Today, I have "fathered" you?

[Ascetic X]

You keep confusing “mind”, “soul”, and “spirit”.

Apollonarianism stated that Jesus did not have a human mind. Scripture does not support this view that Jesus was only partially human, as you suggest.

John 1:14

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us…

To be made flesh means to have a human body and mind.

Thus, this heresy does not accept that Jesus was fully human. A human is both body and mind.

You may embrace Apollonarianism and that’s your choice. But orthodox Christianity rejected it in the very early days of the church.

 

[Van]

You keep confusing “mind”, “soul”, and “spirit”.

SNIP

Did you address Jesus only had One spirit? Nope.

Did I confuse mind with the conjecture that only the mind of a human spirit could be tempted? Nope

Did I claim Jesus had a Divine Soul and a human Soul? Nope

Did I claim Jesus had a Divine Spirit and a Human Spirit? Nope

My view is based on what scripture says, NOT on the conjecture of humans.

Did I claim Christ's mind could NOT be tempted as a "human mind?" Nope

To be made of flesh means to have a human brain intertwined with either a human spirit or a divine spirit.

Jesus was fully human and fully divine. To claim He must have two spirits one human and one divine is hogwash. He had One spirit.

I do not "embrace" Apollonarianism," that is your false claim. I embrace Scripture.

 

[Van]

Folks, Jesus had One Spirit, NOT two. That is scripture. The Second Person of the Trinity became flesh, NOT flesh and spirit. That addition is based NOT on scripture but on conjecture. It is heresy.

 

[Van]

How many "spirits" did Jesus give up in Matthew 27:50? One or two.?

How many "spirits" did Jesus give up in John 19:30? One or two?

How many "spirits" did Jesus entrust in Luke 23:46? One or two?

Either we believe Scripture or we believe in Human Conjecture.

Did Jesus give up the Spirit of Logos, the Second Person of the Trinity, or a created human spirit?

 

[Ascetic X]

Folks, Jesus had One Spirit, NOT two. That is scripture. The Second Person of the Trinity became flesh, NOT flesh and spirit. That addition is based NOT on scripture but on conjecture. It is heresy.

Folks, Jesus was fully human, not partially human.

Either we believe orthodox Christianity or we believe heresy. Either scripture or philosophy.

Jesus was fully God and fully man. No Baptist would dare to dispute this.

To believe Jesus did not have a human mind is not Baptist theology. It is Apollonarianism, which was rejected as heresy in 381 AD.

No living entity becomes flesh with just a body. Flesh consists of body and mind. Jesus had human body and human mind. But His mind was subjected to God’s will at all times. This is why we can also strive to have a mind subjected to God’s will. We can put on the obedient mind of Christ.

If the mind of Jesus was divine and not human:

* Jesus was only partially human and not fully human
* Jesus could not have been tempted like we are
* Jesus could not have grown in knowledge
* Jesus would not have said His words were not His own, but were the Father’s
* Jesus would not have to make the choice between obedience and disobedience
* Jesus would not have to prefer and submit to His Father’s will, since Jesus’ will would have been identical with His Father’s will
* Jesus in the garden of Gethsemane would not have asked His Father to remove the cup of God’s wrath if possible
* Jesus would not have been in human likeness, which is human mind and human body


Philippians 2:5-8

5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
6 who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 but made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 and being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

 

[Van]

Did Jesus need to have a "fallen" or "sinful" nature to be "fully" human? Could Jesus be sinless and be "made a sinner?" Inquiring minds want to know.

My view, based on scripture is that Jesus did NOT have a fallen nature, His divine Spirit was not distorted with the consequence of Adam's sin. He was NOT a "made sinner." Romans 5:19.

But He did have a "human nature" subject to the needs and desires of the flesh. He was tempted in every way humans are. He could get hungry, and He could get angry. He could desire to avoid pain and suffering. But His commitment to do His Father's will never wavered.

 

[Van]

Did anyone say Jesus did not have a "human mind?"

Does flesh consist of body and "mind?" Nope. That is human conjecture NOT supported by scripture.

Where does scripture say Jesus had the mind that was NOT divine? If we are indwelt we have "the mind of Christ." Sounds like a divine mind.

I addressed Jesus learning, but my position is ignored.

Jesus is a separate Person from the Father, therefore He has will, emotion and intellect, and when He became flesh, received the needs and desires of the flesh, making Him fully human and fully God.

The claim Jesus was a NOT a separate Person of the Trinity is simply another heresy.

Philippians 2:5-8 supports that Jesus was divine, but humbled Himself and became in the likeness of man. Open to temptation just like us.

And Note folks, has this bible student presented any verse indicating Jesus had more than One Spirit, or has he denied Jesus had a Divine Spirit, the Second Person of the Trinity?

 

[JesusFan]

Logos certainly was the "Word of God" the second Person of the Trinity.

Please provide the verse that reads "Word of the Father."

Jesus, the human man, was NOT created! Yes His physical body was created, but He did not have a human mind. He did not have a human "soul." He did not have a human "spirit." He was God incarnate. God in the flesh.

here is the real Christian view on this
he hypostatic union is the foundational Christian doctrine that Jesus Christ is one person possessing two distinct natures—fully divine and fully human—united without mixture, change, division, or separation. Established at the Council of Chalcedon (451 AD), it affirms that Christ is not two separate beings or a hybrid, but the eternal Son of God who took on human flesh.
Answers in Genesis +5
Key Aspects of the Hypostatic Union

• One Person, Two Natures: Jesus is a single "hypostasis" (individual existence/person). He is not part human and part God, but fully both simultaneously.

 

[Van]

here is the real Christian view on this
he hypostatic union is the foundational Christian doctrine that Jesus Christ is one person possessing two distinct natures—fully divine and fully human—united without mixture, change, division, or separation. Established at the Council of Chalcedon (451 AD), it affirms that Christ is not two separate beings or a hybrid, but the eternal Son of God who took on human flesh.
View attachment 13718Answers in Genesis +5
Key Aspects of the Hypostatic Union

• One Person, Two Natures: Jesus is a single "hypostasis" (individual existence/person). He is not part human and part God, but fully both simultaneously.

LOL, I asked for the verse that says "Word of the Father" which is ignored, and then he copy and pastes non-germane verbiage that refutes his stated position that Jesus BECAME the Son of God at the incarnation.

The issues are (1) what constitutes the "human nature" of Christ, and two, did Christ need a human spirit to have a "human nature."

 

[JesusFan]

LOL, I asked for the verse that says "Word of the Father" which is ignored, and then he copy and pastes non-germane verbiage that refutes his stated position that Jesus BECAME the Son of God at the incarnation.

The issues are (1) what constitutes the "human nature" of Christ, and two, did Christ need a human spirit to have a "human nature."

Did he have a human soul? And my point before was that He as the Son of God was not eternal that, but he became the Son in the Incarnation , but was still always fully God as the Logos of the Father

 

[Van]

Did he have a human soul? And my point before was that He as the Son of God was not eternal that, but he became the Son in the Incarnation , but was still always fully God as the Logos of the Father

You have no idea what you are posting. Logos was eternally the Son of God. You do not know that either.

 

[Ascetic X]

Did he have a human soul? And my point before was that He as the Son of God was not eternal that, but he became the Son in the Incarnation , but was still always fully God as the Logos of the Father

Logos was eternally the Son of God before incarnation. Logos became a human at the incarnation as Jesus Christ. Logos was made flesh, thus Jesus had a human body and human mind. Yet He was fully God and fully man.

 

[JesusFan]

Logos was eternally the Son of God before incarnation. Logos became a human at the incarnation as Jesus Christ. Logos was made flesh, thus Jesus had a human body and human mind. Yet He was fully God and fully man.

Logos was eternally the Son of God before incarnation. Logos became a human at the incarnation as Jesus Christ. Logos was made flesh, thus Jesus had a human body and human mind. Yet He was fully God and fully man.

Think we fully agree on the nature and person of Jesus, just differ on if he had eternal Sonship or not going on

 

[37818]

According to Acts 13:33, Psalm 2:7, . . . that he hath raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm . . . .

 

[Ascetic X]

Think we fully agree on the nature and person of Jesus, just differ on if he had eternal Sonship or not going on

I think Jesus was always eternally the Son of God, the Logos, the Word of God.

As John 5:26 states, “For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son also to have life in himself.” In the context of John, “this claim to divine aseity [i.e., life in himself] must refer to the Son’s eternal ontology, not to a function of his incarnation.”

Supporting this interpretation, John 8 identifies Jesus as the divine son, when Jesus says that “before Abraham was, I am” (v. 58). The “I am” (egō eimi) recalls the Lord’s divine name (“I am who I am,” Exod. 3:14), and Jesus’s antecedent existence (“before Abraham”) surely identifies Jesus as the eternal Son.

However,
Romans 1:2–4 explains how Jesus, as David’s son, is the Son of God and the hope of salvation.

In these verses, Paul speaks of Christ receiving the title “Son of God” at his resurrection.

Verses 3–4 read, “concerning his Son, who was descended from David according to the flesh and was declared to be the Son of God in power according to the Spirit of holiness by his resurrection from the dead, Jesus Christ our Lord.”

Critically, this passage is best understood to of Christ’s exaltation in his resurrection.

While Jesus is God the Son throughout his entire human life, his resurrection assigns him the title “Son of God.” This is the testimony of Acts 13:32–33 and Hebrews 5:5–6, as well.