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[franklinmonroe]

...The charge has been made that these verses do not affect doctrine. There are complete verses in one book (KJV) that are not contained in another book (NIV)...

If my posts are reviewed carefully it can be seen that I think most of these do not affect doctrine. But for example, what doctrines are made more sure by these verses? --

Acts 15:34 - Notwithstanding it pleased Silas to abide there still.

Acts 24:7 - But the chief captain Lysias came [upon us], and with great violence took [him] away out of our hands,

Acts 28:29 - And when he had said these words, the Jews departed, and had great reasoning among themselves.

Romans 16:24 - Salute Asyncritus, Phlegon, Hermas, Patrobas, Hermes, and the brethren which are with them.​

 

[Ed Edwards]

...
I would love to have a 1769 KJV with the sidenotes in it... does anyone know a publisher that is currently printing one?

Check crosswalk.com -- thier KJV1769 Edition has
the Translator Footnotes. I don't know why
people started printing KJVs without the Translator
Footnotes???

 

[franklinmonroe]

...It also assumes I have nothing better to do, like make a living to feed my household (which btw, copyists did not need to worry about since it was their JOB to spend all day working on transcription of Scripture)...

You have assumed that all manuscripts were copied by professional scribes, which is incorrect.

 

[Rufus_1611]

This is where indepth study is needed... No one said studying the Bible is easy..

Alright, studying the NIV in depth, and using inspired scripture only, does the NIV conclude that casting out the devil of a lunatic child is done by prayer and fasting and if so, what verses is this demonstrated in?

Again, studying the context of the scripture, the history of the scripture, and the translator's notes help... this is one reason I like my NET Bible... the translator's put there reasoning down in their notes.


It would depend on the scripture in question, and the note usually alludes to why it was handled the way it was handled.



To honestly show the Bible scholar that there are other variations of that scripture.

 

[Rufus_1611]

Rufus_1611: // On the other hand, it is not out of the realm
of reason that heretical groups of people would
mishandle the words of God thereby omitting
certain passages to support their heretical belief systems.//

Strangely, the additions to the so called Antiochian Family
of manuscripts from the so called Alexandrian Family of
manuscripts very poorly do this for the purposes
of supporting the Antiochian Family and true
Eastern Orthodox Religion,
True Cyptoc and true Eastern Syrian Religion.
And they fail totally to support latecomers like the
Roman Catholics and Protestants.

What post are you quoting me from?

 

[Deacon]

Your implied conclusion is that there MUST be errors in the FIRST copy. This assumes automatic error. It also assumes that God would NOT direct my hand. It also assumes I would be in some kind of hurry to get it done. It also assumes I have nothing better to do, like make a living to feed my household (which btw, copyists did not need to worry about since it was their JOB to spend all day working on transcription of Scripture).

Secondly you imply that a copyist would neccessarily have to copy TEN pages of Script in a given days work. You also assume automatic carelessness on my part.

Thirdly, you give an arbitrary time frame which I propose the copyists of old were not under such constraints. Therefore it is not unreasonable to assume they could have spent an entire WEEK on one page!!!

Tell ya what. YOU do it and get back to me. But be honest and try to do it with the understanding that you are copying SCRIPTURE for the purpose of PRESERVING what God said exactly the way He said it!!! And TAKE YOUR TIME because this is important. K?

Actually I assumed you wouldn’t do it;
But assumed that if you did it there would be errors.

I also assumed that you would have an excuse for your errors, such as lack of inspiration... but everybody here already knows that.

Rob

 

[Rufus_1611]

Rufus_1611 Should we understand the scripture that omits
the verse or the footnote that includes it?

Yes

God has divinely preserved both for our edification.
You should believe both. God doesn't make conflicts
in His Written Word -- people make such
conflicts.

Which is truth? Which did Jesus Christ say? Did He say nothing or did He say whatever is in the footnote?

 

[Rufus_1611]

If my posts are reviewed carefully it can be seen that I think most of these do not affect doctrine. But for example, what doctrines are made more sure by these verses? --

Acts 15:34 - Notwithstanding it pleased Silas to abide there still.

Acts 24:7 - But the chief captain Lysias came [upon us], and with great violence took [him] away out of our hands,

Acts 28:29 - And when he had said these words, the Jews departed, and had great reasoning among themselves.

Romans 16:24 - Salute Asyncritus, Phlegon, Hermas, Patrobas, Hermes, and the brethren which are with them.​

If most do not affect doctrine, is that a concession that some do?

 

[tinytim]

Alright, studying the NIV in depth, and using inspired scripture only, does the NIV conclude that casting out the devil of a lunatic child is done by prayer and fasting and if so, what verses is this demonstrated in?

When I find a lunatic child that needs the devil cast from him or her.. i will refer them to you....:laugh:


Seriously..
What do you do when no other scriptures support a doctrine except one?

Doctrines built upon one verse of scripture are dangerous doctrines.

This is where we get devil chasing faith healers that won't go to Micky Ds...

If I knew I was facing a devil ... I would certainly fast... not based on this verse, but to spend time with God.
Fasting would come natural...

 

[Rufus_1611]

When I find a lunatic child that needs the devil cast from him or her.. i will refer them to you....:laugh:

What are you saying? When did devils stop possessing children?

Seriously..
What do you do when no other scriptures support a doctrine except one?

Doctrines built upon one verse of scripture are dangerous doctrines.

According to whom? If we are to live by every word of God, how many times does He have to say something before we are to obey? Regardless, here's your second verse...

"And he said unto them, This kind can come forth by nothing, but by prayer and fasting." - Mark 9:29​

 

[av1611jim]

Actually I assumed you wouldn’t do it;

This is the only place you would have been right. Your experiment is flawed at the outset so why would I waste my time playing your silly game? FWIW: I KNOW I can do it flawlessly but you would not believe that since your bias is showing. Besides, even if I did it perfectly, you have no way of knowing I did other than being here as I did it!!! Hence, your silly assertion that there MUST have been errors is fraught with unsupportable stupidity since none of us were there!


But assumed that if you did it there would be errors.

Why would you automatically assume there would be errors? I'll tell you why. It is because your glasses are all fogged up with this idiocy that it is impossible to be accurate with Scripture.

I also assumed that you would have an excuse for your errors,

Again; your assumption is clouded by your bias.

such as lack of inspiration... but everybody here already knows that.

This claim that "everybody already knows that" is ridiculous since a) you cannot speak for everybody and b) there are not a few here who agree with me. Therefore your broad brush has no paint in it! Ha ha ha!

Rob

See my answers above in bold script.

Keep digging bro. You just might find the truth yet!:thumbs:

 

[franklinmonroe]

If most do not affect doctrine, is that a concession that some do?

These verses are similar or parallel to 7 of the 'omitted' examples given in the OP --

Luke 19:10, NIV - For the Son of Man came to seek and to save what was lost. (virtually the same as Matthew 18:11, KJV)

Mark 12:40, NIV - They devour widows' houses and for a show make lengthy prayers. Such men will be punished most severely.
Luke 20:47, NIV - They devour widows' houses and for a show make lengthy prayers. Such men will be punished most severely. (these are both virtually same as Matthew 23:14, KJV)

Mark 9:48, NIV - where ‘their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched.’ (virtually the same as both Mark 9:44 and 46, KJV)

Matthew 6:15, NIV- But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins. (virtually the same as Mark 11:26, KJV)

Matthew 24:40, NIV - Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. (virtually the same as Luke 17:36, KJV)

Matthew 27:15, NIV - Now it was the governor's custom at the Feast to release a prisoner chosen by the crowd.
Mark 15:6, NIV - Now it was the custom at the Feast to release a prisoner whom the people requested.
John 18:39, NIV - But it is your custom for me to release to you one prisoner at the time of the Passover. Do you want me to release ‘the king of the Jews’? (all three of these are virtually the same as Luke 23:17, KJV)​

Combined with my previous posts, I believe it has been shown that at least 13 of the 17 in the OP are not doctrinal threats. It is my personal concession that some might.

 

[tinytim]

What are you saying? When did devils stop possessing children?




According to whom? If we are to live by every word of God, how many times does He have to say something before we are to obey? Regardless, here's your second verse...

"And he said unto them, This kind can come forth by nothing, but by prayer and fasting." - Mark 9:29
​

No I do believe in possession still today...
Notice the last part of my post that you didn't quote.

 

[Rufus_1611]

No I do believe in possession still today...
Notice the last part of my post that you didn't quote.

I didn't quote it 'cuz it wasn't there when I hit the quote button. What is the big yuk then about you sending me a lunatic child?

 

[tinytim]

It was stupid joke. :laugh: :wavey: I'm not being funny today.:tonofbricks: Forget i said it.:tear:

 

[Bro. Williams]

What were you doing then? I thought I was giving you the benefit of the doubt using the term "making fun of". It seemed at best making fun, if not it might have been mocking, belittling, or at worse attacking (which based on your perversion remark, might be more where you were coming from). But I would like to hear what you feel you were doing in your original post, if not making fun? You sure weren't praising, or glorifying.

Giving me the benefit of the doubt is rarely a good thing...

"Making fun of" is a fine way to describe what I was doing... I was saying we define "Bible" differently. I understand your misunderstanding though.

 

[Ed Edwards]

Which is truth? Which did Jesus Christ
say? Did He say nothing or did He say whatever
is in the footnote?

Joh 21:25 (KJV1611 Edition):
And there are also many other things
which Iesus did, the which if they should be written
euery one, I suppose that euen the world
it selfe could not conteine the bookes
that should be written, Amen. //

'conteine' - my spelling is going South reading the KJV1611 Edition

IMHO your question leads you to error.
IMHO God intended for BOTH messages to come through.
Both messages are more than the sum of each of the
two messages.

One misses the message by asking bad questions.
PRAISE GOD WHO has preserved in His Divine Wisdom
many of the Words of Messiah Yeshlua in the Holy Bibles:
many English Bibles for many diferent ages, climes, and peoples.
AMEN!

 

[Rufus_1611]

Joh 21:25 (KJV1611 Edition):
And there are also many other things
which Iesus did, the which if they should be written
euery one, I suppose that euen the world
it selfe could not conteine the bookes
that should be written, Amen. //

'conteine' - my spelling is going South reading the KJV1611 Edition

IMHO your question leads you to error.
IMHO God intended for BOTH messages to come through.
Both messages are more than the sum of each of the
two messages.

One misses the message by asking bad questions.
PRAISE GOD WHO has preserved in His Divine Wisdom
many of the Words of Messiah Yeshlua in the Holy Bibles:
many English Bibles for many diferent ages, climes, and peoples.
AMEN!

IMHO your answer leads you to error.
IMHO God promised to inspire scripture and you've got him inspiring footnotes.
Both messages are opposed to each other. One says Jesus Christ said nothing, the other says Jesus Christ said something. If he said nothing, it should be omitted from scripture, if He said something it should be included.

 

[Ed Edwards]

Rufus_1611: //IMHO your answer leads you to error.//

IMHO my answer is God's Truth.
This would be a real good time for you to give
your testimonies concerning how God used
you and your fasting & prayers to cast out
deamons. You mental consent & even your
faith is useless in following the way of the cross
without some works.

Rufus_1611 //IMHO God promised to inspire scripture
and you've got him inspiring footnotes.//

IMHO God promised to inspire scripture
and you don't have enough faith to believe
God did that with the NIV. By contrast with you,
Dear Brother Rufus_1611 -- I have seen/felt/experienced
deamons leaving plagued persons (who where then
saved when Jesus saved them and the Holy Spirit
came into their lives). One of those times I was
actually FEASTING in a public resturant.
I was reading the NIV to a young man who
was plagued with a bi-sexual deamon.
That deamon left the young man and he was
saved. I haven't heard from him for some 23 years,
but I'll meet him in heaven.

 

[Rufus_1611]

...

Which is truth. The scripture or the footnote?