tongue speakers please answer

MEE, I want to explain myself from over in the other topic as to why I wrote "lock and load"(not that it in itself needs any explaining-haha), but the reason I feel that way is this: "You cannot imagine how it is to have been brought up the true Baptist way; and all your kinfolks as far back as you can go were all Baptists; so this is the way you teach your children-because it is the right way, even tho' I know that many so-called 'christians' today are like the Israelites in Ps.106:34-38. I have found out if you play with snakes, you're likely to get bit. This is what happened to our youngest son. It destroyed his marriage, his world, our world, his son's world-and a whole lot more. "I was born to be a keeper-at-home & responsible for teaching truth to my children. I believe a mama should be aware of enemies that are trying to destroy her home. (2John). I knew how to run my household well & was so thankful my children walked in truth(3John4). "Yes, there are many deceivers out there & the Bible tells us of ways to identify antichrists, etc.(1John4:1-3; 2Cor4:4; 1Cor2:9-16) & I believe as Jael did in Judges5:24-27, that I do have the right to destroy the enemy, if need be. I am worse than an old mama bear when it comes to my family; and in the case of false doctrine, we are talking about one's very soul. Yes, you had your fun, made a little joke, had a good laugh; but when the smoke's cleared... :-]

 

Yes Naomi - despite my deep psychoses, mental quirks, and less then average physical looks; I am being serious. At times tho, I must express the seriousness in different ways sometimes with humour or some such variant of, or I would cry like Jonah "Smite dem buggers down!" all too often on this board. Which Jonah did because he didnt want to give them a chance to repent, but the Lord God did.

 

Huh Who are you calling on to repent?

 

But the tongues that the apostles were speaking were other earthly languages for those around them heard them speaking in their own language.

So I ask again:

When you are speaking in tongues do those around you hear you speaking in thier own language? Do they understand what you are saying?

When the apostles spoke in tongues everyone around them understood them and they all heard "them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues".

Is this how it is with you?

~Lorelei</font>[/QUOTE]Lorelei, when the apostles first spoke in tongues was it to break a language barrier? Was it only so people could understand what was being said about Jesus?

 

Oneness, you are not like the Apostles. Do people understand what you are saying when you speak in tongues? What the Apostles were speaking was being understood by all there, in their own language and dialect.
It took miracles and signs in the beginning to convince the Jews that it was indeed the Christ that they crucified.
We are not to seek after signs. All we need to know is in the Bible. Without faith it is impossible to please God. I have faith that Jesus died for me. I have faith that he rose from the dead and is now sitting on the right hand of the Father. I have faith that he will return for his church that has been made white by the BLOOD of Jesus. I have faith that I will spend eternity with Him in Glory. Praise God! We have a blessed hope! If we glory, it should be in Jesus. He is worthy of all our praise. For while we were yet sinners, he died for us. We love God because He first loved us. He came into the world to save the lost, not the righteous. I am like the publican who cried, " have mercy on me a sinner". I could never do anything to gain salvation. I thank God He provided a way at calvary. Jesus suffered more than anyone ever has or will because He loved us and He doesn't want anyone to go to hell. Why does any one think they have to "help" Jesus for their salvation. He cried, "it is finished". Praise God! As I get older I look on my life and wish I had trusted in the Lord when I was young. I led a very sinful life and thought it was OK because I thought I wasn't hurting anyone. After I got saved I could see my sin as a reproach against God. I am now ashamed to even think of what I use to do. I wasn't raised in church, so I couldn't rely on my parents instruction. (They were saved later). I was convicted of my sins when I opened a Bible and it hit me square in the face!!
After I was saved I remember calling a lady and asked her forgiveness for the wrong I had done to her and her family. I had had an affair with her husband and didn't think twice about hurting anyone. I was after my own pleasure. When I asked her to forgive me, SHE DID! She was even there when I was baptized. I know where God has brought me from and I thank Him for casting my sins as far as the east is from the west.
I feel like if he can forgive me, anyone can be forgiven! I don't question the how, what, when or where. It was Jesus and Jesus alone that saved me! Praise His holy name! He is a wonderful savior.

In Christ, Susan

 

In Christ, Susan [/qb][/QUOTE]



I believe that you do. I would never question your faith. Praise God for people who have faith, I commend you for that.

Now let me ask you this, in all your faith that you have, if you never repented would you make it to heaven? You dont have to answer that but if you want to, please feel free

As I said before, we do not seek after the signs, the signs follow us. (Mark 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe)

*Sincere*

I would never want to take that away from you, and I never could. Praise God for your testomony and what he has done for you, it is an awesome thing.

Now Would anyone want to answer the question that I posted

Lorelei, when the apostles first spoke in tongues was it to break a language barrier? Was it only so people could understand what was being said about Jesus?

[ May 29, 2002, 02:38 PM: Message edited by: ONENESS ]

 

Oneness, you asked me if I thought a person would make it to heaven if they didn't repent. Of course they won't. No sin will enter into heaven. A person has to have a broken heart and contrite spirit and be dealt with by the Holy Spirit before they are saved. It is a repenting way. But thank God Jesus is there for an advocate for us. I make mistakes daily and have to ask the Lord's forgiveness. And I thank Him for His grace and mercy. Jesus is wonderful!! He deserves all our praise!

In Christ,
Susan

 

See Susan, I knew thats what you would say, but what I am trying to get you to see is that Repentance is something that we do. Repenting is a work. I am not saying that if we go out here and knock on 100 doors, feed the homeless, etc. will get you to heaven. It will not. It is still a good thing to do, but even if you never feed a homless person in your life you will still make it to heaven if you have the blood applied to your heart.

But when it comes to repentance and water baptisim and the infilling of the Holy Ghost it is essential. It is called being born again.

I had someone ask me what is so important about the NAME of Jesus this weekend. And I had the honor of telling her that there was no other name under heaven given among men whereby we must be saved. There is an athority with that Name.

Susan I like how you have faith, I admire that I really do. Heres a quick lesson on faith if I may.

Jesus said in Matt 17: if ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place: and it shall remove and nothing shall be impossible unto you.

Does that mean that we can just sit there and stare at the mountain and believe that it will just vanish? No not at all. How ever Faith will motivate you to get a shovel and start digging away at it.

We are not saved b/c we have faith, We are saved b/c God allowed us Grace to have Faith. Do you see what I am saying. We are saved by Grace through faith not of yourselves, it is a gift of God, Not of works lest any man should boast.

Any man can boast about his faith, but no man can boast about Grace b/c we cant earn it. It is still grace that we have the oppurtunity to Have faith, Repent, get baptized and receive the Holy Ghost.

I hope that did not confuse you b.c i had trouble writeing it the way I meant it.

God bless

 

Tongues speakers violate every rule in tongues that the apostle Paul outlined in Corinthians, and then they claim to be filled with the Holy Ghost !
What nonsense !!

 

Aman, You really gave me a revelation!!! I think I want to be just like you. For now on you are my hero for letting everyone know what the truth is about tongue speakers.

Godspeed

LORELEI, JUST WONDERING IF YOU WANT TO ANSWER MY QUESTIONS I POSTED EARLIER?

 

Lorelie, Did you quit posting? If you are sill sitting back watching, I would like to hear your answers that I asked you at the top of pg 2. Or did you get tired of this.

God bless

 

Assuming that you are referring to these questions, I'd be happy to answer them.
What you must understand is that the issue is not as simplistic as you are trying to paint it. All of the sign gifts had the GENERAL purpose of authenticating the message of the new Christian Church. Tongues also had the SPECIFIC purpose of breaking language barriers.
So to answer your questions: yes, it was to break a language barrier; but no, it wasn't ONLY so people could understand what was being said about Jesus.
Btw, it may be noted that the 'private prayer language' version of tongues does NOT fulfill the general purpose of the sign gifts, because there is nothing obviously miraculous about lying on the floor babbling. It's something literally anyone can do, regardless of whether they have the Holy Spirit.

 

On a completely different subject, has anyone but me noticed problems with pages loading on this board the last two or three days? I just inadvertantly did a double post because of this, which is why I'm bringing it up. If anyone wants to respond to this, please start a new topic.
And now, back to our discussion...

[ May 30, 2002, 04:40 PM: Message edited by: Walguy ]

 

Assuming that you are referring to these questions, I'd be happy to answer them.
What you must understand is that the issue is not as simplistic as you are trying to paint it. All of the sign gifts had the GENERAL purpose of authenticating the message of the new Christian Church. Tongues also had the SPECIFIC purpose of breaking language barriers.
So to answer your questions: yes, it was to break a language barrier; but no, it wasn't ONLY so people could understand what was being said about Jesus.
Btw, it may be noted that the 'private prayer language' version of tongues does NOT fulfill the general purpose of the sign gifts, because there is nothing obviously miraculous about lying on the floor babbling. It's something literally anyone can do, regardless of whether they have the Holy Spirit.</font>[/QUOTE]I was hopeing that Don and Lorelei would reply to the questions, b/c i have found something very intresting. My pastor should this to me.

So back to the topic.

If you will notice in the Book of Acts the second Chapter. The bible says that all who were filled with the Holy Ghost at the first outporing of the Spirit spoke with "Other Tongues" (languages other than their own" as the Spirit gave them the utterance.

Jews from every nation under heaven heard their diffrent languages spoken miraculously by the disciples.

Were Tongues Given at Pentecost Principally to Enable the Foreign Jews to understand what was spoken?

If so , why did not God likewise empower others to speak with tongues before this time, such as John the Baptist, the apostles during the earthly ministry of Jesus and the seventy whom Jesus sent out?

And why would God want to speak through ALL on the day of Pentecost, all seemingly speaking at once, if He merely wanted the Jews to understnad what was said?

Aramaic was the popular language in Palestine at the time, while Old Testament Hebrew (though not always in an unchanged form) was still in use in schools and religion. The Greek language was a widely known and used in the World of that day. Perhaps most, if not all, of the foreign Jews Present on the Day of Pentecost could understand Hebrew, Aramaic, or Greek. Jerusalem, the location of the temple, was the religious center of the Jews-not like a strange country to them. Therefor, surely no major language problem existed.

If an insurmountable language barrier existed, how did the multitude discover that each one recognized his own language being spoken? For Example, who informed the crowd that the Jews from Rome heard their language? And who made it known that the Arabian Jews heard their language spoken? And likewise for those who spoke other languages? Yet the fact that each group heard their own language being spoken became common knowledge, so that the people were able to ask, "And how hear we every man in our own tongue wherein we were born?" Acts 2:8 The bible says plainly that the multitude spoke "one to another" and the bible repeats some of their conversation (acts 2:6-13)

When the disciples were filled with the Spirit the multitude "were all amazed and were in doubt saying one to another, What meaneth this"? (Acts 2:12) "Other mocking said, These men are full of new wine. "Then Pter preached the notable sermon recorded in the second chapter of Acts. It is altogether reasonable to judge that he preached to the entire multitude in only ONE language. If he had preaced to on language "group at a time, he could rightly address only that one group as he began his sermon to the. But the apostle Peter addresse the entire multitude all at one time saying "Ye men of Judaea, and ALL ye that dwell at Jerusalem..." (acts 2:14) Verse five had previously disclosed that these people from every nation were dwelling at Jerusalem. If the tongues were fiven to enable people to understand what was spoke, why did not God Cause the disciples to do the necessary explaining in other languages? When the People asked the vital question "What shall we do" again it was Peter who gave the answer.

The tongues may have been profitable on the day of Pentecost to enable some to better understand part of what was spoken, but it is quite evident that the enabling of people to understand was not primary purpose of the tongues. Futhermore, the bible does not state that tongues were given or ever would be given to overcome language barriers

God Bless

[ May 30, 2002, 05:08 PM: Message edited by: ONENESS ]

 

You are correct in a way. Generally the miraculous nature of the sign gifts was more important than their practical usage, and this was indeed especially true on Pentecost. The miraculous nature of the event got people's attention, and they also got an introduction to the teaching of Christianity in their own languages prior to Peter's one-language sermon really driving that message home. In fact, the word in 2:6 and 2:8 is different from the one in 2:4. In verse 4 the word is 'glossolalia,' the standard Greek word for 'language.' In verses 6 and 8, however, the word is 'dialektos,' from which we get our English word 'dialect.' The visitors to Jerusalem not only heard the message in their own languages, but in their own regional dialects as well! This underscored the miraclulous nature of what was happening, which was of overriding importance at that moment; but it also made a statement about the communications aspect of the gift, which became more important (although still of secondary importance) when the gift was used in dealing with individuals and smaller groups where only one unknown language was involved, and only one speaker needed.
Again, though, the point is that we don't have to say that tongues was given either for one purpose or the other. It was given for BOTH reasons.

 

i have noticed that in the last year that there has always been a discussion going on about Speaking in tongues.
Why so much interest?

 

The reason there is so much interest is because people who talk in tongues actually believe in this as having something to do with their salvation. They are mixing works with grace. This is a very important teaching to be straight on. Most people from my experiences always rely on the experience they have had other then the finished work of Christ on the cross. This pollutes the true gospel, leading people astray.

 

The reason there is so much interest is because people who talk in tongues actually believe in this as having something to do with their salvation. They are mixing works with grace. This is a very important teaching to be straight on. Most people from my experiences always rely on the
experience they have had other then the finished work of Christ on the cross. This pollutes the true gospel, leading people astray. </font>[/QUOTE]The reason that people are so intrested in speaking in tongues is because they are drawn by the Spirit of God. They don't understand the subject and are always trying to figure out what it means.

Some try to say that it isn't for us and then others try to say it is of the devil, just to justify and soothe their own conscious, for the lack of understanding. It's really sad!

The baptism of the Holy Ghost, with the evidence of speaking tongues, "is" part of our salvation. Acts 2, the question was asked, "what shall we do?" Peter said, "Repent, be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ and ye shall receive the
Holy Ghost." It was for the Jews first and their children and to all that the Lord our God shall call. He hasn't returned and He is still calling the sinner to repentence.

Acts 2:38 is not a "work." It is a commandment. It is the finished work on Calvary.

Repent, we all agree, being baptized in the name of Jesus Christ was commanded, and to receive the Holy Ghost.

BTW, most get the baptism of the Holy Ghost and the "gift of tongues" mixed up and think they are the same thing. They are not! The gift of tongues is not a requirement for salvation, as well as the other eight spiritual gifts.

MEE

 

Julie,
Though there are many opinions and beliefs, the majority of people that speak in tongues do not believe that this is a requirement for salvation.
Acts 19 gives a story of the people of Ephesus that were already SAVED but Paul Ask : Have you recieved the Holy Ghost since you believed (KJV)
On the Day of Pentecost those in the upper room were already saved.
This experienced happened after salvation in these 2 cases.
Paul was saved on the Road to DAmascus but Annanias was sent to pray for him for things
1. that he may be healed of his physical blindness
2. that he might recieve the Holy Ghost.
Some might say that the book of Acts does not mention that Paul Spoke in Tongues but in I Corinthians he makes it clear that he spoke in tongues more than all the Corinthians and he was there when this happened in Ephesus.