Understanding the 1000yr Reign?

[skypair]

That just is not true, a terrestrial body is a fleshly body.

The key word that distinguishes one body from the other, IMO, is "glory." And there is no glory to the natural body. Furthermore, to get the "spiritual body" takes a "resurrection," which resurrection we have in Christ and demonstrate through baptism. Thence we have the "glory" that Jesus promised to give to us in John 17:22. And no wonder --- if the Spirit of God shone above the mercy seat when He dwelt in tabernacles, how much more will be shine within us and shine forth from out of us when He dwells in us!

One that both saints and sinners have. If you have a spiritual body, then why do you have to die. Does the Spirit die????

In order to receive my "celestial glory." "Celestial glory" is a physical body that has been glorified/perfected.

I appreciate your looking up "terrestrial" for me but, as you can see, that is only part of the definition.

Meanwhile, back to what you were BEGGING for -- and scripture that showed Christ on an earthly throne. I gave you 2 but apparently you don't like looking them up (still don't have Instaverse, eh, BBob?).

Jer 23:5-6 -- "Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth. 6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he shall be called, THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS."

But even better, Zech 14:9, 16 -- "And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one."

16 "And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts."

Is Messiah not LORD? When did the LORD reign on earth saving Judah and giving safety to Israel post-Jeremiah whilest being called THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS?" When did ANY of this coincide with Zech 14:10-15??

[offensive remark removed]
skypair

 

[Brother Bob]

Jer 23:

39: Therefore, behold, I, even I, will utterly forget you, and I will forsake you, and the city that I gave you and your fathers, and cast you out of my presence:
40: And I will bring an everlasting reproach upon you, and a perpetual shame, which shall not be forgotten.

You can not just pick what you want in Jer and let the rest go. You say if the lord promises it, then it shall be literally. These are those who turned away from the Lord.

BBob,

 

[skypair]

Might as well add Micah 4 to that list to be 'explained away'.

You're right! I was looking through Micah 4 but missed this crystal clear proof: "and the LORD shall reign over them in mount Zion from henceforth, even for ever. (4:6)

The context makes spiritualizing the passage impossible! Thanks!

skypair

 

[skypair]

Jer 23:39: Therefore, behold, I, even I, will utterly forget you, and I will forsake you, and the city that I gave you and your fathers, and cast you out of my presence:
40: And I will bring an everlasting reproach upon you, and a perpetual shame, which shall not be forgotten.

You can not just pick what you want in Jer and let the rest go. You say if the lord promises it, then it shall be literally. These are those who turned away from the Lord.

BBob, you're fishiing" from the end of the passage which, quite likely, is a whole other prophecy.

Look at 23:9 --- do you see that little backwards "P?" That means that right there the thought and thrust of the prophecy changes. Stop playing games" and get serious!

skypair

 

[Brother Bob]

The key word that distinguishes one body from the other, IMO, is "glory." And there is no glory to the natural body. Furthermore, to get the "spiritual body" takes a "resurrection," which resurrection we have in Christ and demonstrate through baptism. Thence we have the "glory" that Jesus promised to give to us in John 17:22. And no wonder --- if the Spirit of God shone above the mercy seat when He dwelt in tabernacles, how much more will be shine within us and shine forth from out of us when He dwells in us!

In order to receive my "celestial glory." "Celestial glory" is a physical body that has been glorified/perfected.

I appreciate your looking up "terrestrial" for me but, as you can see, that is only part of the definition.

1Cr 15:44It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

Meanwhile, back to what you were BEGGING for -- and scripture that showed Christ on an earthly throne. I gave you 2 but apparently you don't like looking them up (still don't have Instaverse, eh, BBob?).

Jer 23:5-6 -- "Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth. 6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he shall be called, THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS."

But even better, Zech 14:9, 16 -- "And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one."

16 "And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts."

Mat 2:1¶Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,

Mat 2:2Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

These were Jews that came to worship a King!


Is Messiah not LORD? When did the LORD reign on earth saving Judah and giving safety to Israel post-Jeremiah whilest being called THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS?" When did ANY of this coincide with Zech 14:10-15??

Mat 2:2Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

[removed]

skypair

You are a hostile man Skypair! IMO

 

[skypair]

The point is that some of the context of Zech is put forth as yet to come and low and behold, if you keep reading it plainly shows it is being fulfilled in the OT.

Then it shouldn't be hard at all to show us Zech 14:6-16 happened, right?

skypair

 

[Brother Bob]

BBob, you're fishiing" from the end of the passage which, quite likely, is a whole other prophecy.

Yea, I understand. Throw out what don't fit your theology.

Look at 23:9 --- do you see that little backwards "P?" That means that right there the thought and thrust of the prophecy changes. Stop playing games" and get serious!


skypair

No games, just showing how you cherry pick to fit your doctrine.

BBob,

 

[Brother Bob]

Then it shouldn't be hard at all to show us Zech 14:6-16 happened, right?

skypair

Zech 14

6: And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:
7: But it shall be one day which shall be known to the LORD, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.
8: And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.
9: And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one.
10: All the land shall be turned as a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem: and it shall be lifted up, and inhabited in her place, from Benjamin's gate unto the place of the first gate, unto the corner gate, and from the tower of Hananeel unto the king's winepresses.
11: And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited.
12: And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.
13: And it shall come to pass in that day, that a great tumult from the LORD shall be among them; and they shall lay hold every one on the hand of his neighbour, and his hand shall rise up against the hand of his neighbour.
14: And Judah also shall fight at Jerusalem; and the wealth of all the heathen round about shall be gathered together, gold, and silver, and apparel, in great abundance.
15: And so shall be the plague of the horse, of the mule, of the camel, and of the ass, and of all the beasts that shall be in these tents, as this plague.
16: And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

This is the last days of the Old Covenant, when Jesus was to be born King of the Jews.

Mark 15
33: And when the sixth hour was come, there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour.
34: And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?
35: And some of them that stood by, when they heard it, said, Behold, he calleth Elias.
36: And one ran and filled a spunge full of vinegar, and put it on a reed, and gave him to drink, saying, Let alone; let us see whether Elias will come to take him down.
37: And Jesus cried with a loud voice, and gave up the ghost.
38: And the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom.

That fountain has been opened. You don't believe in the Living Waters.

Jhn 4:10Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.




BBob,

 

[skypair]

These were Jews that came to worship a King!

What "King," Bob?? When?? Why do you keep trying to avoid the obvious??

You are a hostile man Skypair! IMO

That is my "terrestrial glory" shining through, Bob. God is calling you out -- to worship Him in spirit and in truth. He does not want you in the hands of Satan like Hymenaeus.

BTW, I understand where your injunction that Christ will not be found "here or there." There will be manifestations of a false Christ (AC/Pope) during the tribulation (which you say is either behind or ahead of us). This does NOT exclude that Jesus said He was coming back one day to be seen of all the earth.

skypair

 

[Brother Bob]

You're right! I was looking through Micah 4 but missed this crystal clear proof: "and the LORD shall reign over them in mount Zion from henceforth, even for ever. (4:6)

The context makes spiritualizing the passage impossible! Thanks!

skypair

And that He is doing.

BBob,

 

[Brother Bob]

What "King," Bob?? When?? Why do you keep trying to avoid the obvious??

What are you doing quoting scripture when you never heard of "King Jesus"???

That is my "terrestrial glory" shining through, Bob. God is calling you out -- to worship Him in spirit and in truth. He does not want you in the hands of Satan like Hymenaeus.

I do not deny that we have a terrestrial glory, but it will come to an end, when we die.

There is a glory in Heaven that is reserved for us that is not to be compared with the glory we have now.

1Cr 15:43It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

BTW, I understand where your injunction that Christ will not be found "here or there." There will be manifestations of a false Christ (AC/Pope) during the tribulation (which you say is either behind or ahead of us). This does NOT exclude that Jesus said He was coming back one day to be seen of all the earth.

skypair

Yes, ever eye shall behold Him, at the second coming.

Rev 1:7Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they [also] which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen

BBob,

 

[skypair]

Zech 14

6: And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:
7: But it shall be one day which shall be known to the LORD, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.
8: And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.
9: And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one.
10: All the land shall be turned as a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem: and it shall be lifted up, and inhabited in her place, from Benjamin's gate unto the place of the first gate, unto the corner gate, and from the tower of Hananeel unto the king's winepresses.
11: And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited.
12: And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.
13: And it shall come to pass in that day, that a great tumult from the LORD shall be among them; and they shall lay hold every one on the hand of his neighbour, and his hand shall rise up against the hand of his neighbour.
14: And Judah also shall fight at Jerusalem; and the wealth of all the heathen round about shall be gathered together, gold, and silver, and apparel, in great abundance.
15: And so shall be the plague of the horse, of the mule, of the camel, and of the ass, and of all the beasts that shall be in these tents, as this plague.
16: And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

This is the last days of the Old Covenant, when Jesus was to be born King of the Jews.

Well, not actually "born" cause that was in Bethlehem, right?

So here's what happened the day of the crucifixion (?) then according to Zech 14:6-16 and YOU: 1) Living waters went forth out of Jerusalem to the 2 seas. Why is this not Ezek 47:1-12 -- literal rivers in the yet coming literal kingdom where the glory of the LORD enters as He left (43:1-7) into the "place of His throne" where He promises to "dwell forever" (as He does in Micah 4:6).

2) The LORD was king over all the earth. Why would this be a prophecy if He is already, in your mind, king over all the earth??

3) The mountains of northern Israel are flattened. Huh?

4) 14:14 -- Israel gathered the wealth of the heathen round about?? Neither at the cross not in 70 AD did this happen! Have you read this somewhere?

5) And then all the nations come to Jerusalem to worship Christ?? Baloney! When the nations came, it was to PERSECUTE Jews and Christians (most Christians got out of Jerusalem only because they were warned by Luke but Peter and Paul make clear that the Christians in Jerusalem were under persecution just like those in Thessalonica!).

There is no comparison with Mark 15, BBob. On the face of it, you know that comparison is untrue.

skypair

 

[skypair]

BBob,

I do not deny that we have a terrestrial glory, but it will come to an end, when we die.

There is a glory in Heaven that is reserved for us that is not to be compared with the glory we have now.

Absolutely!! (I finally got you to admit something!! :applause: )

skypair

 

[Brother Bob]

Well, not actually "born" cause that was in Bethlehem, right?

So here's what happened the day of the crucifixion (?) then according to Zech 14:6-16 and YOU: 1) Living waters went forth out of Jerusalem to the 2 seas. Why is this not Ezek 47:1-12 -- literal rivers in the yet coming literal kingdom where the glory of the LORD enters as He left (43:1-7) into the "place of His throne" where He promises to "dwell forever" (as He does in Micah 4:6).

You have it close, except it is Spiritual waters. You didn't read anything where the Lord was carrying the living waters, that He would of given to the woman did you?

2) The LORD was king over all the earth. Why would this be a prophecy if He is already, in your mind, king over all the earth??

He will send His angels to the four corners of the Earth to gather in His children.

I could get the scripture, but I think you know it.

3) The mountains of northern Israel are flattened. Huh?

There were great earth quakes and they are still digging out parts of Jerusalem.

4) 14:14 -- Israel gathered the wealth of the heathen round about?? Neither at the cross not in 70 AD did this happen! Have you read this somewhere?

I think I read somewhere that Israel was given back all the wealth from the temple so they could restore it. Not sure what this means, except Israel did receive a Messiah, of which all but a remnant rejected. I believe we are rich, if we have Christ, don't know about you.

5) And then all the nations come to Jerusalem to worship Christ?? Baloney! When the nations came, it was to PERSECUTE Jews and Christians (most Christians got out of Jerusalem only because they were warned by Luke but Peter and Paul make clear that the Christians in Jerusalem were under persecution just like those in Thessalonica!).

I thought He said that they would come from all nations to where He had scattered them.

We also are under persecution today. As a matter of fact, we are in a war. I believe it speaks something about that also in Zech;.

There is no comparison with Mark 15, BBob. On the face of it, you know that comparison is untrue.

skypair

I think there is and especially believe that the "living waters" are flowing today.

BBob,

 

[EdSutton]

Mat 2:2Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

These were Jews that came to worship a King!

The "wise men" (or 'Magoi') were definitely not Jews.

In all likelihood they were Persian or Babylonian (Chaldee) astrologers and/or sorcerers, who were practitioners of witchcraft, "familiar spirits", magicians, etc., as the Greek (imported) word "Magoi" is applied to that group, elsewhere. The word is also used in reference to false prophets, as well. This practice of "witchcraft" was specifically prohibited to the Israel, and even the Witch at Endor expected to die at the hand of Saul, when she was found out. (Ex. 22:18; Dt. 16:10; I Sam. 28:9)

Incidentally, our word 'magician' comes from "magus", the singular form of 'magoi' .

Ed

 

[skypair]

BBob,

"Satan has desired to have you, that he may sift you like wheat: But I have prayed for thee; that thy faith fail not..."

You have it close, except it is Spiritual waters. You didn't read anything where the Lord was carrying the living waters, that He would of given to the woman did you?

No, sir. You are dodging the truth. Zech 14:8 = Ezek 47:3-5. You have absolutely NO license to allegorize this verse!

He will send His angels to the four corners of the Earth to gather in His children.

I could get the scripture, but I think you know it.

Again, you're avoiding the wording of the verse. The LORD (remember, it is all caps for a reason) is King over the earth. There is nothing here about Mt 24:31 and that is certainly NOT part of the scene of the crucifixion!

There were great earth quakes and they are still digging out parts of Jerusalem.

Even if your claim wasn't "pulled out of thin air," 14:10 says nothing of that. It speaks of Jerusalem "lifted up" and "inhabited" -- not buried and uninhabited.

4) 14:14 -- Israel gathered the wealth of the heathen round about?? Neither at the cross nor in 70 AD did this happen! Have you read this somewhere?

I think I read somewhere that Israel was given back all the wealth from the temple so they could restore it. Not sure what this means, except Israel did receive a Messiah, of which all but a remnant rejected. I believe we are rich, if we have Christ, don't know about you.

No, sir! In fact the evidence is that the Romans accidentally melted the all the gold in the temple which was why there was "no stone left upon another" just as Jesus said. And will you stop with the spiritualizing already!! We're rich but not in "gold, and silver, and apparel!"

And I missed one! Where did their eyes consume away in their sockets and their flesh conmsume away while they stood at the cross?? or even in 70 AD?

You do realize, of course, that now you have made the cross event stretch out to 70 AD, right? Again, where is your license for that?

I thought He said that they would come from all nations to where He had scattered them.

Well, see --- you weren't studying the scriptures. You were going on intuition, not what actual scripture says. There is a place where it says they are gathered back but it is OBVIOUSLY NOT between 30-70 AD!!

We also are under persecution today. As a matter of fact, we are in a war. I believe it speaks something about that also in Zech;.

Zechariah is a VERY CURRENT book to be reading!! Zech 10:8-12 couldn't describe any period but the present! You should read it and meditate on it as you lie down to sleep tonight. Zech 11:1-3 is "at the door!" Israel has just announced that Iran will have a nuke in a few months. Someone is going to do something about this and it will ignite, IMO, Zech 11:1-3 --- Iran's puppets (Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, and the Palestinains) going to war against Israel!! Read the rest of Zech 11. It is compelling in it's description of the coming of AC -- of his covenant and his breeching of it -- of his "mortal head wound!!"

Zech 12 revisits the situation telling us about the "cup of trembling" years of revived Israel's early history -- the "burdensome stone" of its middle years -- and "that day" when they will be like a "fire among the wood .. a torch in the sheaf" to Syria, Lebanon, Jordan "devouring those round about!"

When Elijah and Moses (the 2 witnesses in Rev 11) come to "restore all things," I believe the kingdom of David will include all the lands that David once ruled. And it will be in the wake of this near-term war. And "stamped" by AC's 7 year covenant!! You, like Peter was symbolically in John 18:15-27, are right in the path of AC's "steam roller!" He's gonna "have you for lunch" as I said earlier quoting Jesus! And I really do pray you will repent on this. Stop playing "ignore the scripture" long enough to listen to the Spirit, BBob!

skypair

 

[Brother Bob]

The "wise men" (or 'Magoi') were definitely not Jews.

In all likelihood they were Persian or Babylonian (Chaldee) astrologers and/or sorcerers, who were practitioners of witchcraft, "familiar spirits", magicians, etc., as the Greek (imported) word "Magoi" is applied to that group, elsewhere. The word is also used in reference to false prophets, as well. This practice of "witchcraft" was specifically prohibited to the Israel, and even the Witch at Endor expected to die at the hand of Saul, when she was found out. (Ex. 22:18; Dt. 16:10; I Sam. 28:9)

Incidentally, our word 'magician' comes from "magus", the singular form of 'magoi' .

Ed

I can't argue with you whether they were Jews, representing the tribes of the Jews or exactly who they were. So, I will not argue the point, except to say for some reason, they knew that Jesus was a King.

BBob,

 

[Brother Bob]

BBob,

"Satan has desired to have you, that he may sift you like wheat: But I have prayed for thee; that thy faith fail not..."

No, sir. You are dodging the truth. Zech 14:8 = Ezek 47:3-5. You have absolutely NO license to allegorize this verse!

Again, you're avoiding the wording of the verse. The LORD (remember, it is all caps for a reason) is King over the earth. There is nothing here about Mt 24:31 and that is certainly NOT part of the scene of the crucifixion!

Even if your claim wasn't "pulled out of thin air," 14:10 says nothing of that. It speaks of Jerusalem "lifted up" and "inhabited" -- not buried and uninhabited.

No, sir! In fact the evidence is that the Romans accidentally melted the all the gold in the temple which was why there was "no stone left upon another" just as Jesus said. And will you stop with the spiritualizing already!! We're rich but not in "gold, and silver, and apparel!"

And I missed one! Where did their eyes consume away in their sockets and their flesh conmsume away while they stood at the cross?? or even in 70 AD?

You do realize, of course, that now you have made the cross event stretch out to 70 AD, right? Again, where is your license for that?

Well, see --- you weren't studying the scriptures. You were going on intuition, not what actual scripture says. There is a place where it says they are gathered back but it is OBVIOUSLY NOT between 30-70 AD!!

Zechariah is a VERY CURRENT book to be reading!! Zech 10:8-12 couldn't describe any period but the present! You should read it and meditate on it as you lie down to sleep tonight. Zech 11:1-3 is "at the door!" Israel has just announced that Iran will have a nuke in a few months. Someone is going to do something about this and it will ignite, IMO, Zech 11:1-3 --- Iran's puppets (Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, and the Palestinains) going to war against Israel!! Read the rest of Zech 11. It is compelling in it's description of the coming of AC -- of his covenant and his breeching of it -- of his "mortal head wound!!"

Zech 12 revisits the situation telling us about the "cup of trembling" years of revived Israel's early history -- the "burdensome stone" of its middle years -- and "that day" when they will be like a "fire among the wood .. a torch in the sheaf" to Syria, Lebanon, Jordan "devouring those round about!"

When Elijah and Moses (the 2 witnesses in Rev 11) come to "restore all things," I believe the kingdom of David will include all the lands that David once ruled. And it will be in the wake of this near-term war. And "stamped" by AC's 7 year covenant!! You, like Peter was symbolically in John 18:15-27, are right in the path of AC's "steam roller!" He's gonna "have you for lunch" as I said earlier quoting Jesus! And I really do pray you will repent on this. Stop playing "ignore the scripture" long enough to listen to the Spirit, BBob!

skypair

Satan desires you also.

I haven't stretched anything, you have thought and still stretching. You are a futurist and I am not. As those in olden times, they were looking for all this in their time, so let them be. It is not for your time.

Zech 14



1: Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.
2: For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
3: Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.
4: And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
5: And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.
6: And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:
7: But it shall be one day which shall be known to the LORD, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.
8: And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.


You got a big problem, the living water is already here. You are living in the past, their last days, were the end of the OT.

Jhn 4:11The woman saith unto him, Sir, thou hast nothing to draw with, and the well is deep: from whence then hast thou that living water?

Jhn 7:37¶In the last day, that great [day] of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

Jhn 7:38He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

BBob,






BBob,

 

[EdSutton]

I can't argue with you whether they were Jews, representing the tribes of the Jews or exactly who they were. So, I will not argue the point, except to say for some reason, they knew that Jesus was a King.

BBob,

If that is all true, why did you say this?

These were Jews that came to worship a King! (my emphases)

It sure seems you were saying the Magoi were Jews, to me.

The Magoi understood that one had been born that was to be King of the Jews from His birth, no less, from their studies, and somehow, from the Star. There is no record that any Jews at that time, recognized this, and only after Herod's inquiry, did the Jerusalem crowd study to find out even where "the Christ" would be born.

Even the star 'reappeared' to guide the Magoi. Apparently no one else saw the singificance of that star, not even Herod, who was already on a rampage to kill this perceived threat to him. Herod had been appointed as "King of the Jews" under Roman edict; the Magoi announced that one was born to that title, although there is no record that they even knew the name of Jesus, until probably after they saw Him.

Apparently, the star had appeared some two years prior, when the Magoi were still in their own country, in the East. Read the text in Matt. 2, and elsewhere, and see what it is actually saying. I suggest reading it in the NKJV, HCSB, NASB, and/or ESV, here, as well. For the cross referenced verses listed, I would personally recommend the ESV, here in Matt. 2, as a good study guide.

Matt. 2:1 says "Jesus had been born". The typical nativity scenes we see each Christmas, are Biblically incorrect, for the Magi did not come to a stable, but a house, and this could have been as late as two years after the birth of Jesus, if the star first appeared at the time of His birth.

Jesus must have been born around 5 or 6 BC, with the fall of 6 BC seeming the most likely date. This also makes sense, considering Joseph was afraid of Archelaus, yet took the family to Jerusalem when Jesus was 12, as recorded in Luke 2:42. Archelaus was deposed by Augustus, and banished to Gaul in 6 AD.

Ed

 

[Brother Bob]

If that is all true, why did you say this?It sure seems you were saying the Magoi were Jews, to me.

The Magoi understood that one had been born that was to be King of the Jews from His birth, no less, from their studies, and somehow, from the Star. There is no record that any Jews at that time, recognized this, and only after Herod's inquiry, did the Jerusalem crowd study to find out even where "the Christ" would be born.

Even the star 'reappeared' to guide the Magoi. Apparently no one else saw the singificance of that star, not even Herod, who was already on a rampage to kill this perceived threat to him. Herod had been appointed as "King of the Jews" under Roman edict; the Magoi announced that one was born to that title, although there is no record that they even knew the name of Jesus, until probably after they saw Him.

Apparently, the star had appeared some two years prior, when the Magoi were still in their own country, in the East. Read the text in Matt. 2, and elsewhere, and see what it is actually saying. I suggest reading it in the NKJV, HCSB, NASB, and/or ESV, here, as well. For the cross referenced verses listed, I would personally recommend the ESV, here in Matt. 2, as a good study guide.

Matt. 2:1 says "Jesus had been born". The typical nativity scenes we see each Christmas, are Biblically incorrect, for the Magi did not come to a stable, but a house, and this could have been as late as two years after the birth of Jesus, if the star first appeared at the time of His birth.

Jesus must have been born around 5 or 6 BC, with the fall of 6 BC seeming the most likely date. This also makes sense, considering Joseph was afraid of Archelaus, yet took the family to Jerusalem when Jesus was 12, as recorded in Luke 2:42. Archelaus was deposed by Augustus, and banished to Gaul in 6 AD.

Ed

Because I made a mistake. every make one?? They were supposed as representives of 3 tribes of Israel, but I do not even know if that was true. One thing for sure, Jesus was to be born King of the Jews, and these wise men, had a great interest in seeing Him.

They were said to be kings, and three in number; they were said to be representatives of the three families of Shem, Ham, and Japhet, and therefore one of them is pictured as an Ethiopian; their names are given as Caspar, Balthasar, and Melchior, and their three skulls--said to have been discovered in the twelfth century by Bishop Reinald of Cologne --are exhibited in a priceless casket in the great cathedral of that city."

I just don't know who "they" are.......

BBob,

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