There is no Millennium according to Jesus

[timtofly]

The Millennium is a Pharisee Doctrine.


First, MILLENNIUM: MILLENNIUM - JewishEncyclopedia.com
By: Joseph Jacobs, A. Biram

Table of Contents

Messianic Period an Interregnum.

The reign of peace, lasting one thousand years, which will precede the Last Judgment and the future life. The concept has assumed especial importance in the Christian Church, where it is termed also “chiliasm,” designating the dominion of Jesus with the glorified and risen saints over the world for a thousand years. Chiliasm or the idea of the millennium is, nevertheless, older than the Christian Church; for the belief in a period of one thousand years at the end of time as a preliminary to the resurrection of the dead was held in Parseeism. This concept is expressed in Jewish literature in Enoch, xiii., xci. 12-17; in the apocalypse of the ten weeks, in Apoc. Baruch, xl. 3 (“And his dominion shall last forever, until the world doomed to destruction shall perish”); and in II Esdras vii. 28-29. Neither here nor in later Jewish literature is the duration of this Messianic reign fixed. It is clear, however, that the rule of the Messiah was considered as an interregnum, from the fact that in many passages, such as Pes. 68a, Ber. 34b, Sanh. 91b and 99a, Shab. 63a, 113b, and 141b, a distinction is made between and , although it must be noted that some regarded the Messianic rule as the period of the fulfilment of the prophecies, while others saw in it the time of the subjugation of the nations.


So it is no wonder Millennialism found its way into the first century Church comprised mainly of former Jews.


But in time, the church condemned it as heresy. First, According to the Nicene Creed

………………. and He shall come again, with glory, to judge both the living and the dead; Whose kingdom shall have no end.

Sproul, R. C. (Ed.). (2015). The Reformation Study Bible: English Standard Version (2015 Edition) (p. 2389). Orlando, FL: Reformation Trust.

And condemned as heresy by the Council of Ephesus in 431 in two ways.


“In addition to its condemnation of Nestorianism, the council also condemned

Pelagianism, [2] and rejected premillennialism (Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Papias,

Tertullian, Origen, Lactantius) in favor of Amillennialism (Clement of

Alexandria, Chrysostom, Jerome and Augustine of Hippo): "Augustine's

explanation became Church doctrine when it was adopted as the definitive

explanation of the millennium by the Council of Ephesus in 431."[35]


Secondly, “Canon 7 condemned any departure from the creed established by the First Council of Nicaea (325)” This affirmed Jesus “shall come again, with glory, to judge both the living and the dead; whose kingdom shall have no end.” Thereby denouncing premillennialism and the doctrines leading up to and including Dispensationalism of the 1800s.


Retrieved from Council of Ephesus - Wikipedia

Amil is just as heretical. They declare this reign is also now right along with the other so called heretics.

That is the whole point, no?

The Pharisees were expecting this reign. Jesus said in the shortest form, "not yet". The time of the Gentiles had to come first. Unless you can prove John was teaching a Pharisee doctrine in Revelation 20, then your assertion any one does, falls flat. Isaiah was not a Pharisee, yet he prophecied about a coming kingdom. The Pharisees had to base it on more than just non accepted writings.

You are still basing your own argument on 1000 which you claim is not literal. You have yet to point out those writings point to a literal 1000 year time frame. So far only John in Revelation 20 has literally described it as that. Saying chiliasm is a thing and proving those in Judaism prior to the first coming called it a thing is not the same thing.

John declared it an event after the Second Coming. Not after the first coming.

 

[timtofly]

You are imposing the God blinded Pharisee's millennium over John's 1000 years. Scripture never mentions a millennium = there isn't one. Replacing John with false doctrine is dangerous. Heed the warnings. 1000 in scripture often = a large amount, quite a bit. Samson killed 1000 Philistenes, God owns the cattle on 1000 hills.

Imposing one's symbolism where none is necessary is also a risk.

1000 is right there in black and white. No further interpretation necessary.

 

[just-want-peace]

Were you taught this? Or did objective self-study lead to it? I studied Bancroft. Strong and sat in different pre-millennial/Dispensational Churches but could never swallow it, thankfully. It wasn't until I questioned all I had been taught and set out to disprove it that I found the truth in Jesus' gospel of the kingdom. You wouldn't believe the enemies I gathered, even my own family for the most part.

I’m truly sorry that you have accumulated so many enemies, but you yourself said in effect (don’t remember the exact quote), but, “ - - have you not considered that your interpretation might be wrong?”
That is why I implied that you should look in the mirror; is it too far fetched in your mind that just maybe YOU COULD BE WRONG?????

Just from the tone of your posts, if you are as belligerent in person as on this board, then I can well understand the repulsion you have sensed, and I truly mean this in a Christian loving way, cause I have a similar problem in that my wife tells me that I sometimes answer people in a short manner, that I have NOT intended to do.
So please just take this as a gesture of shared experience from a Christian brother, and consider it as you see fit.

 

[1689Dave]

I’m truly sorry that you have accumulated so many enemies, but you yourself said in effect (don’t remember the exact quote), but, “ - - have you not considered that your interpretation might be wrong?”
That is why I implied that you should look in the mirror; is it too far fetched in your mind that just maybe YOU COULD BE WRONG?????

Just from the tone of your posts, if you are as belligerent in person as on this board, then I can well understand the repulsion you have sensed, and I truly mean this in a Christian loving way, cause I have a similar problem in that my wife tells me that I sometimes answer people in a short manner, that I have NOT intended to do.
So please just take this as a gesture of shared experience from a Christian brother, and consider it as you see fit.

A simple check is if you have faith. Faith comes from hearing the word. I have faith in what I posted. It comes from the gospel of the kingdom in the gospels. I never had faith in any of the other schemes I held along the way. If you are born again, the Spirit bears witness with your spirit.

Enemies? Each is a jewel in my crown.

 

[just-want-peace]

A simple check is if you have faith. Faith comes from hearing the word. I have faith in what I posted. It comes from the gospel of the kingdom in the gospels. I never had faith in any of the other schemes I held along the way. If you are born again, the Spirit bears witness with your spirit.

Enemies? Each is a jewel in my crown.

And a good day to you also, sir!!!

 

[Lodic]

Don't you see, that just because John mentions 1000 years, and the Pharisees preach a 1000 year physical kingdom, they are not the same thing? Especially after Jesus disproved their ideas of a Millennium (see OP). Scripture never mentions a millennium. And to insert Pharisee Millennialism into John's passage is adding to scripture.

[EDIT - I originally posted that I didn't quite get it. Then I read the rest of the posts.]
I didn't quite get it until you posted this: "The reign of peace, lasting one thousand years, which will precede the Last Judgment and the future life. The concept has assumed especial importance in the Christian Church, where it is termed also “chiliasm,” designating the dominion of Jesus with the glorified and risen saints over the world for a thousand years. Chiliasm or the idea of the millennium is, nevertheless, older than the Christian Church; for the belief in a period of one thousand years at the end of time as a preliminary to the resurrection of the dead was held in Parseeism.
Reading through that article, I think I finally understand. Thank you for taking the time and trouble to elaborate upon this. Blessings, Brother.

 

[1689Dave]

I'm trying to see, but I still don't quite get it. As I understand it, the "Millennium" is the "1,000 years" of Revelation 20. I do not believe that to be a literal 1,000 years, just as I don't believe God only owns the cattle on 1,000 hills. Are you saying that this 1,000 year "period" is a spiritual kingdom? BTW, I agree that there is no Millennium (in the popular "end times" view) in our future.

First, scripture never mentions a millennium. It is a false doctrine created by the Pharisees that Jesus totally shreds while preaching the gospel of the Kingdom in the four gospels. People who cannot grasp Jesus' teaching on the Kingdom think John is talking about the Pharisee's Millennium. But scripture does not confirm that he is. So they add to God's word, despite His warnings against doing this, the Pharisees "Premillennial false doctrine". Scripture often uses 1000 as a symbol not to be taken literally for a great sum, or a great amount.

Why would John be referring to the Pharisee's millennium when Jesus totally dismantled it? Keep in mind, Jesus said, unless a man is born-again he cannot see the kingdom of God.

 

[Lodic]

First, scripture never mentions a millennium. It is a false doctrine created by the Pharisees that Jesus totally shreds while preaching the gospel of the Kingdom in the four gospels. People who cannot grasp Jesus' teaching on the Kingdom think John is talking about the Pharisee's Millennium. But scripture does not confirm that he is. So they add to God's word, despite His warnings against doing this, the Pharisees "Premillennial false doctrine". Scripture often uses 1000 as a symbol not to be taken literally for a great sum, or a great amount.

Why would John be referring to the Pharisee's millennium when Jesus totally dismantled it? Keep in mind, Jesus said, unless a man is born-again he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Now it's all making sense. It's ironic that by adding this teaching to God's word, they are the ones who fail to heed Christ's warning in Revelation 22:19.