I believe to Messiah the Prince was till the baptism of Jesus, theannointing of the most holy and the announcement from heaven. That was also a fulfillment of the prophecy of Isaiah, quoted by Jesus in Luke 4:17-21 he was cut off in the midst of the 70th week.
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The Tribulation Period
- Thread starter Revmitchell
- Start date
Yes, absolutely. What comes after 62 weeks, 63 weeks, he was cut off after 62 weeks, I the 63rd week.
From the decree of Cyrus to the 32nd year of Darius/Artaxerxes was about 49 years, 7 weeks.
Seeing how you quote Philip Mauro, he wrote a couple of books on Bible chronology which do not seem to be available for download, although I did download The wonder of Bible Chronolgy some years ago. But I see it is available on Amazon for $4.99.
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
That is an absolutely fantastic book and it's chronology timetable congeals right along with his others on prophecy, etc. Excellent stuff, in my book, but some don't see the symbols the way the Bible teaches them.
Dave G
Well-Known Member
Understood. But I see "to Messiah the Prince" to be His death on the cross.
At the end of 62 weeks is how I understand "after 62 weeks".
Best wishes to you, and may God bless you.
I don't think the numbers in Daniel or in Revelation were meant to be taken literally. They are numbers that show us God will complete the task at the "appointed time" as we read in Daniel 11. I think it's a foolish errand to try crunch all the numbers and make them fit into an accountants ledger. God gives us a picture book of what is happening and we are meant to see the picture, not connect the dots.
I know a lot of people believe that but Jesus came as King on palm Sunday, Prince at the Baptism when John declared him The Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world, and Mark 1:11 And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
And
Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.
1). Fulfilled, when the Jews filled up the measure of their fathers by crucified the Messiah. Matthew 23:32.
2). Fulfilled at the cross, by ransoming his flock.
3).Fulfilled as no 2.
4). Fulfilled by imputing righteousness to the redeemed.
5). Fulfilled. Mat 11:13 For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
Luke 16:16 The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.
6). Fulfilled Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
Sounds moon and Stars in prophecy always refer to people, sun and moon are greater rulers and stars lesser rulers. In AD 70 the Jewish hierarchy fell. The next time the Jews see the Lord is when he comes in glory.
Should read Sun, moon and stars.
Revelation 12:1-4 reads:
Then I witnessed in heaven an event of great significance. I saw a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon beneath her feet, and a crown of twelve stars on her head. She was pregnant, and she cried out because of her labor pains and the agony of giving birth. Then I witnessed in heaven another significant event. I saw a large red dragon with seven heads and ten horns, with seven crowns on his heads. His tail swept away one-third of the stars in the sky, and he threw them to the earth. He stood in front of the woman as she was about to give birth, ready to devour her baby as soon as it was born.
Here the sun is Abraham, the moon is Sarah, and the stars that Satan sweeps with his tail are the Redeemed, the Israel of God, whom Satan opposed before the Promised One was born. They are those who, like Abraham, were justified by faith.
I see that as the tribulation during the Roman War. There never was a time of trouble such as that, when the Romans surrounded the city, there was a civil war going on inside. Their was a succession of high priests, all murdered. "The bodies of those who had lately worn the sacred garments were cast naked into the street and trampled
on. A woman ate her own child (see Deut 28)
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That is certainly novel bro, I haven't heard that before, but I can't go along with it because the dragon with seven heads and ten horns is Rome. The crowns are on the heads, that is before the fall of the western empire when it divided into ten. We meet it again later when the crowns are on the ten horns that is after the Empire was divided.
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I am seeing a lot of personal opinions being given but no real scholarly work to support those opinions. No break down of scriptural support, no supporting evidence.
It's not novel. In fact John tells us the dragon is Satan in the same passage.
This great dragon—the ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, the one deceiving the whole world—was thrown down to the earth with all his angels.
(Revelation 12:9)
It's clear you're a preterist so I understand why you have to interpret the dragon as the Roman Empire, but the text tells us who the dragon is.
Hello Dave, my intent is to come back to this, because I consider you to be a true student of the word , when I’ve time to focus on it. Been consumed with other matters.
No I am not a preterist. Neither am I a futurist which is a Jesuit origin. I believe what the early Church believed, and the martyrs, the Waldensiens, the Hussites and Lollards, the reformers, Baptists, etc up till the 19th century.
Daniel 7.7 tells about the beast with 10 horns.
If this is such a Great Tribulation Period what are you going to do about those who have suffered and even died all down through history?... We are so fortunate we do not have to defend our belief with our life... There has been no greater tribulation on the face of this earth when Satan thought he destroyed the church, that Jesus came to save and that was the end of it when Jesus died... He was probably having a party in hell for three days, thinking he won
... Then God raised Jesus body from tomb... Party is over!
... He's been going after his children ever since, with Great Tribulation down through history... We have daily tribulation and live in a free country and are free to worship as we please and read our Bible... Now take ALL that away... Deny God or die!... That is Great Tribulation... Pray to God we NEVER go through it... Brother Glen
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So what you are saying is that the events in Revelation 6-19 all occurred at that time? Are you applying an allegorical interpretive theory to those events? Can you break down any number of those events and explain your allegorical interpretation of them? What does the Romans assault on the city have to do with the descriptions of the Tribulation period?
He is presenting a Preterist interpretation of Revelation that sees the entire book being fulfilled in the destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD. (Correction,David seems to be a Historicist) It is one of four common interpretations of Revelation.
The oldest and most consistent interpretation is Amillennialism (a misnomer because this view recognizes the millennial binding of Satan and tribulation of saints happening side by side). The predominant interpretation of the Reformers was the Historicist view whereby you connect historical events with the book. The predominant view of evangelical Americans is the futurist view that was popularized by John Darby in the 1800s and further assisted by the Scofield study Bible in the early 1900s. It attempts to take all the numbers and create a ledger of account based upon the numbers being very literal. The Amillennial view sees the book as a beautiful picture book while the Futurist view sees the book as a connect the dots coloring book that requires you to find the next dot.
John MacArthur is a futurist preacher. Voddie Baucham is an amillennialist preacher. They are both good preachers. Baucham, in my opinion, understands Revelation better than MacArthur. Both are brothers in Christ.
So, you're a Historicist? You're attempting to connect historical events into Revelation to connect dots. It is certainly one way of understanding the book. I think it ends up with gaping holes, like Futurism, but it is one way of interpreting the book. Most people today see little value in that position, but it's still a method that one can use.