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The Mediatorial Kingdom

Covenanter

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
From another thread:

Tcassidy said:
The Mediatorial Kingdom ended when the times of the Gentiles began (the Babylonian Captivity). It reappeared for a very short time during the earthly ministry of the Lord Jesus Christ (the Kingdom was present with the Presence of the King), but ended again at the Ascension. It will return to earth with the return of the Lord to establish His Kingdom of God on Earth.
 

Covenanter

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
The following exchanges occurred:

The Mediatorial Kingdom ended when the times of the Gentiles began (the Babylonian Captivity). It reappeared for a very short time during the earthly ministry of the Lord Jesus Christ (the Kingdom was present with the Presence of the King), but ended again at the Ascension. It will return to earth with the return of the Lord to establish His Kingdom of God on Earth.

Please, can you explain that with Scripture references.


I see - you can't explain - you just refer to an internet link.

I can explain, but to do so would take several posts and you would just label them as being non-constructive. I provided a link that saves a lot of space and band width. What you do with it is up to you.
 

Covenanter

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Is the doctrine of "The Mediatorial Kingdom" an important doctrine to learn about & discuss - perhaps taking "a lot of space and band width."

TC expressed this opinion & provided the following Scripture references quoted from his link:

"I will not do his studying for him. I gave him an excellent resource to read for himself. If he refuses to do his own research it is his loss not mine. Besides, no matter what I posted he wouldn't believe it, no matter how much scripture I supported it with".​

Here. Let's see what he does with this:

Matthew 5:20; 7:21; 18:3; 18:8–9 (cf. Mark 9:43, 45, 47); 19:14 (cf. Mark 10:14–15; Luke 18:16–17); 19:16–30 (cf. Mark 10:17–31; Luke 18:18–30); 23:13; and John 3:5.
 

Covenanter

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Those are not my words. You took what I said and twisted it into something I never said and do not believe. But this is rather typical of you. Shame on you!

I'll quote you exactly:

He admitted he didn't know that the Hypostatic Union was, and after a brief explanation he was suddenly an expert who lectured those of us who actually know and understand it, about how wrong we are.

I will not do his studying for him. I gave him an excellent resource to read for himself. If he refuses to do his own research it is his loss not mine. Besides, no matter what I posted he wouldn't believe it, no matter how much scripture I supported it with.

Here. Let's see what he does with this:

Matthew 5:20; 7:21; 18:3; 18:8–9 (cf. Mark 9:43, 45, 47); 19:14 (cf. Mark 10:14–15; Luke 18:16–17); 19:16–30 (cf. Mark 10:17–31; Luke 18:18–30); 23:13; and John 3:5.
 

TCassidy

Late-Administator Emeritus
Administrator
As anyone can see, taking "a lot of space and band width" was NOT in the context of the question, "Is the doctrine of "The Mediatorial Kingdom" an important doctrine to learn about & discuss?"

But, again, this is rather typical of your difficulty with context.
 

Mr. Davis

Active Member
Site Supporter
As anyone can see, taking "a lot of space and band width" was NOT in the context of the question, "Is the doctrine of "The Mediatorial Kingdom" an important doctrine to learn about & discuss?"

It is an important doctrine to learn about and discuss.

Does the Mediatorial Kingdom include the Millennial Kingdom?

And, those that reign with Christ, as kings and priests, are the Spiritual Christians
and those that are carnal Christians are servants in the Kingdom? Are there Scriptures
that support this distinction?
 

David Kent

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
As anyone can see, taking "a lot of space and band width" was NOT in the context of the question, "Is the doctrine of "Meditorial Kingdomn important doctrine to learn about & discuss?"

But, again, this is rather typical of your difficulty with context.
I did a bible search and couldn't find the word Meditorial, so I would say "No it is not important"

I
 

David Kent

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
It is an important doctrine to learn about and discuss.

Does the Mediatorial Kingdom include the Millennial Kingdom?

And, those that reign with Christ, as kings and priests, are the Spiritual Christians
and those that are carnal Christians are servants in the Kingdom? Are there Scriptures
that support this distinction?
Are carnal Christians actually Christians at all?
 

TCassidy

Late-Administator Emeritus
Administrator
I can't find the word "Bible" in my bible either, but I have one right here. :)
 

Covenanter

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Back to the OP for a Biblical discussion. I won't put it in quotes 'cos replies would remove the quoted text.

Tcassidy said:
"The Mediatorial Kingdom ended when the times of the Gentiles began (the Babylonian Captivity). It reappeared for a very short time during the earthly ministry of the Lord Jesus Christ (the Kingdom was present with the Presence of the King), but ended again at the Ascension. It will return to earth with the return of the Lord to establish His Kingdom of God on Earth."​

Does that mean there was a MK from Moses to Jeconiah? or from Saul or David to Jeconiah? What do we make of Peter's Pentecost sermon? Or James' inspired restatement & application of Amos' prophecy?

Is the MK only an earthly kingdom? What is the status of Kingdom believers during the present Gospel "dispensation" while earth waits for the supposed Millennium after Jesus return?

I suggest that as Jesus is Mediator and King that the whole Gospel age IS the MK & Jesus & believers are in the words of Jesus to John -
Rev. 1:4
John, to the seven churches which are in Asia:

Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne, 5 and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth.

To Him who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood, 6 and has made us kings and priests to His God and Father, to Him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen.
 

TCassidy

Late-Administator Emeritus
Administrator
Does the Mediatorial Kingdom include the Millennial Kingdom?
Yes.

And, those that reign with Christ, as kings and priests, are the Spiritual Christians and those that are carnal Christians are servants in the Kingdom?
I don't know. I am not a proponent of that view.

Are there Scriptures
that support this distinction?
As I am not a proponent of that view I cannot support it. Perhaps someone who holds that view might like to chime in.
 

TCassidy

Late-Administator Emeritus
Administrator
The mediatorial kingdom is defined as

1. the rule of God,

2. through a divinely chosen representative,

3. who not only speaks and acts to the people for God,

4. and also speaks and acts for the people to God,

5. its mediatorial ruler is always a member of the human race.

The Mediatorial rulers would include:

Moses

Joshua

Samuel

The Judges

The Monarchial Mediatorial rulers were:

Saul

David

Solomon

The Kings of Judah

Ending with the Babylonian Captivity which began the Times of the Gentiles.

The Mediatorial Kingdom of Christ:

During His earthly ministry. 5BC - 31AD

During His return and the consummation of the ages. (TBD)
 

Covenanter

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
I note you assert
TCassidy said:
The Mediatorial Kingdom of Christ:

During His earthly ministry. 5BC - 31AD

During His return and the consummation of the ages. (TBD)
You explicitly exclude the present Gospel age, implying Christ is not our mediator; not the mediator for redeemed sinners.

Mediator Scriptures can be found here. I'll requote some -
Gal 3:19 - What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. Moses.

1Ti 2:5 - For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus,

Heb 8:6 - But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, inasmuch as He is also Mediator of a better covenant, which was established on better promises.


Notice the references are present tense. Jesus is perfect God, perfect man in one person so how is he presently disqualified as Mediator?

Perfect fulfilment of prophecy does await Jesus' return in glory when he will bring about the final state - the NH&NE. Not some millennial half-way house where Jesus sits with his human, physical body on David's throne in Jerusalem.

Where does Scripture say there was no mediator between the exile & the incarnation?

Where does Scripture say the glorified Lord Jesus Christ is presently disqualified as a Mediator?
 

Reformed

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
You explicitly exclude the present Gospel age, implying Christ is not our mediator; not the mediator for redeemed sinners.

Friend, I believe Tom was making the point that mediatorial representatives(small "m") were physically present at the time of their role. Yes. Christ is our Mediator (big "M"), who intercedes directly to the Father on our behalf. As a Covenant Theologian and an Amillennialist, I'm of little use on discussions about the Millennium, so I'll return you back to your thread.
 

Covenanter

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
You {TC} explicitly exclude the present Gospel age, implying Christ is not our mediator; not the mediator for redeemed sinners.

Friend, I believe Tom was making the point that mediatorial representatives(small "m") were physically present at the time of their role.

Yes. Christ is our Mediator (big "M"), who intercedes directly to the Father on our behalf. As a Covenant Theologian and an Amillennialist, I'm of little use on discussions about the Millennium, so I'll return you back to your thread.

Thanks, Reformed. I do understand that under the Old Covenant dispensation that human mediators were physically present. But as types of Christ & his perfect office as Mediator. What I absolutely reject is that Christ is not our Mediator during the present Gospel age, because he is not physically present.

Mat. 28:18 Then Jesus came to them and said, ‘All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.’

Dare they deny that glorious truth?
And
"As a Covenant Theologian and an Amillennialist" you are welcome to share your understanding.
 

prophecy70

Active Member
As a Covenant Theologian and an Amillennialist, I'm of little use on discussions about the Millennium, so I'll return you back to your thread.

Im an Amillennialist as well and I believe there is more of us here, you are more then welcome to share you understanding.
 

Reformed

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Thanks, Reformed. I do understand that under the Old Covenant dispensation that human mediators were physically present. But as types of Christ & his perfect office as Mediator. What I absolutely reject is that Christ is not our Mediator during the present Gospel age, because he is not physically present.

Mat. 28:18 Then Jesus came to them and said, ‘All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.’

Dare they deny that glorious truth?
And
"As a Covenant Theologian and an Amillennialist" you are welcome to share your understanding.
The only thing I will add is that, while Christ is our Great Sheperd, He has given the church under-shepherds for the purpose of caring for His flock (Eph. 4:11). He gave church discipline as a loving enforcement mechanism to be overseen by the elders, although participated in by the entire church. Soteriologically speaking, Christ is our direct mediator with the Father. We are privileged to be chosen as vessels whereby the Gospel is to be proclaimed, but it is Christ who saves.
 
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