freeatlast
New Member
Who will be admitted into heaven?
"Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city." Revelation 22:14
-
Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
The Judgement of man
- Thread starter freeatlast
- Start date
"Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city." Revelation 22:14
I cannot what?
freeatlast
New Member
draw the following conclusions you gave
Why not.
It is a simple mathematical conclusion.
You are stating that "a" (keeping) the "b" (law) = (results) "c" fellowship in some manner with God.
Therefore, "-a" (not keeping) the "b" (law) = (results) something other than "c" or not in the fellowship with God.
freeatlast
New Member
If you want to draw that conclusion that is fine with me. However what we know is that we will be judged by the commandments. Those who do will be the ones with the Lord and those who do not will be alone in torment.
Are God's commandments burdensome to those who are truly born again?
"For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world - our faith." 1 John 5:3, 4
What motive should prompt us to keep God's law?
"If you love Me, keep My commandments." John 14:15
1John 2:4
He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit (practice) sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot (practice) sin, because he is born of God.
Who will be admitted into heaven?
"Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city." Revelation 22:14
But the verses you posted are not conditions of love but the results of love.
I don't love Christ out of obligation to fulfill the commandments, I love Christ (for He first loved me) and the results are a tremendous desire to keep the commandments.
The difference is in motivation. And you stated that was the difference.
The motivation is either given by the Holy Spirit, or it is man generated in hope of attaining what is clearly stated in Scriptures as unattainable (for all have sinned).
If gain all ability to even cast a mountain into the sea, and not only able to keep but actually teach all the law and the prophets and have not love, I am nothing according to Paul.
Is it important to keep the commandments - certainly for they are a gauge, a tool, not in a determination of attainment, but in determination how far from attainment the believer is from the expectation of God.
Therefore, the commandments are not what is the determination of heaven and hell.
That is clearly stated by Christ when He said, "He that does not believe on me is condemned already, because he does not believe in the name of the only begotten Son of God."
Last edited by a moderator:
Are we saved by the lord grace, or by keeping His commandments?
saved by grace alone, or Law?
Which way is it?
freeatlast
New Member
It is impossible to respond to you in this reply as you have totally misrepresented anything that has been said. At no time has anything been said or even suggested as you are claiming it has been. So all I can do is point you to the truth. We are saved by grace through faith and judged if we have kept the commandments or not. Those who have will have the right to the tree of life and enter through the gates into the city. Those who have not will spend eternity in torment.
Are God's commandments burdensome to those who are truly born again?
"For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world - our faith." 1 John 5:3, 4
What motive should prompt us to keep God's law?
"If you love Me, keep My commandments." John 14:15
1John 2:4
He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit (practice) sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot (practice) sin, because he is born of God.
Who will be admitted into heaven?
"Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city." Revelation 22:14
freeatlast
New Member
This is not about salvation. This is about those who claim to be Christians and hate the commandments. By hate I am using the same understanding as when the Lord says if we do not hate our mother and father and brother and sister and even our own life we cannot be His disciple.
Those who hate the commandment are always arguing against them and want nothing or little to do with them. They constantly claim grace to get out of being commandment keepers, and that is hate from a biblical stand point.
No real believer 'hates" the 10 commandments, but we do NOT keep them in order to save us, or keep us saved, or show we re saved!
love the Lord and obey him from the heart, as we will naturally obey him IF trust and rely upon the HS now empowering us to live lives worthy o four calling in christ!
Even IF we had no written commandments, the Lord will lead/direct/enable us to live for Him in power and in His grace!
freeatlast
New Member
This is not about getting saved.
Are God's commandments burdensome to those who are truly born again?
"For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world - our faith." 1 John 5:3, 4
What motive should prompt us to keep God's law?
"If you love Me, keep My commandments." John 14:15
1John 2:4
He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit (practice) sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot (practice) sin, because he is born of God.
Who will be admitted into heaven?
"Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city." Revelation 22:14
Why and How do YOU keep all the Commandments of God?
Have you kept them perfectly since being saved, do you see it as being possible?
freeatlast
New Member
I have answered that question for you many times. Since the answer is the same today as the last time you asked I suggest the search feature.
your answers have been that we keep the 10 Commandments in order to show we are saved, that real Christians Must keep the commandments of God, and that we can get to place of always keeping them, sinless perfection is attainable!
freeatlast
New Member
This is my answer;
Are God's commandments burdensome to those who are truly born again?
"For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world - our faith." 1 John 5:3, 4
What motive should prompt us to keep God's law?
"If you love Me, keep My commandments." John 14:15
1John 2:4
He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit (practice) sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot (practice) sin, because he is born of God.
Who will be admitted into heaven?
"Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city." Revelation 22:14
"His commandments" and "My commandments" should not be confounded with the Law of Moses of which there are 603 mitvouth and 10 "words".
In fact it is impossible to keep the 613 commandments since there is no temple in Jerusalem, there is no Red Heifer to cleanse the land even if there were a temple.
Several mitvouth require a visit to the temple. e.g. To pay the temple tax; there is no Levitical priesthood to receive it or offerings.
Even if you try to keep the 10, you either can't or don't.
Do you keep the Sabbath (Saturday)? If you turn on a light on the Sabbath you can be put to death because you are kindling a fire on the Sabbath.
What about images?, Check your wallet and pockets for US money, which contain lots of images.
You must keep the law perfectly or you will receive a curse.
Here are a few of the NT commandments :
But if you think you can keep the law, then start reading Genesis through Deuteronomy and then get to work.
HankD
In fact it is impossible to keep the 613 commandments since there is no temple in Jerusalem, there is no Red Heifer to cleanse the land even if there were a temple.
Several mitvouth require a visit to the temple. e.g. To pay the temple tax; there is no Levitical priesthood to receive it or offerings.
Even if you try to keep the 10, you either can't or don't.
Do you keep the Sabbath (Saturday)? If you turn on a light on the Sabbath you can be put to death because you are kindling a fire on the Sabbath.
What about images?, Check your wallet and pockets for US money, which contain lots of images.
You must keep the law perfectly or you will receive a curse.
James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
Galatians 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
Here are a few of the NT commandments :
John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him thatsent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
John 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
John 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.
John 15:17 These things I command you, that ye love one another.
But if you think you can keep the law, then start reading Genesis through Deuteronomy and then get to work.
HankD
Last edited:
isn't it that Christ kept the Law perfectly, and God credited us for that atoning work of His on our behalf, so that God 'expects" us to today to walk in the powere of the hs, to abide in christ, and that will be sufficient to "keep His law" for the New Covenant today?
Think Fal means well, but like the some of the judaizers in Galatians, is trying to get saved by grace and yet live by the Law!
The law of love is His commandment for us, that we not only love God but that we also love one another.
1 John 4:21 And this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth God love his brother also.
Romans 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
FAL is looking at this from the point of view of what is seen in the manner of our walk rather than we are walking/living in the Spirit and we will not practice a sinful way of life because it is grievous to us and Him because He dwells within us.
The problem is that it is a matter of choice.
When we leave off following Him we grieve Him and quench His influence in our lives which leads to chatisement.
So it is primarily that we are walking in the Spirit in the law of love and the commandments of love rather than trying to keep the letter of the law of moses (all or partially).
NKJV 1 Corinthians 13
1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal.
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.
3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, but have not love, it profits me nothing.
4 Love suffers long and is kind; love does not envy; love does not parade itself, is not puffed up;
5 does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil;
6 does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth;
7 bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
...
11 When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
12 For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know just as I also am known.
13 And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.
1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal.
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.
3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, but have not love, it profits me nothing.
4 Love suffers long and is kind; love does not envy; love does not parade itself, is not puffed up;
5 does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil;
6 does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth;
7 bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
...
11 When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
12 For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know just as I also am known.
13 And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.
Love (agape-God's indwelling love) will keep one from hurting his/her neighbor, stealing his/her neighbors goods, stealing his/her spouse, lusting after what is his/hers, etc...
HankD
I am still not really sure if Fal believes/teaches that unless we are able to keep well enough the law of God, that we are even really saved!
Well, if one claims to be a child of God and there is sin, particularly if it is a continuous ongoing thing then something is wrong.
At very least our conscience should be hurting.
Sometimes FAL seems to over react with his challenges but FWIW I give him the benefit of the doubt.
On more that one occassion he has admitted that we fail.
HankD
At very least our conscience should be hurting.
Sometimes FAL seems to over react with his challenges but FWIW I give him the benefit of the doubt.
On more that one occassion he has admitted that we fail.
HankD