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Secondly, DHK assumes without proof that all me have the opportunity to hear and respond to the gospel.
I gave you Scripture, and as I predicted, you would not even believe the Word of God. That's sad.
God is not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.
It is God's will that all should be saved. (1Tim.2:4)
He is the propitiation not for our sins only but for the sins of the whole world (1John 2:2)
--With these Scriptures in mind don't you think he would provide a way for all men to hear the gospel if they so desired to hear it? But believe what you like. Your tendency on this board is to believe a man-made philosophy without any Scriptural backing at all, as you have proven over and over again.
HP: To extrapolate the rendering of this verse to suggest that every living human being has had the opportunity to hear and accept the gospel message, is beyond all reason.
Just another admission that you won't believe the Bible. What it says, it says.
Rom 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
If you really believed these verses you would put down your keyboard immediately, go, prepare to be a missionary, and go to the most needy nations on the face of this earth so that they may hear. But you don't even believe the Scripture that you read. Don't be a hypocrite. At least I believe the Scripture and act on it.
I see your position as simply unreasonable and unbelievable violating common sense, the testimony of missionaries across the globe,obviously yourself excluded, and not reasonably supported by the one solitary proof text you set forth to support such a notion. Show us your support for such a notion by any Bible scholar
I could show you my support via my own experience as a missionary and the testimony of every other missionary I know. You don't know what you are talking about. Like I said, if you really believed the Scripture you wrote, you would drop what you have, prepare to be a missionary and go to the neediest places on this earth and there preach the gospel. But you don't believe in the very Scriptures you believe.
Who has the unreasonable position? You do! You don't even believe in the Great Commission! I carry it out.
. Look back to the OT and apply such a notion as you suggest to the fact that salvation was given to the Jews. The words of Christ Himself clearly refute your position.
Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
John 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
Joh 1:11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
Your Scripture is taken out of context. This was all pre-cross.
Now Christ has died, buried, and risen again. He was rejected by the nation of Israel, who crucified him. salvation has been offered to all the world. Whosoever believes on him shall be saved. Have you done that?
I completely understand why DHK insists on suggesting that having the opportunity to respond to the gospel, because he knows intuitively that if men are born in sin and have not such an opportunity, it would prove God unjust if He condemned all men when they had no other choice but to be the sinners original sin makes them. DHK's notion is convenient cover for an unscriptural notion of OS.
Where do you get such deluded ideas?
Man was born in sin. Jesus died for the sins of the world. He is the propitiation for the sins of the whole world. Did he die in vain? No. The grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. Does HP believe the Bible on this point? No. Does man have a choice to believe Christ as Saviour? Yes. Is there more than one way to heaven? No.
What did Christ say?
He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. (John 3:36)
--Does it get any plainer?
HP apparently does not believe the Bible on this point.
Whether you believe the unscriptural notion that men are not born in sin (as HP does), or believe that men have a sin nature, as the Bible teaches, this truth remains the same--the only way to heaven is through Christ. There is no other way. "I am the way the truth and the life," Jesus said, "No man comes unto the Father but by me." HP do you believe the Bible?
DHK indicate that I am not correct on the following comment I made:
If you think that is what I believe then quote me. I never said that.
If original sin is correct, one does in fact have the driving force of sin and coercion in ones life, which makes it impossible to choose the right.
That is not my belief. That is a typical Calvinistic belief, but it is not mine.
If the will itself is so affected by sin that it can only sin and that continually, no morality can be predicated of it period, for morality necessitates the clear possibility of contrary choice. OS necessitates that contrary choice is not available.
You quote a position that is not mine and build a case on something that I don't believe. What foolishness is this?
I believe I am completely correct in my assessment above concerning DHK's philosophy. If DHK thinks I am wrong, I say it is a direct result of a clear inconsistency in his belief system that he needs to address.
You are wrong. I have said many times what I believe. You are confused.
Again, if OS is accepted as fact, one has no choice but to sin.
You are so confused. This is truly sad.
If one has a choice to accept or reject, that would in reality be the only moral choice a sinner could every make, all other ends being necessitated by ones sinful nature.
We all have that choice. We all have a sin nature.
Of a truth, words have meanings. If one uses the word moral, or morality, certain facts apply. Morality always denotes clear choice. Not choice to simply 'do as one wills' for the 'doing' sustains to the will the notion of necessity, not freedom or choice. One can ONLY do as they will. If one acts differently than the will chooses, it is a clear indication that the will has chosen a different end.
If you wish to murder, go ahead. You will be accountable. That is true for one who is saved or one who is not saved. Moses murdered a man, and was held accountable. So did David, a man after God's own heart. They were both held accountable. They were both saved men. God stated that Lot was a just and righteous man. Lot offered his two virgin daughters to a crowd of homosexuals to be abused by them all night long. If that had happened they would have been dead by morning. Yet Lot was a just and righteous man. Then Lot escaped out of the city, went to a mountain and committed incest with his two daughters. Yet, Lot was a just and righteous man. He made these decisions of his own accord. God did not force his hand.
One other related issue DHK brings to the forefront in his beliefs, is a long held Calvinistic notion that the damning sin is 'not accepting the gospel.' Certain there is one solitary proof text those that hold to such a notion go, but that in no wise makes the case for them. Scripture is clear. It is ones sins that separate one from God. Legion are the passages that set that fact in clear plain light. For brevity alone I mention just one.
Isa 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.
Written to the nation of Israel, sin had separated from fellowship with God. They were God's chosen nation. This was not speaking of salvation as such. These were God's chosen people.
The rejection of the offer of salvation will certainly seal ones fate IF they have the opportunity to hear and respond to the gospel, but that is not their damning sin. Disobedience to any known commandment of God is a damning sin, even if that simply involves eating a forbidden fruit and for that they deserve eternal separation from God, and for their sins will they stand condemned before a Holy and Just God.
Rejection of Christ, and rejection of Christ alone will damn a person to hell.
He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. (John 3:36)
But you don't believe the Bible, do you?
