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Featured Two Prophecies in One

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by John of Japan, Jan 14, 2019.

  1. Covenanter

    Covenanter Well-Known Member
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    I believe those glorious prophecies, which should be read as a whole. Clear instruction & prophecy is given in figurative language. Figurative language so easy to understand that you call it some of it "literal" presumably to make a point about David's throne.

    In context (!) the "Immanuel" prophecy was to Ahaz, & presumably concerned his virgin bride who would soon conceive in the normal way. The Messianic significance is of course clear as we consider the prophecy as a whole, which runs from 7:1 to 9:7. The Messianic prophecy to Ahaz is completed by 9:6-7 - Immanuel is born to us.

    Is quoting & agreeing with your own post being insulting?
    It may be of interest that the Shunammite wanted a throne (H3678) (translated "stool") prepared for Elijah. 2 Kings 4:10.
    ---------------------------------------------------
    You want an answer to your OP -
    The passage, in its context is a real, understandable prophecy given partly in figurative language concerning real, literal events.

    When Isaiah uses metaphors like -
    8:5 The Lord spoke to me again:
    6 ‘Because this people has rejected
    the gently flowing waters of Shiloah
    and rejoices over Rezin
    and the son of Remaliah,
    7 therefore the Lord is about to bring against them
    the mighty floodwaters of the Euphrates –​
    the meaning is clear - & explained as the prophecy continues.

    When Isaiah writes of the glorious titles being given to Messiah, he includes the Kingship - the promised throne of David, aka the throne of the LORD. I consider that by insisting on a literal, physical fulfilment of "throne of David" you are missing the force of the prophecy & its glorious fulfilment in the resurrection, ascension & reign of our LORD Jesus Christ as recorded in the New Covenant Scriptures.
     
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  2. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    Excellent.
     
  3. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    just in the past couple of days:

    https://www.baptistboard.com/threads/two-prophecies-in-one.111068/page-2#post-2474256

    https://www.baptistboard.com/threads/how-did-you-discover-the-bible-teaches-a-pre-trib-rapture.111080/#post-2474064

    https://www.baptistboard.com/threads/two-prophecies-in-one.111068/page-4#post-2474707
     
    #83 kyredneck, Jan 19, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2019
  4. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    Check the new testament.

    Mathew gives the genealogy of Joseph which was through Solomon. Luke gives the genealogy of Mary through Nathan. I thought you would have known that.
    • Luke 3:31 Which was the son of Melea, which was the son of Menan, which was the son of Mattatha, which was the son of Nathan, which was the son of David,
     
    #84 David Kent, Jan 19, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2019
  5. Covenanter

    Covenanter Well-Known Member
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    Off topic, but I didn't start the thought -

    How does that resolve the problem of the lines converging & diverging & converging again? Matthew gives the kingly line David to Zerubbabel, while Luke gives a completely different line via Nathan.

    Matthew -
    11 and Josiah the father of Jeconiah and his brothers at the time of the exile to Babylon.
    12 After the exile to Babylon:
    Jeconiah was the father of Shealtiel,
    Shealtiel the father of Zerubbabel,
    13 Zerubbabel the father of Abihud,
    Abihud the father of Eliakim,

    Josiah - Jeconiah - Shealtiel - Zerubbabel - Abihud - ...... -Jacob - Joseph
    Luke -
    the son of Josek, the son of Joda,
    27 the son of Joanan, the son of Rhesa,
    the son of Zerubbabel, the son of Shealtiel,
    the son of Neri, 28 the son of Melki,

    Melki - Neri - Shealtiel - Zerubbabel - Rhesa - ...... - Heli - Joseph
     
  6. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    C, you're an Englishman think of the House of Stuart (Jacobite) and the House of Hannover. In this case, Joseph is the Stuart and Mary the Hannover. In Jesus, the Jacobite is made happy, but the Devine decree removing the crown from the Solomonic is also satisfied.
     
  7. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Oops, sorry. I thought you were talking about Nathan the prophet who rebuked David. My bad, as the young people say.
     
  8. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    JoJ, all I can say is tum, te, tum, tum.
     
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  9. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    Interesting.

    But how did the father of Zerubbabel have two different fathers?
     
    #89 David Kent, Jan 21, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2019
  10. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    The Judgement Seat of Christ A.K.A .The Great White Throne.
     
  11. Covenanter

    Covenanter Well-Known Member
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    I think the basic difference down to Jeconiah is that Matthew is recording the "official" line of kings - as UK would from William 1 to Elizabeth 2, regardless of the actual blood line, whereas Luke is recording the actual blood line.

    Note that Jeconiah was declared childless - Jer. 22:30
    This is what the Lord says:
    ‘Record this man as if childless,
    a man who will not prosper in his lifetime,
    for none of his offspring will prosper,
    none will sit on the throne of David
    or rule any more in Judah.’​

    Thus the continuation was through another Davidic line - through Nathan.
     
  12. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    How do you conflate these completely different terms, referred to in completely different contexts in the Bible? Paul speaks of the judgment seat of Christ to Christians in his epistles. We will never be judged for sin, since "there is therefore now no condemnation to them that are in Christ Jesus."

    However, John speaks of a judgment in Rev. 20 after which those judged will be thrown into the lake of fire. That's not believers.
     
  13. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    ???

    10 For we must all be made manifest before the judgment-seat of Christ; that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 2 Cor 5
     
    #93 kyredneck, Jan 21, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2019
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  14. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    That's what I tried to say.
     
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