I am sure that most of you by now know that I believe that the KJV is the perfect, inerrant Word of God, and I have learned that most of you do not believe this. My question is simple, and I have asked it before but I wanted to start this thread on it. If the KJV is not the perfect, inerrant Word of God in the English language then what is? If there isn't a perfect, inerrant English translation of the Bible then why isn't there? Isn't God powerful enough to see to it that we have the perfect, inerrant Word of God in our language?
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The Perfect Inerrant Bible
- Thread starter deacon jd
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One problem is your definition of "perfect".
"Perfect" does not mean exclusive or even unique. If two pitchers pitch games in which they allow no base runners then both have pitched "perfect games" but that doesn't mean those games were identical.
A "perfect" Bible is one that lacks nothing essential to its kind. It does NOT mean that if two Bibles use different wording then it is necessary that one is perfect while the other is corrupted.
Your belief about the KJV simply can't be reconciled with the fact that other "perfect" forms of God's Word have been around for over 1900 years and none of them "perfectly" match the KJV.
"Perfect" does not mean exclusive or even unique. If two pitchers pitch games in which they allow no base runners then both have pitched "perfect games" but that doesn't mean those games were identical.
A "perfect" Bible is one that lacks nothing essential to its kind. It does NOT mean that if two Bibles use different wording then it is necessary that one is perfect while the other is corrupted.
Your belief about the KJV simply can't be reconciled with the fact that other "perfect" forms of God's Word have been around for over 1900 years and none of them "perfectly" match the KJV.
deacon jd said:
God's word in all valid translations is infallible, inerrant.
Not one significant doctrinal difference can be found b/t the KJV and NIV. Or NASB. And others.
But I must ask, um....
...if there were spelling corrections, doesn't that negate your particular definition of "perfection?"
In my courses that involved writing, if I misspelled a word, then the paper wasn't given a "perfect" grade.
Ed Edwards
<img src=/Ed.gif>
Rbell: //God's word in all valid translations is infallible, inerrant.//
Amen, Brother Rbell -- Preach it! :thumbs:
Rbell: //Not one significant doctrinal difference
can be found b/t the KJV and NIV. Or NASB. And others.//
Amen, Brother Rbell -- you are so RIGHT ON! :thumbs:
Amen, Brother Rbell -- Preach it! :thumbs:
Rbell: //Not one significant doctrinal difference
can be found b/t the KJV and NIV. Or NASB. And others.//
Amen, Brother Rbell -- you are so RIGHT ON! :thumbs:
mcdirector
Active Member
Ed Edwards said:
I most humbly concur with Bro. Ed concurring with Bro. Bell :tongue3:
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If we take it form a Scriptural point of view...
Mat 24:35 - Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
(also Mk 13:31, Lk 21:33)
The very "words" of Jesus will not pass away. Does anyone here believe that His words have not passed away, if so where do they exist?
Isa 40:8 - The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of our God shall stand for ever.
Has His word stood forever, or has only His thought/message stood forever? If so, where is it found today?
1 Pet 1:23 - Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
Does the word of God live and abide forever? If so, where is it today?
If the answer to this is that while God gave plenary inspiration He only gives partial preservation, then perhaps you could list Scripture that speaks to God's "partially preserved" word??
Mat 24:35 - Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
(also Mk 13:31, Lk 21:33)
The very "words" of Jesus will not pass away. Does anyone here believe that His words have not passed away, if so where do they exist?
Isa 40:8 - The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of our God shall stand for ever.
Has His word stood forever, or has only His thought/message stood forever? If so, where is it found today?
1 Pet 1:23 - Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
Does the word of God live and abide forever? If so, where is it today?
If the answer to this is that while God gave plenary inspiration He only gives partial preservation, then perhaps you could list Scripture that speaks to God's "partially preserved" word??
In all valid translations.
God has preserved his word...in all valid translations. Valid translations: Those translations which preserve all fundamental doctrines. Differences that exist are inconsequetial to the Christian faith.
e.g.: New World Translation...not valid. Bad Christology et al.
New American Standard...valid. All fundamental doctrines consistent with textual records.
I'll do that when someone lists Scripture that the KJV, and not the Great Bible, or Geneva Bible, is the "truly preserved" word of God for English peoples.
Forever settled in heaven
New Member
deacon jd said:
why, u have a prob w The Message?
cos there's somebody out there hissin' "Yea hath God said?"
'cept when bible deniars go around calling the inerrant Word a "PERversion."
how can a PERversion be perfect n inerrant at the same time? :sleep:
rbell,
I assume you believe in plenary verbal inspiration?
So you don't believe in plenary verbal preservation, but in doctrinal preservation?
I assume you believe in plenary verbal inspiration?
I was not asking about translations, but about preservation. I did list verses that spoke to God preserving His word - which you seem to interpret as God preserving His doctrine.
The KJV is perfect for crystal doctrines over modern versions. However the KJV is not perfect translation because the KJV translators were sinners and not perfect. Do you mean the "inerrant" KJV? If so, how would you know these KJV translators were inerrant during they were still sinners? The inerrancy refers to the autographs of the OT and of the NT only, not the KJV because the KJV is a translation.deacon jd said:
deacon jd said:
It is inaccurate to claim that all the 2000 changes in the text of the 1611 edition of the KJV by later editors and printers was only the correction of printing errors and spelling. A good number of the renderings in the 1611 edition of the KJV that later editors changed were the responsibility of the KJV translators themselves since the KJV translators kept those renderings from the Bishops' Bible. Since the KJV translators had kept those renderings from the Bishops' Bible, they clearly were not the fault of the printers. There were some changes made in the text of Oxford editions of the KJV after 1880 and in Cambridge editions in 1873 and after 1900 in most present Cambridge editions although the 2005 Cambridge edition has many changes introduced in 2005.
Forever settled in heaven
New Member
Askjo said:
um, what might these "crystal doctrines" be?
i remember my teachers talking abt anthropology, theology proper, bibliology, but not Crystalogy.
closest thing was Christology! :laugh:
Anti-Alexandrian
Member
TAttack on Bible deleted
And what about [SIZE=-1]1 Timothy 3:16 as found in say the NIV or the NASB?[/SIZE]
Too simple for you?
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