egypt, Babylon, etc.) had set up on their own (see Esther 1; Daniel 5, for an example).

Now as to "Israel", there is the type (Jacob of Isaac), and the true (Jesus Christ; Matthew 2:13-15,19-21; Hosea 11:1, etc). Thus, in the latter, all persons who are in Him (Galatians 3:28; Colossians 3:11) are to "keep the feast ... in sincerity and truth" (1 Corinthians 5:8, see also Joshua 24:14).

Thank you, I am glad you agree.

Indeed. That was my point. I could use a motorcycle by the way, just in case you were hinting at anything. I could get around with a little more ease on this island with it. A high quality dirtbike would be even better, for some of the places here cannot be rightly called 'roads', but more like paths (gravel, dirt, broken up asphalt, and even times rivers of water coming down from the high mountains).

The Ceremonial law was given to Israel specifically - not the nations surrounding Israel. You miss the point that the Egyptian's and other nations were observing "moral" law to worship something greater than themselves as is evidenced by every culture throughout time.

'Natural' or 'Moral' law is obligatory upon all people all the time - a savage living in the jungle who worships a toad on a string or cat knows it's wrong to steal his neighbors belongings, knows its wrong to bring dishonor on his family, to cheat, etc. All societies have laws on the books dealing with these 'Moral' or 'Natural' laws.

The departure you make from Scripture is when you say something that had to be taught supernaturally is moral - by its very definition the Sabbath and the other Feasts of the Lord are not moral or natural laws because they required supernatural instruction so that they could be known.

Past that Acts 15 disproves your premise in that NONE OF THE CEREMONIAL rubrics of the Old Covenant were obligatory for Christians and had they been (as you claim) Acts 15 would read radically different than it does.

Your citation of Galatians 3, 28 repudiates the point you attempted to make with it as that Chapter states clearly "THE LAW" came 430 years AFTER the promise to Abraham AND equally clear THAT SAME LAW THAT SEPARATED JEW FROM GENTILE IS OVER, It's DEAD, DONE. That's the whole point. That's why the Sabbath is OUT, the rejection of certain types of foods is OUT, etc.

Like I've been gently saying - ALL non-Trinitarian groups do this - they all teach a mutation capable Christ, soul sleep & many teach one must abstain from certain foods.

The way you have figured it Gentiles would need to essentially become Jews to be appropriate Christians.

 

[Salty]

Six hour warning

This will be closed no sooner than 6 am (EDT) / 3 am PDT

 

[Alofa Atu]

...The way you have figured it Gentiles would need to essentially become Jews to be appropriate Christians.

That you equate God's regulations on diet (Genesis 1-3), sabbath (Genesis 2), death (Genesis 2-3) to merely 'Jews' is missing the entire point from the beginning, and to miss the Alpha, is also to miss the Omega.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

Six hour warning

This will be closed no sooner than 6 am (EDT) / 3 am PDT

This thread is closed.