• Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

The shocking link between psychiatric drugs, suicide, violence and mass murder

Ed Edwards

<img src=/Ed.gif>
Caveat: Do not make medical judgements on misreadings
of what is said at www.wnd.com
wnd.com is a source of bad science, bad news,
bad medicine; invalid paranoia & conspiracy theory;
excellent source of baseless propaganda examples. :(

I will continue to lobby the PTB (powers that be)
at BB (Bapitst Board) to not allow pointers to
WND.COM on their web site.

Though I must admit World News Daily is better
than Weekly World News ;)
 

Baptist in Richmond

Active Member
Phillip said:
There is probably another very scary part. I bet every one of these people drank at least 16 ounces of water during the day or two before they did their committed their crimes. . . there just HAS to be a link here, too. I think we should apply for a ten million dollar grant to study the effects of water on murderers brain, after all, we know that dehydration can cause the brain to swell. . .

Yes, except that the fact that practically everyone in the country has engaged in the same behavior, I think we can safely exclude them from the study group......


Regards,
BiR
 

Magnetic Poles

New Member
Ed Edwards said:
Caveat: Do not make medical judgements on misreadings
of what is said at www.wnd.com
wnd.com is a source of bad science, bad news,
bad medicine; invalid paranoia & conspiracy theory;
excellent source of baseless propaganda examples. :(

I will continue to lobby the PTB (powers that be)
at BB (Bapitst Board) to not allow pointers to
WND.COM on their web site.

Though I must admit World News Daily is better
than Weekly World News ;)
I'm not too sure Ed. Batboy seems more credible than WND! :laugh:
 

Rufus_1611

New Member
Ed Edwards said:
Do you understand that the sides are reports of what
some 15 MILLION people have experienced?
Any one experience any 1 person had
is listed for LEGAL REASONS (i.e. if the company lists the
sides, it protects them more /not absolutely/ from
legal suits). Reading the sides IS NOT mathematically
valid statistics. Reading the sides is good training for a Lawyer
but not for a mathematician :)

I have not made a statistical or mathematical argument here. Bottom-line is the drug manufacturers admit that these drugs have some very real and dangerous side effects and it just so happens that in a number of cases folks that are committing mass homicides happen to be on the drugs that these manufacturers say contribute to homicidal tendencies, 'tis a curious thing.
 

Rufus_1611

New Member
Ed Edwards said:
Caveat: Do not make medical judgements on misreadings
of what is said at www.wnd.com
wnd.com is a source of bad science, bad news,
bad medicine; invalid paranoia & conspiracy theory;
excellent source of baseless propaganda examples. :(

I will continue to lobby the PTB (powers that be)
at BB (Bapitst Board) to not allow pointers to
WND.COM on their web site.

Though I must admit World News Daily is better
than Weekly World News ;)

Worldnetdaily is a neoconservative site with significant misdirection. However, in order for a source to lend themselves credibility they have to mix in a bit of truth in order to mislead with their lies. Most sights with agendas have about 80-90% truth and I believe, on this topic, WND is on to something and can be corroborated by other sources. To dwell on the WND thing is about as effective as the milk and water arguments.

How about we focus on just one matter....

"Paxil's known "adverse drug reactions" – according to the drug's own 2001 FDA-approved label – include "mania," "insomnia," "anxiety," "agitation," "confusion," "amnesia," "depression," "paranoid reaction," "psychosis," "hostility," "delirium," "hallucinations," "abnormal thinking," "depersonalization" and "lack of emotion," among others."

Is the above statement fact or fiction? If it is fact, are these adverse drug reactions worth having millions of people taking these drugs? Notice that one of the adverse drug reactions is depression! How can a side effect for an anti-depressant be depression?! What is the number of people that experience psychosis, hallucinations etc. before we say wooah, problem?

Let's make it two matters...

Do you agree that there is a link between SSRIs and suicide? The FDA, Eli Lilly and Pfizer seem to think so and here's a non-WND site that says so...

FDA Proposes New Anti-Depressant Drug Warning For Suicidal Thoughts In Young Adults

The U.S. Food and Drug Administration on Wednesday proposed that the manufacturers of anti-depressant drugs should include a suicide warning on all anti-depressant medication labels for adults aged 18-24, who are considered at an increased risk of suicidal thoughts and behavior after consuming the drugs.

The FDA said the labels, which already include similar warnings for children and adolescents, should also warn young-adult consumers about a risk of developing suicidal thoughts during initial treatment, generally in the first one to two months.

Federal health authorities said that the new changes would also include text stating that scientific data does not show such an increased suicidal risk in adults older than 24, and that adults aged 65 and older who take anti-depressants are at lower risk of experiencing suicidal ideation.

The new warnings would also indicate that depression and certain other serious psychiatric disorders are the main causes of suicide. The FDA has now given the manufacturers of anti-depressants a deadline of 30 days to submit their revised product labels and revised medication guidelines for review.

Eli Lilly as said in a statement, "We believe this step will help ensure that the millions of people with depression who are young adults age 24 and under and their families can make informed treatment decisions while minimizing the fear and stigma associated with depression."

Other companies that have agreed to the new proposal include Zoloft manufacturer Pfizer Inc. (Source: http://www.netscape.com/viewstory/2...l-thoughts-in-young-adults/v/6123/&frame=true)
 

Ed Edwards

<img src=/Ed.gif>
Rufus_1611 said:
I have not made a statistical or mathematical argument here. ...

Somebody uptopic is trying to make a statistical argument.
Well some one find me 900+ murders a year to make the
15 million antidepressant users EQUAL to the general
American population.

Unfortunately the pseudo-statistical argument begs
for more government stats, control, and meddling.

relatively unbiased Source:
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/ssris/MH00066

MayoClinic said:
Suicidal feelings and SSRIs

In some cases, antidepressants may be associated with worsening symptoms of depression or suicidal thoughts or behavior. These symptoms or thoughts are most likely to occur early in treatment or when you change your dosage, but they can occur at any time during treatment. Be sure to talk to your doctor about any changes in your symptoms. You may need more careful monitoring at the beginning of treatment or upon a change in treatment, or you may need to stop the medication if your symptoms worsen.

IMHO SSRI's make one think clearer.
If one is thinking of suicide, one is more
capable of planning and executing that plan.
 

Rufus_1611

New Member
Ed Edwards said:
Somebody uptopic is trying to make a statistical argument.
Well some one find me 900+ murders a year to make the
15 million antidepressant users EQUAL to the general
American population.

Unfortunately the pseudo-statistical argument begs
for more government stats, control, and meddling.

relatively unbiased Source:
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/ssris/MH00066



IMHO SSRI's make one think clearer.
If one is thinking of suicide, one is more
capable of planning and executing that plan.
Whereas one without the SSRI's won't be able to locate the trigger?

You didn't answer my questions Ed. That's alright, not the first time.

I'll just note that from your relatively unbiased source:

Side effects of SSRIs include:

* Nausea
* Sexual dysfunction, including reduced desire or orgasm difficulties
* Headache
* Diarrhea
* Nervousness
* Rash
* Agitation
* Restlessness
* Increased sweating
* Weight gain
* Drowsiness
* Insomnia

I find it interesting that they included neither depression nor homicidal ideation as a side effect.
 

Ed Edwards

<img src=/Ed.gif>
Rufus_1611 said:
...
I find it interesting that they included neither depression nor homicidal ideation as a side effect.

I've already answered that up-topic:

Do you understand that the sides are reports of what
some 15 MILLION people have experienced?
Any one experience any 1 person had
is listed for LEGAL REASONS (i.e. if the company lists the
sides, it protects them more /not absolutely/ from
legal suits).

by contrast, Mayo Clinic has no legal reason for listing
low odds sides.
 

JustChristian

New Member
This is like saying that those who take a medication to reduce their blood pressure (e.g. Toprol) have a higher incidence of heart attacks and therefore Toprol causes heart attacks. We're talking about a subset of people who are clinically depressed and therefore more likely to consider suicide. I'd like to see a statistic comparing all those who are clinically depressed who don't take medication versus those who do. That would be meaningful.
 

Ed Edwards

<img src=/Ed.gif>
BaptistBeliever: //This is like saying that those who take a medication
to reduce their blood pressure (e.g. Toprol) have
a higher incidence of heart attacks
and therefore Toprol causes heart attacks.//

Strangely, I take Toprol and an SSRI .

(Ed thumbs thru DANGEROUS DRUG INTERACTIONS,
The People's Pharmacy Guide {(St Martin's Paperbacks, 1999}) )

Evidently Prozac* might have some bad interactions with Toprol
(If I have a heart attack I should notify my Doctor immediately).
SSRIs aren't listed yet. Maybe I should get a 2007 book?

*Prozac is NOT what I take. But I have a friend from whom
Prozac made the past 7 years livable.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Top