Trump's New Humanitarian Streak--Foreign Aid at Businesses Expense

[Earth Wind and Fire]

At the present, solar is still a waste of money. It is very close to true viability, but it still has not reached that point. It will be there in 10 years. You must also calculate in the fact that currently solar is heavily subsidizing Chinese economy and harming the economy of USA and our strategic allies.
If solar is so wonderful, why is China exporting almost all its panels and burning coal to make their own energy???
Kind of like my HVAC guy who wanted to sell me the $9k unit and when asked what he had at his house it was the $4k unit.

The Chinese don’t care about people that’s why

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

I guess the traitors should have been more loyal to USA. I buy as much USA made as possible. I pay 2.5x for USA made bearings, gear boxes, reducers, etc. They are worth every penny. You get what you pay for and reliability is not cheap.

What automobile do you drive?

 

[Benjamin]

I guess the traitors should have been more loyal to USA. I buy as much USA made as possible. I pay 2.5x for USA made bearings, gear boxes, reducers, etc. They are worth every penny. You get what you pay for and reliability is not cheap.

Yup, "Buy American and Hire American" ,,,even if you have to tax China's unfairly flooding our market while using the intellectual property they stole from us and give some of the proceeds to hungry nations to do it!.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Yup, "Buy American and Hire American" ,,,even if you have to tax China's unfairly flooding our market while using the intellectual property they stole from us and give some of the proceeds to hungry nations to do it!.

The USA gave that up right after WW2. Flooded both the Japs and the Germans with tons of money and taught them Demmings quality principles so they could compete with us. So we go from Japanese manufacturing to Chinese then to Vietnam then next to Cambodian yada yada .... maybe will get back here when we are so economically irrelevant that we compete with the Pakistani.

 

[Benjamin]

The USA gave that up right after WW2. Flooded both the Japs and the Germans with tons of money and taught them Demmings quality principles so they could compete with us. So we go from Japanese manufacturing to Chinese then to Vietnam then next to Cambodian yada yada .... maybe will get back here when we are so economically irrelevant that we compete with the Pakistani.

That defines the plan of the Globalist Progressives, to make our economy irrelevant, but I don't believe we will be giving up the right to stay ahead any time soon with the guidance of this President.

 

[RighteousnessTemperance&]

At the present, solar is still a waste of money. It is very close to true viability, but it still has not reached that point. It will be there in 10 years. You must also calculate in the fact that currently solar is heavily subsidizing Chinese economy and harming the economy of USA and our strategic allies.
If solar is so wonderful, why is China exporting almost all its panels and burning coal to make their own energy???
Kind of like my HVAC guy who wanted to sell me the $9k unit and when asked what he had at his house it was the $4k unit.

Because solar is impractical in real world competition, and they are not such fools to miss that. They have been laughing all the way to the bank at our expense for far too long. Trump is the only one to have seriously challenged that.

The Chinese don’t care about people that’s why

That too, without exception.

 

[RighteousnessTemperance&]

The USA gave that up right after WW2. Flooded both the Japs and the Germans with tons of money and taught them Demmings quality principles so they could compete with us. So we go from Japanese manufacturing to Chinese then to Vietnam then next to Cambodian yada yada .... maybe will get back here when we are so economically irrelevant that we compete with the Pakistani.

Yes, in doing that we should at the very least be capitalizing on their success. Where's the ROI?

But we also hurt ourselves with unions and expanded nationalization (not to be confused with nationalism).

 

[Reynolds]

I presented a study supporting my position. You present no facts just your observations. BTW, do you want the U.S. to follow China or do you want for us to resume the lead in technology, the country that put a man on the moon?

We are ahead. We develop, they copy.

 

[Reynolds]

The Chinese don’t care about people that’s why

So you are admitting coal is cheaper?

 

[Reynolds]

What automobile do you drive?

Chevrolets, Fords.

 

[RighteousnessTemperance&]

No, just an honest mistake. Oil is a more interesting topic. The dominant use of oil is transportation (71%) versus 24% for industrial power and 6% for residential, commercial and electric power combined. The cost of switching to renewable sources or natural gas for transportation is of course burdened by the large infrastructure required to support it and the development and use of vehicles using other fuel types. But your question was only about the cost of solar energy production version energy production using oil. The broader issue is more relevant.

The cost of using oil for transportation includes the price of crude, the refining into gasoline and the physical delivery of gasoline to service stations.

The cost of solar includes the cost of solar collectors (the energy itself is free), the conversion into electricity, the storage of the electricity (batteries) and the transmission of electricity to service stations.

Solar collectors and batteries have become much cheaper and more efficient in the last 20 years. Oil prices go up and down depending on geopolitics. Now they're down but could easily go back up. I think you have to factor in the cost of wars we've waged in the MidEast to secure oil for our industrial machine. Added to that is the fact that just recently the U.S. became a net oil exporter due primarily to shale oil production.

Therefore, for both economic, environmental and strategic reasons I believe we should continue to transition off oil. But yes, the cost of just producing energy from solar is now cheaper than the cost of producing energy from oil. I think taking us out from under the thumb of the sheiks in the MidEast is a major advantage. Drilling offshore in the U.S. is costly and dangerous. Remember the oil spills in the Gulf and offshore in Alaska?

To keep all things equal, it's time that all solar products be produced and distributed solely via solar energy, with that stipulation to include any and all items used in that production and distribution as well. When they get to that point, then they will have bragging rights. Until then, they're cheating.

Unsubsidized, let's see how many solar- built and solar-powered ships from China make it over here with those cheap solar products in the next decade.

 

[RighteousnessTemperance&]

We are ahead. We develop, they copy.

And some of that copying is through espionage and other theft.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

So you are admitting coal is cheaper?

And very dirty

 

[Reynolds]

And very dirty

It can be dirty or clean. My favorite fishing lake has a massive coal power plant on it. The lake is clean. The fish are clean. The air is clean. You never see or smell any smoke. I love fishing the hot water off the plant outlets. Catch massive cats there in the winter time.

 

[MartyF]

Then why is he trying to start a war with Iran?

You’re confusing Trump with Obama.

 

[MartyF]

There ya go assuming again

But InThe Light said

Well, go right ahead and keep talking about how you oppose zero tariffs--something no one in this thread has supported or mentioned.

Are you saying he was wrong?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

But InThe Light said



Are you saying he was wrong?

ITL doesn’t speak for me.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

It can be dirty or clean. My favorite fishing lake has a massive coal power plant on it. The lake is clean. The fish are clean. The air is clean. You never see or smell any smoke. I love fishing the hot water off the plant outlets. Catch massive cats there in the winter time.

The town I grew up with in eastern Pa was full of underground coal mines, lots of coal dust, lots of above ground smoldering ash piles, lots of asthma, lots of black lung. When you went outside there was Ashes on the ground, the air quality was bad and still is. The river beds were coated with residue from dumping and fish were no longer evident. Then there was miners cough, very pronounced in the mornings before the miners went to work.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

That defines the plan of the Globalist Progressives, to make our economy irrelevant, but I don't believe we will be giving up the right to stay ahead any time soon with the guidance of this President.

Would that that were so. I worked for a guy in NY who built safety equipment and for years in NY... Brooklyn to be exact. He paid dearly for that decision as all his competitors ate his lunch by building off shore. Ole man Bush visits him personally and introduced him to this NAFTA plan.... so he shifts much of his manufacturing to Mexico. His hallway was adorned with pictures of him on a donkey with a sumbrao and poncho and smiling Mexicans all around him. But wait, all his competition moves to China and is still eating his lunch (now a rice & bean taco). So if he is now making something in Mexico for $10.00 the Chinese are making it for $1.00. Hard to compete. But my boss doesn’t like the Chinese, he comments that they are not honorable people so he travels to Vietnam and comments that business is booming... only the unions would never permit him to buy & sell Vietnam’s goods. So what can he do, why he shifts to China ( like all his competitors did).

So we advance to 2019 and what’s this POTUS do by getting in a trade war? Trump now forces this guy to begin moving to Vietnam, Cambodia, maybe Mexico once again.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

We are ahead. We develop, they copy.

Have you studied Demmings?