The Sin Nature

[percho]

I always think back to Adam in that situation in the Garden. God created Adam, planted a garden, and then took Adam and put him in the Garden.

I also believe this was in accordance with God's plan.

I agree and what was the devil doing in the garden where God put the man? I do not think God was testing the man.

 

[JonC]

I agree and what was the devil doing in the garden where God put the man? I do not think God was testing the man.

I think Paul was correct with his comparison of Adam's disobedience to God's command with Israel's disobedience to the Law.

The Law was perfect. The Garden was perfect. But flesh falls short when placed under the perfect.

 

[Craigbythesea]

The material on the "sin nature" in this OP is provided by Kenneth Wuest (1893-1961), former professor of the "New Testament Greek," Moody Bible Institute.

It's vital that we grasp an understanding of the sin nature in order to build a foundation in which to approach this all important chapter 6 of Romans. This is what I will attempt to do in the OP, and hopefully, Lord willing, we can move on into the chapter with a better understanding of exactly what the great apostle is teaching us.

Mr. Wuest gives us the definition of the sin nature.

"The sin or evil nature is actually the Adamic nature which imprisoned man at the fall. It has poisoned the entirety of the human race and for all time. It is the nature which encourages sin and which against, man is powerless.

At Calvary Jesus broke the hold of this deadly yoke. However, He did allow it to remain, but powerless. Its remaining is a disciplinary measure. If the Believer correctly follows Christ, there is no problem; however, if we yield to temptation and sin, and then try to overcome in the flesh, the sin nature comes alive with serious consequences.

So, in this chapter we will study this all important subject of sin in the life of the Christian, why it is there, and the victory afforded by Christ -- the only victory there is incidentally."

The Christian and the Sin Nature

When the medical profession speaks of a disease germ that has not yet been isolated, it means that germ has never been identified and thus isolated from those germs which are known. Since that germ has never been identified, medicine has not been able to discover a remedy for it. Once the germ has been isolated, a remedy can usually be found. This is the case of the Believer.

The Christian who has never isolated the evil nature -- that is, who has not discovered the Truth of Romans Chapter 6 where God through the Apostle Paul describes the inner change which occurs at the moment he is saved, and also the Christians adjustment to this inner change, does not have consistent victory over it. But when in the Christian's thinking, this matter is cleared up and this nature isolated, he has the remedy which will enable him to gain consistent victory over sin in his life.

The Bible has thus isolated the germ called sin; identifying it as the fallen nature received of Adam. This nature remains in the individual even after God has saved him, as we learn from 1 John 1:8,

"If we say that we have no sin (sin nature), we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."

God, in salvation breaks the power of this sinful nature over the Believer, but leaves it in him as a disciplinary measure. When the Believer refuses its behests, saying a complete "Yes" to Jesus Christ, he glorifies God, defeats Satan, and grows in spiritual strength and stature.

If the Believer expects to to gain consistent victory over this nature, He must know two things: A. What God has done in his inner being with regard to that nature; B. What adjustments it is necessary for him to make in relation to it. These two things Paul takes up in chapter 6, which we are now studying.

Sorry for the long post, just one more thing concerning the approach to Chapter 6, as we learn how to learn from the Apostle Paul. Mr. Wuest continues.

The first thing we must settle, regards the word "sin." Does it refer here to acts of sin committed by the Believer, or to the depraved nature (sin nature) still in him?

Inasmuch as the definite article appears before the word "sin" in the Greek Text, in other words, "the sin" this means we are referring here to the sin nature, actually to sin reigning as a king (Rom. 5:21).

Every time the word "sin" is used in this Chapter 6 as a noun, if the reader will substitute the words "sinful nature" or "sin nature" in its place, interpretation will be much easier.

Hopefully we can build a foundation on what Mr. Wuest has here given us. And If anyone would like to go into this Chapter 6 of Romans to understand exactly what Paul is saying about this sin nature, let's do it!

Are we to believe Kenneth Wuest’s substandard interpretation of the Bible—or are we to believe the Bible as the Holy Spirit makes it clear to us and has made it clear to countless thousands of Christians who had a much better understand of it than did Wuest.

Four critical points:

1. The concept that man has a sin nature does not come from the Bible!

2. The English word “flesh” is a translation of the Greek word σάρξ, a characteristic of every human being, including Jesus as pertaining to his human nature, which makes human beings susceptible to temptation.

3. To live in the flesh is to be living in subjection to the desires of flesh, and especially those desires that are in conflict with Christian teaching.

4. Regarding Romans 6:6:

We know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be destroyed, and we might no longer be enslaved to sin. (NRSV)​

The English word “body” is a translation of the Greek word σῶμα expressing the concept of the physical body of human beings in which resides the flesh. Christians are to reckon themselves, their physical bodies along with its temptations, to be dead to sin just as Jesus became dead to all temptations to sin when his physical body died on the cross (Rom. 6:11).

 

[Charlie24]

Are we to believe Kenneth Wuest’s substandard interpretation of the Bible—or are we to believe the Bible as the Holy Spirit makes it clear to us and has made it clear to countless thousands of Christians who had a much better understand of it than did Wuest.

Four critical points:

1. The concept that man has a sin nature does not come from the Bible!

2. The English word “flesh” is a translation of the Greek word σάρξ, a characteristic of every human being, including Jesus as pertaining to his human nature, which makes human beings susceptible to temptation.

3. To live in the flesh is to be living in subjection to the desires of flesh, and especially those desires that are in conflict with Christian teaching.

4. Regarding Romans 6:6:

We know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be destroyed, and we might no longer be enslaved to sin. (NRSV)​

The English word “body” is a translation of the Greek word σῶμα expressing the concept of the physical body of human beings in which resides the flesh. Christians are to reckon themselves, their physical bodies along with its temptations, to be dead to sin just as Jesus became dead to all temptations to sin when his physical body died on the cross (Rom. 6:11).

As I've said before, everyone has to study the Scripture to determine doctrine for themselves.

Mr. Wuest has only provided what he found and believes, but you are the final judge in your beliefs.

I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything, just giving the explanation of where the sin nature came from and where it's found in Scripture for those who already believe in the sin nature.

If I didn't believe in the sin nature I would have just ignored that thread.

 

[Craigbythesea]

As I've said before, everyone has to study the Scripture to determine doctrine for themselves.

Mr. Wuest has only provided what he found and believes, but you are the final judge in your beliefs.

I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything, just giving the explanation of where the sin nature came from and where it's found in Scripture for those who already believe in the sin nature.

If I didn't believe in the sin nature I would have just ignored that thread.

Everyone should study the Scriptures to learn the truth, but some people study the Scripture to determine doctrine for themselves. Unfortunately, Kenneth Wuest did not bother to get either a University or seminary education but only the very limited education offered by a highly sectarian Bible college whose theology is a commingling of dispensationalism and Calvinism and therefore on the distant fringe of reality. Very much of Paul’s ministry was devoted to exposing theological error for what it is and the damage that it can do to it adherents. Christians who have been blessed by God with a good education and who have a solid knowledge of the truth have a solemn obligation before God to follow Paul’s example, especially regarding theological errors that are an egregious mutilation of the truth that he taught.


Why not share with us what you have learned from your study of the scriptures rather than pass off as the truth the errors that Wuest taught?


A few of my comments from another thread regarding the meaning of the Greek words:


By the early 1900’s, the new studies in the lexicography of Koine Greek had become so great in number and significance that Erwin Preuschen published his Greek-German lexicon in 1910. Upon his death in 1920, the revision of his lexicon was entrusted to Walter Bauer and this revision was published in 1928 as the second edition. In 1930, James Hope Mouton and George Milligan independently published The Vocabulary of the Greek Testament. A thoroughly revised edition of the Preuschen lexicon was published in 1937 with only Bauer’s name on the title page. Bauer realized, however, that his lexicon, although a huge improvement over Thayer’s in terms of accuracy and completeness, needed to be thoroughly revised and updated and therefore undertook a thorough search of all Greek literature down to the Byzantine times to determine more precisely the meaning of the words found in the New Testament. This resulted in the publication of the monumental work, Griechisch-Deutsches Wörterbuch zu den Schriften des Neuen Testaments und der übrigen urchristlichen Literatur in 1949-1952. An English translation (by William F. Arndt and F. Wilbur Gingrich) of this lexicon was published by the University of Chicago in 1957 with the title, Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and other Early Christian Literature and became widely known as the “Bauer, Arndt, and Gingrich Lexicon.” A second edition was published by the University of Chicago in 1979. A thorough revision by Frederick William Danker was published by the University of Chicago in 2000. It is very commonly referred to simply as “BDAG” and this name appears on the title page in parenthesis below the full title.

 

[Charlie24]

Everyone should study the Scriptures to learn the truth, but some people study the Scripture to determine doctrine for themselves. Unfortunately, Kenneth Wuest did not bother to get either a University or seminary education but only the very limited education offered by a highly sectarian Bible college whose theology is a commingling of dispensationalism and Calvinism and therefore on the distant fringe of reality. Very much of Paul’s ministry was devoted to exposing theological error for what it is and the damage that it can do to it adherents. Christians who have been blessed by God with a good education and who have a solid knowledge of the truth have a solemn obligation before God to follow Paul’s example, especially regarding theological errors that are an egregious mutilation of the truth that he taught.


Why not share with us what you have learned from your study of the scriptures rather than pass off as the truth the errors that Wuest taught?


A few of my comments from another thread regarding the meaning of the Greek words:


By the early 1900’s, the new studies in the lexicography of Koine Greek had become so great in number and significance that Erwin Preuschen published his Greek-German lexicon in 1910. Upon his death in 1920, the revision of his lexicon was entrusted to Walter Bauer and this revision was published in 1928 as the second edition. In 1930, James Hope Mouton and George Milligan independently published The Vocabulary of the Greek Testament. A thoroughly revised edition of the Preuschen lexicon was published in 1937 with only Bauer’s name on the title page. Bauer realized, however, that his lexicon, although a huge improvement over Thayer’s in terms of accuracy and completeness, needed to be thoroughly revised and updated and therefore undertook a thorough search of all Greek literature down to the Byzantine times to determine more precisely the meaning of the words found in the New Testament. This resulted in the publication of the monumental work, Griechisch-Deutsches Wörterbuch zu den Schriften des Neuen Testaments und der übrigen urchristlichen Literatur in 1949-1952. An English translation (by William F. Arndt and F. Wilbur Gingrich) of this lexicon was published by the University of Chicago in 1957 with the title, Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and other Early Christian Literature and became widely known as the “Bauer, Arndt, and Gingrich Lexicon.” A second edition was published by the University of Chicago in 1979. A thorough revision by Frederick William Danker was published by the University of Chicago in 2000. It is very commonly referred to simply as “BDAG” and this name appears on the title page in parenthesis below the full title.

I've shown you what I've learned and agree with.

I'd like to see what you've learned and I'm sure I'll have some comment!