This thread is to be closed soon. This is how this thread will end. There are some calvies who like very much to use strawman arguments in order to debate. They want to be able to hang on to that debate tactic and will claw, scream, and fight for it. For them it is all about debating and winning and little to no concern for reasonable discussions. Its war to them. Those with whom they disagree must be destroyed and their positions held up to everyone as the spoils of war. They care nothing about the people with whom they disagree nor is fellowship a goal of being here. It is all about war and winning. This thread bears that out.