The Role of Women

[Sai]

Think about the absolute tragedy that Adam sinned willfully. He was not deceived. It is through his willful act of sin that brought sin to every person that has ever lived.

If you claim women are easily deceived in matters of religion, then follow through the logic and claim men are prone to deliberate rebellion against God.

Amazing Eve did not forsake him for willfully sinning against God and then blaming her for his moral failure.

Looks like that pattern of blaming women for the moral failures of men continues to this very day.

peace to you

Women receive the same spiritual gifts as men do. Teaching, mercy, helps etc. however they have been forbidden to use their gifts in certain areas of church leadership. The reason we are given for example for the head covering is because God gave the woman long hair as the woman’s glory, she is to cover her glory in the meeting of the congregation because men are given the responsibility of reflecting God’s image to the church by uncovering their heads. If the woman has her hair on display she detracts from the glory of God seen in men’s obedience to teach the laws of Christ during the called out church service. Silence is required due to women’s natural deficiency in the realm of seducing spirits and doctrines of demons, which they are prone to believe.


Joy unspeakable full of glory

 

[RighteousnessTemperance&]

[Gen 3:14-19 KJV]
14 And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou [art] cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: 15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.
16 Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire [shall be] to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed [is] the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat [of] it all the days of thy life; 18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; 19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou [art], and unto dust shalt thou return.​

From what I read,

• the serpent was directly cursed,
• Eve suffered consequences because she was deceived but no mention of a curse,
• Adam suffered consequences while the “ground” was cursed because of Adam’s choice.

The original comment was about blame, and all three were blamed, not just Adam.

Adam and Eve both received death, the cursed ground being a reminder of both origin and destiny.

 

[Scarlett O.]

God placed the blame upon Adam, not Eve!

Well, yes, that is what I said.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Not challenging your main point, but am curious of the need to make the fruit edible only by getting up. Got up from where? Why? The text says Eve also gave the fruit to her husband with her. Is this extra point really important to your thesis?

Well, he was either standing with her or sitting on the ground. I didn't mean anything by that.

 

[Scarlett O.]

You display the desire to usurp the man by targeting Adam.

If Adam did not know evil he would not have known the intent of the serpent who was having a dialogue with Eve. And he would not have known Eve’s susceptibility to deception. It was in Adam’s nature to follow Eve because he did not want to lose the only created being that belonged to him, he owned her, he named her.

I have not displayed a desire to usurp a man. There are only two men who have ever been in authority over me and that was my father and my pastor. That's it. In laying out what the Bible says, how can I be usurping anything?

Let me make this concise - I. HAVE. NOT. TARGETED. ADAM.

YOU targeted Eve and I merely explained why the Bible says that all sin comes from Adam. I made it very clear that Eve's sin was GREAT.

Adam is NOT the romance novel guy who just followed Eve so that he would not lose her. He threw her under the bus when God asked HIM what he had done.

You say that Adam just didn't know any better? No. Adam knew what God's command was and when the serpent said otherwise and Eve turned to him to hand him the fruit - he deliberately disobeyed.

Why are you excusing Adam by saying he just didn't know better?

This is very important: In my explanation to you about why God placed the responsibility of the world's sin on Adam, I have NOT dismissed Eve's role in this mess.

YOU - in making Eve the only bad guy and claiming Adam just didn't know better - you have dismissed Adam's role in the world's sin.

 

[Yeshua1]

Not so, but on Adam, Eve, and the Serpent, all.

Yes, in Genesis, but Paul laid it all upon Adam as being the guilty party between himself and eve!

 

[Sai]

I have not displayed a desire to usurp a man. There are only two men who have ever been in authority over me and that was my father and my pastor. That's it. In laying out what the Bible says, how can I be usurping anything?

Let me make this concise - I. HAVE. NOT. TARGETED. ADAM.

YOU targeted Eve and I merely explained why the Bible says that all sin comes from Adam. I made it very clear that Eve's sin was GREAT.

Adam is NOT the romance novel guy who just followed Eve so that he would not lose her. He threw her under the bus when God asked HIM what he had done.

You say that Adam just didn't know any better? No. Adam knew what God's command was and when the serpent said otherwise and Eve turned to him to hand him the fruit - he deliberately disobeyed.

Why are you excusing Adam by saying he just didn't know better?

This is very important: In my explanation to you about why God placed the responsibility of the world's sin on Adam, I have NOT dismissed Eve's role in this mess.

YOU - in making Eve the only bad guy and claiming Adam just didn't know better - you have dismissed Adam's role in the world's sin.

Hmmm.. this sounds like a rebellious woman to me smh.

I started by giving the woman credit by specifically conceding that women have the very same gifts as men and can be and sometimes are better equipped to do the very same tasks as men. That right there just blew your argument up in smoke concerning me “pinning” on Evelyn what God has laid upon Adam, the responsible party for the failure to obey the command to not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

What you fail to see is that women are uniquely susceptible to doctrines of demons and seducing spirits. That does not make women less valuable than men. It is what scripture teaches. Mary baker e, hellen g white, and scores of others within Christendom.

If your pastor is teaching that the command for women to wear a head covering and to remain silent during the services is just a cultural thing excusing it away, then he, just like Adam will be held responsible for you not receiving the blessing God wants to give to faithful women of God during the Messianic Kingdom that precedes the Eternal Order by 1000 years.


Joy unspeakable full of glory

 

[Sai]

Yes, in Genesis, but Paul laid it all upon Adam as being the guilty party between himself and eve!

God allowed it to happen knowing full well what would happen. That Eve would be deceived in thinking she could become like God. That’s pretty heavy. To actually believe that. Plenty of men have thought that in history too, not just Eve. However, Adam did not believe he could be equal to God unlike Eve and perhaps more importantly like Satan believed.
Satan attempted to get both Adam and Eve to believe what he believed thru the beauty of his own countenance, that he too could be God. Isn’t it significant to the entire created beings in the heavens that man did not accept the presupposition that he had within his make up the ability to become like God?

Adam was given authority over more than had been given to Satan. Satan had been given authority over the Eden of God which was a mineral garden. We are not told of any female angelic beings nor any animal creations that Satan had been given authority over. And Satan was not created in the image of the almighty.

Satan succeed in causing the fall of Adam because he deceived Eve. What was on Adam’s mind we can not know.


Joy unspeakable full of glory

 

[Scarlett O.]

Hmmm.. this sounds like a rebellious woman to me smh.

I said nothing to constitute rebellion.

you fail to see is that women are uniquely susceptible to doctrines of demons and seducing spirits

Show me please - from the Bible - where women are "uniquely susceptible to doctrines of demons and seducing spirits."

Now there are about 3-5 men on this board who will come to your defense and agree with you. I've heard over the years here that women sin more than men because they are more CARNAL than men and that women in general are "easily deceived" [which is not in the Bible either].

I'll come back to this thread only to read your response. But I won't respond anymore.

But I DO want to see from the Bible where you get your belief that women are "uniquely susceptible" to evil and men never fall for the devil's lies. I'm anxious to hear how you answer this.

 

[Yeshua1]

I said nothing to constitute rebellion.



Show me please - from the Bible - where women are "uniquely susceptible to doctrines of demons and seducing spirits."

Now there are about 3-5 men on this board who will come to your defense and agree with you. I've heard over the years here that women sin more than men because they are more CARNAL than men and that women in general are "easily deceived" [which is not in the Bible either].

I'll come back to this thread only to read your response. But I won't respond anymore.

But I DO want to see from the Bible where you get your belief that women are "uniquely susceptible" to evil and men never fall for the devil's lies. I'm anxious to hear how you answer this.

Last time I checked, Pastor Russel and Joseph Smith fell hard for the Devil lies, and both were male!

 

[atpollard]

The original comment was about blame, and all three were blamed, not just Adam.

Please point to the scripture where Eve is blamed.
I am familiar with verses in Genesis that blame the serpent and verses by Paul that blame Adam, but cannot call to memory any specific verse that blames Eve. I just want to see what you see in scripture to base your statement on.

 

[canadyjd]

I said nothing to constitute rebellion.



Show me please - from the Bible - where women are "uniquely susceptible to doctrines of demons and seducing spirits."

Now there are about 3-5 men on this board who will come to your defense and agree with you. I've heard over the years here that women sin more than men because they are more CARNAL than men and that women in general are "easily deceived" [which is not in the Bible either].

I'll come back to this thread only to read your response. But I won't respond anymore.

But I DO want to see from the Bible where you get your belief that women are "uniquely susceptible" to evil and men never fall for the devil's lies. I'm anxious to hear how you answer this.

I want you to know I have enjoyed your level headed, biblically centered responses for several years.

Peace to you

 

[Sai]

I said nothing to constitute rebellion.



Show me please - from the Bible - where women are "uniquely susceptible to doctrines of demons and seducing spirits."

Now there are about 3-5 men on this board who will come to your defense and agree with you. I've heard over the years here that women sin more than men because they are more CARNAL than men and that women in general are "easily deceived" [which is not in the Bible either].

I'll come back to this thread only to read your response. But I won't respond anymore.

But I DO want to see from the Bible where you get your belief that women are "uniquely susceptible" to evil and men never fall for the devil's lies. I'm anxious to hear how you answer this.

“and Adam was not beguiled, but the woman being beguiled hath fallen into transgression:”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭2:14‬ ‭ASV‬‬


Joy unspeakable full of glory

 

[Sai]

Last time I checked, Pastor Russel and Joseph Smith fell hard for the Devil lies, and both were male!

Dude no, what are you doing man?


Joy unspeakable full of glory

 

[Sai]

I want you to know I have enjoyed your level headed, biblically centered responses for several years.

Peace to you

Smh


Joy unspeakable full of glory

 

[Sai]

“and Adam was not beguiled, but the woman being beguiled hath fallen into transgression:”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭2:14‬ ‭ASV‬‬


Joy unspeakable full of glory

“But I permit not a woman to teach, nor to have dominion over a man, but to be in quietness. For Adam was first formed, then Eve;”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭2:12-13‬ ‭ASV‬‬


Joy unspeakable full of glory

 

[RighteousnessTemperance&]

Please point to the scripture where Eve is blamed.
I am familiar with verses in Genesis that blame the serpent and verses by Paul that blame Adam, but cannot call to memory any specific verse that blames Eve. I just want to see what you see in scripture to base your statement on.

So, perhaps you can first explain what you mean. Are you suggesting that Eve was not aware of what God had said about not eating from the Tree? Or that Eve did not sin? Or that Eve was not held responsible for her sin? Or that Eve did not deserve the consequences of her sin? Or that there were no consequences for her sin?

 

[canadyjd]

Smh


Joy unspeakable full of glory

Smh?

peace to you

 

[atpollard]

So, perhaps you can first explain what you mean. Are you suggesting that Eve was not aware of what God had said about not eating from the Tree? Or that Eve did not sin? Or that Eve was not held responsible for her sin? Or that Eve did not deserve the consequences of her sin? Or that there were no consequences for her sin?

See post #59 where I already did as you request.

You said:

The original comment was about blame, and all three were blamed, not just Adam.

I just asked for the specific scripture you base that claim on.

Serpent is blamed: (Genesis 3:14)
Adam is blamed: (Romans 5:12)
Eve is blamed: ??

 

[atpollard]

Smh?

peace to you

I had to look it up ... SMH = Shaking My Head